Capital OTB discontinues free PP's

[Linny]

Under copyright laws, Capital, (or any other agency distributing such data) would be forced not to eat the $1 cost abut the cost of 4 sets of PP's multiplied by the number of customers who get them. If 1000 patrons are getting the pp's and each track costs (hypothetically) $.50, then they are eating $2000 per day. Based on that number, Capital would need to be handling over $200k in bets generated by those pp's. Charging $1 for the information allows them to avoid a copyright lawsuit for distributing copyrighted material for free. Capital may buy it from Track-Data but that doesn't allow it's free distribution.

Honestly, I have never quite understood the concept of free info. If you are going to the track you buy a Form or or download pps (for a fee!) or buy a program when you get there. OTB's got in the habit of hanging pages of the Form on the walls back in the 70's, something NO RACETRACK I know of has ever done. When the Form threathened action, some OTB's stopped. The idea was that "limited" free info was OK for some but that most customers would be frustrated with sharing pages of a pulled apart Form with the rest of the place and would but their own.

From Mister B
"I recieved the same letter, I am not going to use their account any longer. They will feel the impact, but I think they are under the GUN from other agency's in a law dispute.

Anyway, I never really used them. I think I am going to activate my NYRA account when Belmont opens.
04-19-2007 10:09 PM "

You never used the pp's but even though you are NOT effected by the change, you wont use Capital any more. You will use NYRA. Will they send you free data daily for 4 of the most popular tracks? Would you leave them if they started charing $1 for such info?

Overall, I would not be surprised to see more issues like this in racing. It's a data driven game and companies that compile and store data are becoming more and more aware of it's widespread distribution. I liken it to the music industry. When I was a kid I copied a favorite song onto cassette tapes from the radio. No one really cared. With computers making file sharing easy music companies went berserk over free distribution of their product. The very liberal use and distribution of racing data has become a problem for the owners/compilers of the data and we will see more of these problems.

Rather than me angry about a free service being removed, be thankful that it was available free for a time.

When threatened with leagl action that could but the company out of business any company would do the same thing. They have to "make right" on the contractual agreement or come under penalty.

For the point of view of the owner of such data, maybe BTW or someone else associted w/ the Form may have more info.

[Hickory Hill Hoff]

I understand where you coming from and the position you're in. It is just a "buck" a day, but since the information was provided "free" of charge, I played five out of seven day week and even sometimes six. Before that, it was just the weekend and during the week if I saw something interesting. But, now I may cut back on wagering because it won't be there, plus summer is coming and got "other" things to do. Capital does do more than it's share for it's patrons, but I guess the "bottom line" does mean more. I still think, the more that is provided "free of charge" by the wagering outlets and racetracks...the more new people will be attracted to the sport. The "racscinos" tend to do that for their customers.

[Linny]

I agree that "casino based" gambling like racinos do far more for their patrons and that racing on the whole, not just a given OTB MUST find a way to do more for their patrons or risk becoming a minor sideshow to slot parlors.
Parking is free at casinos and costs at tracks. You can buy one one or two decent books on betting strategies and be set for essentially a lifetime of table games and slots. You don't need a $5 paper evertime you enter the casino.
The churn produced by slots pays for free drinks and food and pretty chadeliers while the relatively slow pace of racing means expensive eats and cement floors at tracks.
Remember too, that most OTB's across the country came into being as part of the racing industry, not the gaming industry. They measure themselves, traditionally against racetracks, not against casinos. Parking and admission at the track was $4 to $8 and free at OTB. Programs cost $1 + on track and were posted on the walls at OTB's. OTB's offered several tracks and on track patrons had only the live product. Many OTB's provided some published selections for free as well, which tracks didn't, except in the program that you paid for. (I realize tha many people complain about poor tellers etc at OTB's and I'm sure the same percentage applies at tracks. The problem is that OTB's usually only have 3 or so tellers so you might have no choice but to use one you dislike, at a track you have far more options.)
In the last decade with casinos and racinos everwhere, suddenly the OTB experience looks dreadful by comparison. Twenty years ago, only a small percentage of the population had ever been to a casino. You had to go to Vegas or Atlantic City and unless you were really into gaming or just out for a "lark" it was more of a special occasion to gamble. Now with "Indian" casinos every 100 miles it's hard to find someone who hasn't been to a casino. Lat's face it, OTB's AND racetracks (w/the glaring exception of a few) all look pretty raunchy by comparison.

[Travis Stone]

Originally Posted by Linny

Honestly, I have never quite understood the concept of free info.

Never underestimate the power of free. Some of the most powerful companies in the world are based upon the premise of free. Google and free search is one example, but a more close to home example is casinos. If you had to pay $1.00 to sit down at a slot machine, would you ever sit? Of course not.

In horse racing, the game changer is the information. The information is horded like its the Holy Grail. Equibase, who controls the information, only licenses it. Those who sell it are not allowed to give it away for free, to protect the information's value and protect their interests.

If the industry were to ever overcome this ridiculous hurdle, one can only imagine where it could take us.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

Never underestimate the power of free. Some of the most powerful companies in the world are based upon the premise of free. Google and free search is one example, but a more close to home example is casinos. If you had to pay $1.00 to sit down at a slot machine, would you ever sit? Of course not.
In horse racing, the game changer is the information. The information is horded like its the Holy Grail. Equibase, who controls the information, only licenses it. Those who sell it are not allowed to give it away for free, to protect the information's value and protect their interests.

If the industry were to ever overcome this ridiculous hurdle, one can only imagine where it could take us.

but would they pay $1 to find out which machine pays off the most, or the highest? probably.

i am not surprised, considering the economy right now, to see formerly free materials suddenly have a price tag attached.

[joeydb]

I concur that it is strange for them to suddenly start charging. I prefer DRF past performance files, and when I know I'm going to the track or OTB, I buy them and download the PDFs. The price isn't bad and I like the product.

They also do two free "Races of the Week" as many of you already know, and I have gotten in the habit of checking those out too. It has definitely caused me to play more as I can casually analyze those two races without committing to spending the time of reviewing an entire card. It also gets me to check out DRF.com several times a week, and then I see what their top stories are.

So they already have me as a periodic, and somewhat frequent customer, but they also are keeping me happy by giving me something for free, and that stimulates even more interest. I think it's a great strategy, and their owner, Steve Crist, is a very bright guy.

[Bobby Fischer]

they should charge a PENNY a day

[deltagulf]

Originally Posted by Danzig

but would they pay $1 to find out which machine pays off the most, or the highest? probably.

i am not surprised, considering the economy right now, to see formerly free materials suddenly have a price tag attached.

some casinos do charge for the form but its just a dollar.

[Stall Mucker]

The cutting off of free info. is the result of how "tight" the dollar really is.
As a close watcher of handle of the OTB corp that employs me, I can tell you that free info is very costly. Equibase et al is putting the squeeze on everyone therefore making free info no longer free. The fees are costly.
The down handle figures posted on different sites for race tracks etc are real. For a lot of reasons this game and others are in big money trouble.
For at least the last 60 days I have seen 1 up day so far and that was this past Wednesday. As a Dept Head I have been asked for several reports asking for the barest of minimum to operate at the risk of shutting down.