Is American Pharoah Baffert's best horse?

[Benny]

“We've had a lot of good horses,” trainer Bob Baffert said. “I’ve never had one that moves like this. Never.”

http://www.si.com/horse-racing/2015/...ustrated-cover

[DonGuido]

Originally Posted by Benny

“We've had a lot of good horses,” trainer Bob Baffert said. “I’ve never had one that moves like this. Never.”

http://www.si.com/horse-racing/2015/...ustrated-cover

I keep telling you Bob loves this horse and he's not done running and winning yet.

Where would he stand all time if and it's a big IF he were to win the Haskell, The Travers and the BC Classic or even 2 out of the 3. I believe we have not seen his best yet!!!

[Thunder Gulch]

I love Silver Charm, and I thought PG was just an awesome animal, but this guy has to be the best. I suppose if he never wins again, you could argue those 2, but AP is winning big races by open lengths.

[DaTruth]

Zensational has to be in the conversation.
"He’s incredible. He’s a beast. He’s one of the three best horses I’ve ever trained,” trainer Bob Baffert said. “He’s one of the few you get in a lifetime. He is as fast, as powerful, and as good-looking as any horse you will ever see. He breezed faster than really good horses run.”

[outofthebox]

This is why i feel AP is his best. And this mostly comes from a horseman's view. What if find is most amazing about this guy, is that he overcame a 6 month layoff where two months of it was convalescing an injury. Believe me, a normal horse would have never gotten ready for a Triple Crown in the short amount of time he had for preparation. His workout pattern was actually abbreviated from the normal Baffert pattern. In place of his final workouts was actually a race (Rebel) which set him up for his first real test of the year (Arkansas Derby), which ended up as a workout in itself. In reality his first big test of the year was The Derby. And he struggled, we all saw that. It was an effort that actually brought him down to earth to most pundits. Gone was the "super horse" tag many had pinned on him. It was the first time the Baffert team actually had to deal with a tired horse after the race. Most experts were calling for an regression in the Preakness. None doing. He ran everyone off their feet in the quagmire and proceeding to come out of the race stronger. The three weeks between the Preakness and the Belmont we probably witnessed AP in his strongest breeze showings. Here was a horse who was peeking going into the last leg of the Triple Crown. I'm not going to get in a debate about the easy trip he got away with, or the 105 Beyer that he was assigned. What i took out of this final race of the Triple Crown was the power and ease of which he controlled the race from the start. It's not often you watch a Belmont and the winner is still well in hand as he turns into the stretch. AP only was extended for 5/16th of a mile, and was in full stride at the wire and still full of run on the gallop out. I can't wait for the second half of the season for AP..Like all 3yo's, he's going to have to improve his numbers to be competitive in the fall classics. I have faith that he will...

[Benny]

Originally Posted by outofthebox

This is why i feel AP is his best. And this mostly comes from a horseman's view. What if find is most amazing about this guy, is that he overcame a 6 month layoff where two months of it was convalescing an injury. Believe me, a normal horse would have never gotten ready for a Triple Crown in the short amount of time he had for preparation. His workout pattern was actually abbreviated from the normal Baffert pattern. In place of his final workouts was actually a race (Rebel) which set him up for his first real test of the year (Arkansas Derby), which ended up as a workout in itself. In reality his first big test of the year was The Derby. And he struggled, we all saw that. It was an effort that actually brought him down to earth to most pundits. Gone was the "super horse" tag many had pinned on him. It was the first time the Baffert team actually had to deal with a tired horse after the race. Most experts were calling for an regression in the Preakness. None doing. He ran everyone off their feet in the quagmire and proceeding to come out of the race stronger. The three weeks between the Preakness and the Belmont we probably witnessed AP in his strongest breeze showings. Here was a horse who was peeking going into the last leg of the Triple Crown. I'm not going to get in a debate about the easy trip he got away with, or the 105 Beyer that he was assigned. What i took out of this final race of the Triple Crown was the power and ease of which he controlled the race from the start. It's not often you watch a Belmont and the winner is still well in hand as he turns into the stretch. AP only was extended for 5/16th of a mile, and was in full stride at the wire and still full of run on the gallop out. I can't wait for the second half of the season for AP..Like all 3yo's, he's going to have to improve his numbers to be competitive in the fall classics. I have faith that he will...

