Strong Contender

Originally Posted by Sweetness

Without knowing for sure, I think they did. It's that Derby fever.

Had to be the owners in my opinion but the Pletcher ass kissing on this site is ridiculous. Win a Classic race before we start making him out to be Lukas or Baffert.

Originally Posted by Hoisttheflag

Had to be the owners in my opinion but the Pletcher ass kissing on this site is ridiculous. Win a Classic race before we start making him out to be Lukas or Baffert.

With all due respect, he has run second twice, and the run he has been on in the last 5 years or so has been nothing short of remarkable. Pletcher's only been training for about 10 years, and I challenge you to find someone with a more influential 10 years. Look how long it took Bobby Frankel, or Neil Drysdale to get a classic win. Pletcher will get his, no doubt, but you can't say the man isn't an incredible trainer because he hasn't won a classic.

Originally Posted by Sweetness

With all due respect, he has run second twice, and the run he has been on in the last 5 years or so has been nothing short of remarkable. Pletcher's only been training for about 10 years, and I challenge you to find someone with a more influential 10 years. Look how long it took Bobby Frankel, or Neil Drysdale to get a classic win. Pletcher will get his, no doubt, but you can't say the man isn't an incredible trainer because he hasn't won a classic.

Pletcher has been in the business since he was a young guy. His dad is JJ Pletcher. Baffert and Lukas worked their way up. Pletcher is actually one of the Lukas guys but you already knew that.

[Danzig]

lukas worked his way up, baffert had a hand after starting as a QH trainer and pegram deciding to move into t'breds.
not sure why hoist seems so anti-pletcher, he learned from one of the best and has paid his dues as well. any successes he deserves, he's got a tremendous work ethic.
he doesn't have a classic win YET, but it will come.

Originally Posted by Danzig188

lukas worked his way up, baffert had a hand after starting as a QH trainer and pegram deciding to move into t'breds.
not sure why hoist seems so anti-pletcher, he learned from one of the best and has paid his dues as well. any successes he deserves, he's got a tremendous work ethic.
he doesn't have a classic win YET, but it will come.

Baffert was a jockey, you don't pay your dues better than that. I am not anti-pletcher, but you guys are like professional ass kissers. There are entire threads to how great he is because he won with a bunch of horses, one being 1-9. The guy continues to fail to win the big ones. 0 for 51 is not some coincidence. Calling him the modern day silver fox is nonsense.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Hoisttheflag

Baffert was a jockey, you don't pay your dues better than that. I am not anti-pletcher, but you guys are like professional ass kissers. There are entire threads to how great he is because he won with a bunch of horses, one being 1-9. The guy continues to fail to win the big ones. 0 for 51 is not some coincidence. Calling him the modern day silver fox is nonsense.

well, i'm not one who has ever come on here gushing over the guy, i just take exception to your opinion that only a classic win makes a top trainer. you'd get that from me regardless of trainer mentioned. boy, you like to paint a wide group with your brush, don't you?

Originally Posted by Danzig188

well, i'm not one who has ever come on here gushing over the guy, i just take exception to your opinion that only a classic win makes a top trainer. you'd get that from me regardless of trainer mentioned. boy, you like to paint a wide group with your brush, don't you?

They are all really good trainers, including Pletcher, but Baffert and Lukas never went 0-51 in the most important races of the year. They dominated those races. Their percentages are incredible. Pletcher is excellent but he has excellent horse flesh. I think Frankel is excellent too but until he won with Empire Maker and then the BC Classic it was hard to put him in there with Baffert and Lukas. Pletcher might get there but he isn't the modern day silver fox.

Originally Posted by Hoisttheflag

Pletcher has been in the business since he was a young guy. His dad is JJ Pletcher. Baffert and Lukas worked their way up. Pletcher is actually one of the Lukas guys but you already knew that.

