How Is Obamacare Working Out for You?

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Danzig

quite often medical is what puts people in the poor house.

Thisthisthis.

I shake my head when people grouse about the inheritance tax, which will not affect any but the very wealthy, completely ignoring the fact that the cost of health care in this country amounts to a 100 percent inheritance tax on the middle class, since the majority of people incur most of their health care costs in the last six months of life and it often eats up whatever they might have had left for their descendants.

My parents' health care costs are absolutely eating up everything my dad spent his life saving for retirement. A relative who just passed away was paying $700 a month for her health insurance premium. She was regularly down to $20 in her checking account a day or so before the next SS payment came in.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

Thisthisthis.

I shake my head when people grouse about the inheritance tax, which will not affect any but the very wealthy, completely ignoring the fact that the cost of health care in this country amounts to a 100 percent inheritance tax on the middle class, since the majority of people incur most of their health care costs in the last six months of life and it often eats up whatever they might have had left for their descendants.

My parents' health care costs are absolutely eating up everything my dad spent his life saving for retirement. A relative who just passed away was paying $700 a month for her health insurance premium. She was regularly down to $20 in her checking account a day or so before the next SS payment came in.

another issue that has yet to be tackled....
we are living longer and longer--who's going to pick up the tab for end of life care? right now, you spend down til you're indigent and then medicaid pays-medicare doesn't after 90 days. so after 3 months, if you have to stay-you have to dig really deep. if you're married, spouse can stay in home-and keep one car. the rest have to be sold. life insurance with cash value? you have to either cash it in and give the money to the nursing home, or sign it over to the funeral home.
the average nursing home is over $6k a month for a semi-private room. that's just to stay, that doesn't include any medical care, etc. average length of stay, 2 years.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Danzig

another issue that has yet to be tackled....
we are living longer and longer--who's going to pick up the tab for end of life care? right now, you spend down til you're indigent and then medicaid pays-medicare doesn't after 90 days. so after 3 months, if you have to stay-you have to dig really deep. if you're married, spouse can stay in home-and keep one car. the rest have to be sold. life insurance with cash value? you have to either cash it in and give the money to the nursing home, or sign it over to the funeral home.
the average nursing home is over $6k a month for a semi-private room. that's just to stay, that doesn't include any medical care, etc. average length of stay, 2 years.

And now they are saying babies born today could live to 120 or longer. Does anyone ever think about the unintended consequences of this? There isn't enough resources, food, water, jobs to support the current inhabitants of this rock we live on. Think how bad it will be if people start living longer and longer? As I told my friend , the way things are I'm happy that I am mid-way into the far turn

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by jms62

And now they are saying babies born today could live to 120 or longer. Does anyone ever think about the unintended consequences of this? There isn't enough resources, food, water, jobs to support the current inhabitants of this rock we live on. Think how bad it will be if people start living longer and longer? As I told my friend , the way things are I'm happy that I am mid-way into the far turn

I'm just hoping it's a 6 furlong race and I don't have to go around again.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by jms62

And now they are saying babies born today could live to 120 or longer. Does anyone ever think about the unintended consequences of this? There isn't enough resources, food, water, jobs to support the current inhabitants of this rock we live on. Think how bad it will be if people start living longer and longer? As I told my friend , the way things are I'm happy that I am mid-way into the far turn

yeah, i know of life insurance policies that don't mature til age 120-used to be 100. more and more are living past age 100.
thankfully we are having less kids here, and hopefully eventually less all over (hey, catholic church, quit with the preaching against birth control-be fruitful and multiply can only go so far).
current population growth was .7% when i last looked-without immigration, we'd have negative growth.

but yeah, we don't have infinite resources. last i heard we still just have the one planet.


The population of the world is 7.28 billion people as of January 2015.
•During the 20th century alone, the population in the world has grown from 1.65 billion to 6 billion.
•In 1970, there were roughly half as many people in the world as there are now.
•Because of declining growth rates, it will now take over 200 years to double again.


it better not double again. a study i read about not long ago said the max capacity for earth is 10 billion.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

Thisthisthis.

I shake my head when people grouse about the inheritance tax, which will not affect any but the very wealthy.

