Cowtown Cat gets huge BRIS #. Cobalt Blue gets excused

[Grits]

Originally Posted by flifishri

I'm wondering what the 3 BRIS pace figures show for this race compared to earlier CC races. For me that's usually a better indicator than the BRIS speed figure. Anyone know?

I don't have pps/pace figures from this race.

I'm amazed though, the allegiance by which handicappers adhere to Beyer speed figures--and little else. I've assumed, for the most part, that they were a starting point in a process.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Grits

I'm amazed though, the allegiance by which handicappers adhere to Beyer speed figures--and little else.

I know of very few serious handicappers who adhere to speed figures and little else.....

And those few tend to be sheet players.

[Grits]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

I know of very few serious handicappers who adhere to speed figures and little else.....

And those few tend to be sheet players.

My thought on this mainly noting how much and how often--Beyers are quoted. So much emphasis being placed there.

And true, you are right, serious players use every bit of data before them placing great importance on charts, trouble, etc.

All of which bring to mind, Octave, on Saturday had the trip from hell.

[10 pnt move up]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

I know of very few serious handicappers who adhere to speed figures and little else.....

And those few tend to be sheet players.

amen men to that.....

[Thunder Gulch]

CC's last two races

E1 E2/ LP Final
83 97/ 110 106 ....Illinois
70 86/104 96.... Gotham

One note on these. Bris upgraded their product to include "race shape" comparisons of the first and second pace calls. CC's last 2 races.

1c 2c
-12 -9...Illi
-18 -8...Gotham
You can clearly see from this that CC benefitted from very slow pace calls. On the Bris scale, 1L = 2pts, so the first call of the Ill Derby was 6L slower than par. When this happens, you can almost always expect a front runner to put the field away. The Gotham was even slower early. He'll have to run 10 lengths faster to the pace calls in the Derby to maintain the same track position in that field. It takes an extremely talented animal to do this, and I just don't think this guy can maintain that pace and have anything left.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by Thunder Gulch

CC's last two races

E1 E2/ LP Final
83 97/ 110 106 ....Illinois
70 86/104 96.... Gotham

One note on these. Bris upgraded their product to include "race shape" comparisons of the first and second pace calls. CC's last 2 races.

1c 2c
-12 -9...Illi
-18 -8...Gotham
You can clearly see from this that CC benefitted from very slow pace calls. On the Bris scale, 1L = 2pts, so the first call of the Ill Derby was 6L slower than par. When this happens, you can almost always expect a front runner to put the field away. The Gotham was even slower early. He'll have to run 10 lengths faster to the pace calls in the Derby to maintain the same track position in that field. It takes an extremely talented animal to do this, and I just don't think this guy can maintain that pace and have anything left.

Strange, on the PP's I downloaded last night the race shape numbers for the Illinois are -5 -8.

I just pulled them again for the KD future wager and they are like you say, -12 -9, even slower.

[10 pnt move up]

Drugs

It was 89 pace and 98 speed, that is an ugly profile for a speed horse who rode an inside bias.

[flifishri]

Well said. i'd be interested in more on how u spot an "off pace" number and how you use the BRIS pace figs in general. Thanks

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by flifishri

Well said. i'd be interested in more on how u spot an "off pace" number and how you use the BRIS pace figs in general. Thanks

I'm not sure using any BRIS figures is a great idea but to each their own.

[Rootdog1]

I find them useful, much better then Beyers figs. Use them as a guide to pick out ones that look to either of had a positive or negative race set up (pace, trouble, etc)....then go watch replays. But to each their own...