I Think Barbaro Should Be Put Down

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

I think if Barbaro doesn't want to live anymore he will let them know. Until then I think they are absolutely doing the right thing by doing everything possible to let him live.

C'mon now, just because an animal will eat doesn't mean you make an assessment about whether they want to live or not. Animals are not people.

[brianwspencer]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

C'mon now, just because an animal will eat doesn't mean you make an assessment about whether they want to live or not. Animals are not people.

But by and large you can tell by their temperment if they are miserable or not. If it were some schmo on the street insisting that he keep fighting it would be different -- I think it's been clear from the beginning that Dr. Richardson and the Jacksons would never press it one second further than was good for Barbaro. I trust in their opinions 100%.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by brianwspencer

But by and large you can tell by their temperment if they are miserable or not. If it were some schmo on the street insisting that he keep fighting it would be different -- I think it's been clear from the beginning that Dr. Richardson and the Jacksons would never press it one second further than was good for Barbaro. I trust in their opinions 100%.

Yes, I agree with you 100%.

He's a true fighter and has proven so much more than he ever could on the track about his heart... but I took feel like its going to be a losing battle. In my heart of hearts, I dont see a good outcome. Living is a shell if the quality of life isnt good.

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Right, but it's a decent indication from my experience. I think it's a very hard decision either way and actually maybe more difficult for the owners to keep him alive seeing him go through the surgeries. But if the horse keeps fighting, why not let him fight?

DaHoss,
You might be right, but if the test of "courage" is defined by continued pain, in my humble opinion, Barbaro has already shown what a courageous horse he is. He has nothing more to prove.
Who is he fighting for?
He's already survived his battles with great valor.

[randallscott35]

Mind you these quotes from Richardson were before the latest surgery from this morning.

Long term? "We don't know," Richardson said. "I carefully chose the word setback. It's a significant setback in terms of we have to manage his pain more aggressively now. We've got to worry more about his right hind, because he's bearing so much more weight on his right hind, getting off his left. So there are a lot of issues involved that we have to manage."

Richardson and the Jacksons discuss the long term on a regular basis. All made it clear that the colt must ultimately be able to lead a pain-free life. "If we think we're to the point that he isn't acceptable and we don't have reasonable options to try, then we'll give up," Richardson said. "That isn't the case right now."

The fact is, they have tried. And all its led to is more surgeries, more casts, more questions. You aren't doing a service for this horse, that's what we are missing here. This is more about human nature being selfish IMO. People don't want to feel badly about the sport we love which inherently costs horses their lives. We affix more value to Barbaro than the 5k claimer that breaks down at Penn National which is unfair on so many levels.

[timmgirvan]

Rand: This is a tough call for the owners and Doc! But make no mistake..Barbaro is infinitely more valuable than a 5k claimer on every level!

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by timmgirvan

Rand: This is a tough call for the owners and Doc! But make no mistake..Barbaro is infinitely more valuable than a 5k claimer on every level!

Of course he is, from a financial standpoint which is what this should absolutely not be about. I hate the fact that we care less about the cheap horses who are run into the grave and then jump up and down to save the expensive ones. There is no consistency here....The main point here is that trying to save him with the extent of the injuries he had was unheard of. If it was a stakes horse on the undercard that day, they would've been put down without a second thought. So while he is still alive, his future isn't any better than that day as far as I'm concerned.

[jpops757]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Of course he is, from a financial standpoint which is what this should absolutely not be about. I hate the fact that we care less about the cheap horses who are run into the grave and then jump up and down to save the expensive ones. There is no consistency here....The main point here is that trying to save him with the extent of the injuries he had was unheard of. If it was a stakes horse on the undercard that day, they would've been put down without a second thought. So while he is still alive, his future isn't any better than that day as far as I'm concerned.

The sad thing about it is because of the insurance involved, it could be out of th docs and the Jacksons control.

[Samarta]

Originally Posted by jpops757

The sad thing about it is because of the insurance involved, it could be out of th docs and the Jacksons control.

How so? Even if that were the case, which I doubt, $$$ is not the issue. I think if Dr. Richardson and the Jacksons wanted to put him down, and they were told no by the insurance companies, they would do it anyway.