Meet my neighbors, the Pearce's. Because of where their farmland is located it's probably worth in the neighborhood of $30 million, probably another 5 million in structures and equipment. But yea, let's make his heirs pay $10 million in inheritance taxes and be forced to sell off a third of the land for development because Bob and the 5 generations before him worked too hard!

http://www.pearcefarms.com/about.htm

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

Meet my neighbors, the Pearce's. Because of where their farmland is located it's probably worth in the neighborhood of $30 million, probably another 5 million in structures and equipment. But yea, let's make his heirs pay $10 million in inheritance taxes and be forced to sell off a third of the land for development because Bob and the 5 generations before him worked too hard!

http://www.pearcefarms.com/about.htm

The above has been your daily installment of "people who don't understand how the estate tax works." Here's a link to set your mind at rest, Dell, regarding your neighbors and the hypothetical value of their farm:

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=2655

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

The above has been your daily installment of "people who don't understand how the estate tax works." Here's a link to set your mind at rest, Dell, regarding your neighbors and the hypothetical value of their farm:

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=2655

a lot of wealthier people buy 'second to die' life insurance policies. that way, when both parts of the married couple pass, the benefits are paid, tax free of course, to the person inheriting in order to pay estate taxes.

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Danzig

a lot of wealthier people buy 'second to die' life insurance policies. that way, when both parts of the married couple pass, the benefits are paid, tax free of course, to the person inheriting in order to pay estate taxes.

That is very interesting; I didn't know that. I know someone who works in trusts and estates at a law firm, and he said most of what the law firm does is help ultra wealthy folks figure out how to avoid their estates paying out any taxes at all when they die. Lotta money and valuables held "in trust," which means that an individual doesn't technically own it, a trust, which never dies, owns it.

Of course, the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania has estate tax on everything a person owns, and if you aren't a direct descendant of the person, the tax will be 15 percent (it's 4.5 percent on direct descendants). So probably the best legal advice there is not to die as a resident of Pennsylvania.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

That is very interesting; I didn't know that. I know someone who works in trusts and estates at a law firm, and he said most of what the law firm does is help ultra wealthy folks figure out how to avoid their estates paying out any taxes at all when they die. Lotta money and valuables held "in trust," which means that an individual doesn't technically own it, a trust, which never dies, owns it.

Of course, the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania has estate tax on everything a person owns, and if you aren't a direct descendant of the person, the tax will be 15 percent (it's 4.5 percent on direct descendants). So probably the best legal advice there is not to die as a resident of Pennsylvania.

Ask him about it, its a very clever way to handle those taxes. Then on trusts, you have revocable and irrevocable...the latter is probably what wealthier folks do..I know when we talked to the guy handling our trust, I asked if revocable would protect against what I said above about nursing homes, it doesn't. There are rules tho to protect one spouse if other has to get care..Not sure about irrevocable...fits for some but I didn't ask about it. But some folks are uncomfortable with the irrevocable part! Also,, wealthy folks can afford a nursing home or home health..or they have long term care insurance. I recommend everyone look into that!
You can make the trust the beneficiary of life insurance....but you can also place someone else as the policy owner to protect it in case of a nursing home issue, just has to be at least five years before. Right now its a five year look back for assets, but they're talking about changing it to seven...


Oh, and if anyone is buying CDs to have money to leave their kids...take at least a third of that money and buy a life policy.
A 5000 CD gets you five k, and then interest right now is beyond awful
. take that five k to your life agent, let him/her show you what it will do.

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Danzig

Oh, and if anyone is buying CDs to have money to leave their kids...take at least a third of that money and buy a life policy.
A 5000 CD gets you five k, and then interest right now is beyond awful
. take that five k to your life agent, let him/her show you what it will do.

A life policy with a beneficiary is also a way to circumnavigate estate tax if your state imposes it. Unless, of course, you list "Estate of" as your beneficiary!

No kidding about CDs having crappy interest rates. Inflation is still talked about like the big bugaboo, but the US policy on keeping it low has led to savings accounts and CDs being worthless as places to grow your income. I remember opening an IRA when I was 25, and then at some point a few years later looking at the calculations of how much I'd have at retirement if I kept it in a basic savings IRA.

I went out the next day and bought "Mutual Funds for Dummies."