I believe ATR show today brought up the question of other trainers possibly putting in a rabbit in the next races of AP. What do you think,?

[outofthebox]

Originally Posted by Benny

I believe ATR show today brought up the question of other trainers possibly putting in a rabbit in the next races of AP. What do you think,?

I think as the races progress over the summer, there will be no need for a rabbit..There will be other 3yo's that are just progressing now that will be in the Haskell or The Travers that will create another race shape than what we witnessed in AP's last two races. He has proven to be a very relaxed competitor(Arkansas Derby) and is very attuned to what the jockey is asking of him. I've read in a few stories that people were comparing him to Slew. They are two different animals. Slew wanted to attack you and be in control from the start. Such a tenacious fighter he was on the track. AP looks like he is having fun out there and just going through the motions..

[Benny]

Originally Posted by Thunder Gulch

I love Silver Charm, and I thought PG was just an awesome animal, but this guy has to be the best. I suppose if he never wins again, you could argue those 2, but AP is winning big races by open lengths.

I always thought that Baffert undertrained PG for the derby sso he'd be fresherr for the other 2 legs, just athought as i saw him romp in the Belmont that year.I'dd like to ask him that.

[outofthebox]

Originally Posted by Benny

I always thought that Baffert undertrained PG for the derby sso he'd be fresherr for the other 2 legs, just athought as i saw him romp in the Belmont that year.I'dd like to ask him that.

I can't remember how PG trained up to the Derby. Pretty sure those were the days before we had "The Works" show and everyone was focusing on that. I do remember the track that day as being extremely fast and Stevens had him chasing the suicide pace while wide throughout. They chose the wrong day to take him out of his preferred running style..

[Thunder Gulch]

Originally Posted by outofthebox

I can't remember how PG trained up to the Derby. Pretty sure those were the days before we had "The Works" show and everyone was focusing on that. I do remember the track that day as being extremely fast and Stevens had him chasing the suicide pace while wide throughout. They chose the wrong day to take him out of his preferred running style..

The pace was just way to hot to be anywhere close. That said, Congaree was ahead of PG early and finished better. Just wasn't his day.

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Benny

I always thought that Baffert undertrained PG for the derby sso he'd be fresherr for the other 2 legs, just athought as i saw him romp in the Belmont that year.I'dd like to ask him that.

I remember reading an interview with Baffert where he said that was indeed his mistake- he trained PG for the Triple Crown, rather than for the Derby.

[pointman]

Originally Posted by Benny

I always thought that Baffert undertrained PG for the derby sso he'd be fresherr for the other 2 legs, just athought as i saw him romp in the Belmont that year.I'dd like to ask him that.

Just ask The Don to ask Baffert that, he has made it clear that he has the inside track on Baffert's ear.

[Seattleallstar]

Point Given is my favorite horse, and imo was visually the more impressive horse. His Belmont was the best we have seen in in this century, with the time and speed figure to back it up. In the Travers he won easily, but we knew that he had a extra gear or two left in him which we hadn't seen and regrettably we never got to see more

As for what happened in the Derby,with PG. Stevens and Baffert were already thinking TC before winning the Derby. Stevens admitted that the Derby in his mind would be a foregone conclusion, he was looking to break Secretariat's time. Like what was also posted Baffert was training for TC and looked past the Derby

AP is a good horse and also visually impressive, but times and figures assigned have been average times for the races won by horses in years past. Nothing really stands out other than he won the TC. I'm not as confident in AP that he has extra gears left we have not seen. But time will well, hopefully.

Right now for me it is

PG, SC, AP, RQ

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by Benny

I always thought that Baffert undertrained PG for the derby sso he'd be fresherr for the other 2 legs, just athought as i saw him romp in the Belmont that year.I'dd like to ask him that.

I've asked him on radio. Baffert said he didn't want to make excuses at the time, but Point Given was nursing a hoof and couldn't be leaned on pre-Derby... similar to how he came into Haskell very short, but won anyway. Frankel had the same kind of issue to deal with Empire Maker pre-Derby.