[jpops757]

Originally Posted by Samarta

How so? Even if that were the case, which I doubt, $$$ is not the issue. I think if Dr. Richardson and the Jacksons wanted to put him down, and they were told no by the insurance companies, they would do it anyway.

I agree with you but being right has no relationship to legality.

[paisjpq]

3 years ago I had a horse come in from turnout lame...three legged lame. The owner agreed to have the leg x-rayed and the horse had fractured his patella and chipped a good flake off his femur...he was a decent sugical candidate (and the $$ was not an issue)...but he had had 2 previous surgeries while racing to remove chips and both times had serious issues recovering from anesthesia so the owner opted for a wait and see approach...to keep him 'acceptably comfortable' with medication and stall rest...that horse lived for 18 months...he ate well and hobbled around with his pasture mates....but he was not a happy horse (he was 'bright'...but that does not mean happy)...his owner loved him dearly and refused to see that the kindest solution was to put hime down...it wasn't until he had gone so far downhill that he wouldn't eat and had lost a great deal of weight that he allowed me to have the horse put down...
today 2 almost 2 years after the horse was buried he admits that he wishes he hadn't waited so long...that horse was a fighter too.

[timmgirvan]

I think it's past the point of money....I don't think that's the issue now.

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by paisjpq

3 years ago I had a horse come in from turnout lame...three legged lame. The owner agreed to have the leg x-rayed and the horse had fractured his patella and chipped a good flake off his femur...he was a decent sugical candidate (and the $$ was not an issue)...but he had had 2 previous surgeries while racing to remove chips and both times had serious issues recovering from anesthesia so the owner opted for a wait and see approach...to keep him 'acceptably comfortable' with medication and stall rest...that horse lived for 18 months...he ate well and hobbled around with his pasture mates....but he was not a happy horse (he was 'bright'...but that does not mean happy)...his owner loved him dearly and refused to see that the kindest solution was to put hime down...it wasn't until he had gone so far downhill that he wouldn't eat and had lost a great deal of weight that he allowed me to have the horse put down...
today 2 almost 2 years after the horse was buried he admits that he wishes he hadn't waited so long...that horse was a fighter too.

Pais,
Thanks for that story. Gosh, I have mine. Too many, all sad.
I won't share them now cause they'll take from the real concerns on this thread.
Sometimes, it's just too hard to do what's best for the horse depite what we humans want.

[mclem10011]

I feel should have been saved, I would feel that way about any horse. Because it's not always possible to save these great athletes, the fact that Barbaro has made it this far, is a miracle. I hope he continues to improve, I know he had a recent setback, but it sounds like he's gonna rebound once again, and I think it's fantastic!

[golfer]

this opinion comes from someone outside looking in who has never been around horses, but it seems to me the only reason they have been and continue to try to save this horse is because he is allowing it. Other horses would have thrashed around and never allowed this type of treatment. Call him smarter, or whatever, but he has been the ideal patient, almost human-like in character while all this has been ocurring. If he is that intelligent, perhaps he will let everyone know when enough is enough?

[Samarta]

Originally Posted by golfer

this opinion comes from someone outside looking in who has never been around horses, but it seems to me the only reason they have been and continue to try to save this horse is because he is allowing it. Other horses would have thrashed around and never allowed this type of treatment. Call him smarter, or whatever, but he has been the ideal patient, almost human-like in character while all this has been ocurring. If he is that intelligent, perhaps he will let everyone know when enough is enough?

and he will....

[sumitas]

No question Barbaro is recovering. His people are absolutely doing the right thing because the horse wants to live. You folks would do better to try and improve the safety of horse racing instead of biting the heels of this group of caring health experts.

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by sumitas

No question Barbaro is recovering. His people are absolutely doing the right thing because the horse wants to live. You folks would do better to try and improve the safety of horse racing instead of biting the heels of this group of caring health experts.

You know Sumitas, I went out of my way in my initial post to talk about the Jacksons in a positive light. And simply having a view which is not in the mainstream in the horse racing community right now doesn't mean I am attacking the people invovled with the horse at all....So don't try and turn this into a vindictive type thread, b/c its not.

[sumitas]

It is vindictive and you started this despicable thread and I'm calling you and the others of your ilk on it. Go and do something positive with your time.