Yeah I knew that, but thanks teach for the lesson. He has been out on his own for 10 years. But while we are at it, any coincidence that during Lukas golden run, he had Pletcher, McLaughlin, Stewart, and so on and so on as his assistants. These guys are among the best now, so that must be noted.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Sweetness

Yeah I knew that, but thanks teach for the lesson. He has been out on his own for 10 years. But while we are at it, any coincidence that during Lukas golden run, he had Pletcher, McLaughlin, Stewart, and so on and so on as his assistants. These guys are among the best now, so that must be noted.

Dallas Stewart is among the best now?

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Dallas Stewart is among the best now?

Won the Oaks this year, and is a damn good trainer. 18% on the year, not too shabby in my opinion.

[SentToStud]

Money won and Eclipse Awards count too, last time I looked.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Sweetness

Won the Oaks this year, and is a damn good trainer. 18% on the year, not too shabby in my opinion.

He's an OK trainer who has probably underachieved with the stock he has gotten. I'm not knocking him but saying he is " one of the best " is absurd.

Originally Posted by Sweetness

With all due respect, he has run second twice, and the run he has been on in the last 5 years or so has been nothing short of remarkable. Pletcher's only been training for about 10 years, and I challenge you to find someone with a more influential 10 years. Look how long it took Bobby Frankel, or Neil Drysdale to get a classic win. Pletcher will get his, no doubt, but you can't say the man isn't an incredible trainer because he hasn't won a classic.

With all duer respect ...

... the guy has trained nearly a thousand of the best-bred colts in the world ... and has yet to develop even one into a champion at classic distances.

He's the King Of The MSW Sprints ... and does very well with fillies ... but he hasn't developed a colt into a champion ... and ... until he does ... he doesn't deserve to be compared with any of the really good trainers.

I can't say he isn't an incredible trainer? Yes ... I can ...

... He isn't an incredible trainer.

Originally Posted by Bold Brooklynite

With all duer respect ...

... the guy has trained nearly a thousand of the best-bred colts in the world ... and has yet to develop even one into a champion at classic distances.

He's the King Of The MSW Sprints ... and does very well with fillies ... but he hasn't developed a colt into a champion ... and ... until he does ... he doesn't deserve to be compared with any of the really good trainers.

I can't say he isn't an incredible trainer? Yes ... I can ...

... He isn't an incredible trainer.

This coming from the guy who said Mayan King, a listed stake winner at best will be HOY.

Originally Posted by Sweetness

This coming from the guy who said Mayan King, a listed stake winner at best will be HOY.

I thought you were leaving ...

... BUH-BYE !!!

[Scav]

Mayan King was pretty bold of a pick for HOY.....I applaud your insaneness....

Originally Posted by Scav

Mayan King was pretty bold of a pick for HOY.....I applaud your insaneness....

Shhhh ... you're ruining my shtik ... I don't want anyone else to know.

Originally Posted by Bold Brooklynite

I thought you were leaving ...

... BUH-BYE !!!

Another intelligent answer, seems as though Todd got Left Bank to win grade 1's sprinting and going 2 turns. Pretty good stuff.

Originally Posted by Sweetness

Another intelligent answer, seems as though Todd got Left Bank to win grade 1's sprinting and going 2 turns. Pretty good stuff.

You're correct ... Left Bank was voted champion older male ... and he did win one G1 race at 9f around two turns in 24 starts.

Flower Alley also won one G1 race at 10f.

Pletcher also had a 2YO who won one G1 race around two turns.

That's it ... one 9f G1 ... one 10f G1 ... and one 2YO two-turn G1 out of several hundred well-bred colts over a ten-year period. Other trainers have done as much on a single weekend.

If that's "incredible" to you ... so be it. To me ... it isn't.

Originally Posted by Bold Brooklynite

I thought you were leaving ...

... BUH-BYE !!!

LOL! Brooklyn have you met he new resident whacko yet?
Guy knows all about what goes through bafferts mind, says shug underachived, says he knows me(but he cant telll who he is for security reasons), oh yeah and hes involved in the game. tell you what if this guy is involved in the game I'm an astronaut!!!