Classic Empire

freddymo · #1 09-06-2016, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RHT2004

He's fine back at the barn. Per Casse twitter.

Takes a lot to be good horse. Casse said on ATR's he will get blinkers in next start. Let's hope its the solution to the problem or even if there is a problem. Totally possible it was a one off, I wouldnt bet on that being the case, but you never know.

Colt was doomed after my buddy Ed DeRosa tweeted he was the next TC winner, Ed was being cheeky.

Let's hope he isnt a Tap it Out lost cause. Guess all PoTN colts arent sweet pets after all

Kasept · #2 09-06-2016, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by freddymo

Takes a lot to be good horse. Casse said on ATR's he will get blinkers in next start. Let's hope its the solution to the problem or even if there is a problem. Totally possible it was a one off, I wouldnt bet on that being the case, but you never know.

Colt was doomed after my buddy Ed DeRosa tweeted he was the next TC winner, Ed was being cheeky.

Let's hope he isnt a Tap it Out lost cause. Guess all PoTN colts arent sweet pets after all

He propped because of that other starting gate that was lined up against the fence. Should not have been stationed there.

freddymo · #3 09-07-2016, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kasept

He propped because of that other starting gate that was lined up against the fence. Should not have been stationed there.

I guess.. The other horses didnt seem to mind the misplaced gate. Promising colt lets see him get past this, hopefully connects figure it out..It could be something serious or something that never shows up again?? I will root for him in next start but from a wagering point of view I wouldnt ever bet/use him next out. That whole "he is too smart" jargon is theoretic nonsense.

Kasept · #4 09-07-2016, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by freddymo

I guess.. The other horses didnt seem to mind the misplaced gate. Promising colt lets see him get past this, hopefully connects figure it out..It could be something serious or something that never shows up again?? I will root for him in next start but from a wagering point of view I wouldnt ever bet/use him next out. That whole "he is too smart" jargon is theoretic nonsense.

Horses are individuals. Does every horse balk behind the gate when loading? By your reasoning, if one does, all should.

Casse, who after re-watching the race agrees that the gate was the culprit, told me this morning that Classic Empire worked in blinkers and went super.

freddymo · #5 09-07-2016, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kasept

Horses are individuals. Does every horse balk behind the gate when loading? By your reasoning, if one does, all should.

Casse, who after re-watching the race agrees that the gate was the culprit, told me this morning that Classic Empire worked in blinkers and went super.

Not sure I remotely concur with your analogy. We see tons of horses continually balk behind gate and be unsettled, washout etc. their whole careers and still be successful. We witnessed a denial to run from this "individual", lets just say this herd animal elected not to advance with the herd. If you and Casse are OK with suggesting that a misplaced gate was the culprit, OK. We both watch a lot of races, we rarely see a complete refusal from a horse albeit a 2 year old with a few successful starts. As for Casse telling you" he went super". I think we should keep in mind (a little) that this is a valuable colt and being 100% forthcoming MIGHT or MIGHT NOT be the agenda. Not suggesting Casse is lying at ALL, just I would take a wait in see approach. Baffert told us Tap It Rich was OK working great yada yada.

I am a fan I want to see him do well! Will see

Kasept · #6 09-07-2016, 12:05 PM

OK Freddy.. Will rely on your strong Twitter contacts to keep us informed.

freddymo · #7 09-07-2016, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kasept

OK Freddy.. Will rely on your strong Twitter contacts to keep us informed.

As perhaps your most devoted longest listener that's simply not the point. Nobody is suggesting Casse is lying, nobody is saying the horse wasn't spooked by the foreign misplaced gate. Let's keep in mind, it was a G1 at a racetrack with a highly competent staff, with the eyes of the racing world watching, so the notion that this gate faux pas was so divisive to a horses chances is really something to question. Seems to me the staff there wouldn't be so cavalier right before a G1 and try something new ,but perhaps a human made an error..It happens? My GUESS is the gate has been left there before and never was considered to be a hindrance, but I REALLY DONT KNOW

Classic Empire has had issues in his previous races, I am sure this is not news to many of us that follow the game. Those issues have escalated not mitigated. I started this by saying for as much as I KNOW it could have been a 1 off miscue.

I think its important to be objective and from were I stand the colt is a nut case that freaked out. That's not a knock on Casse's amazing operation. That colt ran 30 yards and stopped on a dime like a well trained barrel runner, because he saw Jesus would have been more plausible then seeing through the colt to right side but I really don't know.

As a fan that loves good fast sound horses, nothing would make me happier than to see him win the TC and never have another issue again. StartergateGate does not sound plausible to me.

RolloTomasi · #8 09-13-2016, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by freddymo

N As for Casse telling you" he went super". I think we should keep in mind (a little) that this is a valuable colt and being 100% forthcoming MIGHT or MIGHT NOT be the agenda. Not suggesting Casse is lying at ALL, just I would take a wait in see approach.

Not sure if there was some miscommunication with regards to working with blinkers, but Classic Empire did not have a published workout on 9/07 nor has he had one since.

Also, something left out of this surprisingly sober (for Freddy) discussion was that Classic Empire was noted to be lame when inspected following the incident (hence he was vanned off). He is currently on the NYRA Vet List (accessible on the NYRA website) listed as "unsound".

Curiously, runner-up Royal Copy also made the Vet List coming out of the race, listed as "injured". And Runway Lute fell past the wire, but was allowed to walk off and did not make the Vet List.

An "unusual" Hopeful as Larry Colmus said...

freddymo · #9 09-13-2016, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

Not sure if there was some miscommunication with regards to working with blinkers, but Classic Empire did not have a published workout on 9/07 nor has he had one since.

Also, something left out of this surprisingly sober (for Freddy) discussion was that Classic Empire was noted to be lame when inspected following the incident (hence he was vanned off). He is currently on the NYRA Vet List (accessible on the NYRA website) listed as "unsound".

Curiously, runner-up Royal Copy also made the Vet List coming out of the race, listed as "injured". And Runway Lute fell past the wire, but was allowed to walk off and did not make the Vet List.

An "unusual" Hopeful as Larry Colmus said...

Can a horse be deemed as "unsound" because they refused to race/mental case? Or does it have to be physical ailments?