The Sheets

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by Kasept

In addition to providing consistently more accurate performance figures,

How do you measure this? Do they pick more winners? Better ROI? By how much? Surely you have some data to back up such a blunt statement.

For the record, I'm not disagreeing. I have no idea. I have nothing to do with either of them professionally either. I had access to The Sheets when they were partnered with TimeformUS and didn't even look at them more than twice. I just always wonder what measure people use when proclaiming one set of figures betters better than others.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

How do you measure this? Do they pick more winners? Better ROI? By how much? Surely you have some data to back up such a blunt statement.

Picking more winners and ROI would be in the hands of the user(s).

Accuracy of the figures as measured by TG's Jerry Brown whose opinion I trust completely (no matter how biased).

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Picking more winners and ROI would be in the hands of the user(s).

Accuracy of the figures as measured by TG's Jerry Brown whose opinion I trust completely (no matter how biased).

OK, so no real standard, just the opinion of the creator of one of the two mentioned. That is fair.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

OK, so no real standard, just the opinion of the creator of one of the two mentioned. That is fair.

I'd imagine the 'standard' is the same kind of parameters you most likely use when you monitor, and comment on relative accuracy, of other figure makers. So similarly, not an opinion.. perhaps conjecture or supposition are better words. But you can believe that Jerry is watching everything that's done there. Closely.

[Thoroughbred Fan]

They are not a tout sheet. They are just THE BEST DATA AVAILABLE. You still need to choose the horses and make the tickets. Simple.

[Thunder Gulch]

To each his own, but to almost completely brush aside pace considerations when creating "performance" figures is a big blind spot. Of course that puts it in the hands of handicappers to consider the race and how the figure was earned, which gets to one of the biggest positives of using Thorograph, and that's in that they aren't the most used figure by the masses. It's hard to get any value out of Beyers when they are under everyone's nose and anyone under 50 grew up learning to handicap with them. On the other hand, while Thorograph may not be in the hands of as many handicappers, the ones that use sheets tend to be sharper and play for more money than the guy who picks up a form on the way to his seat. Therefore, it's still difficult to find spots where other sheet players aren't driving the value out of a selection.

Bottom line IMO is that all figures have flaws, whether it be pace, ground loss, changing conditions...whatever. Some really smart people have and continue to make a one size fits all figure, and if even if it were possible, the parimutuel value would disappear when they hit mainstream.

[Secretriat34]

NUMBERS ...ARE JUST THAT - NUMBERS

DON'T MATTER WHO PROVIDES YOUR RAW DATA..

NUMBERS DONT LIE
BUT
YOU CAN LIE WITH NUMBERS

nothing accounts for the day of the race conditions except the mood of the animals themselves

does the 1 horse have a tooth ache,
did the three horse have a bee in his stall
did the 5 horse eat some bad hay
is the 4 horse intimidated by he 7

what happens on race day--- happens !

raw data does little except for identify the three of four with NO chance of being ITM

who is in the race today...
have they faced others in todays field ? what hapened then ?
has each of todays runners run at the track before ? what hapened ...did they win..if not were they in a box..

video and perfomance on todays track, along with repeat competitors have far more predictive power than digital analysis.

if the numbers gave out winners.it would be just that easy..
but..it isn't