Shireffs-- Zenyatta is HOY

[prudery]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

She also never runs in 40 degree weather does she?

That may be true, but she doesn't run or live in a tropical climates either .

Mornings at all tracks are cold even in the summer .

I get your point, but I don't think the temp change is that dramatic.

It is not like she was beamed from stall to gate without moving .

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Who said that? I'll be honest, If she beats Blame by a head, I don't think she would of gotten the vote. I think she needed to dominate Blame. If people think this close defeat cost her the HOY, I think they're mistaken. It would of been close, but I think Blame still would of gotten HOY.

This is also stupid. She would have been close to unanimous had she won. Thankfully the NFL doesn't have a vote on the end of the year champion or else the 07 Patriots would have won been the Champions despite losing to Giants in the SB.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by prudery

That may be true, but she doesn't run or live in a tropical climates either .

Mornings at all tracks are cold even in the summer .

I get your point, but I don't think the temp change is that dramatic.

It is not like she was beamed from stall to gate without moving .

What does the morning have to do with it? There is a reason that riders warm horses up before a race. The fact is that when you dont warm up your horse on a cold day then you shouldnt be surprised when she is slow to get into the race. This is consistent from claiming horses to mythical horses.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

This is also stupid. She would have been close to unanimous had she won. Thankfully the NFL doesn't have a vote on the end of the year champion or else the 07 Patriots would have won been the Champions despite losing to Giants in the SB.

They didn't give it to Gomez in 2006. WTF was that about?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

They didn't give it to Gomez in 2006. WTF was that about?

I dont know or care. Horses awards are fairly clear cut most of the time, including this year.
Blame will be HoY and Older Horse
Zenyatta will be older filly/mare
Goldikova will probably win turf champion
Blind Luck will be champion 3 yo filly
Looking at Lucky will be champion 3 yo colt
Awesome whatever will be 2 yo filly
Uncle mo will be 2 yo colt
I suppose Big Drama will be sprinter

[Left Bank]

Shirreffs sure used the word "if" in that article a lot. I agree with Vic on HOY.If you beat her,how can you give it to her?Shirreffs doesn't understand the award is not for "doing good for the business".

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

goldikova..

[prudery]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

What does the morning have to do with it? There is a reason that riders warm horses up before a race. The fact is that when you dont warm up your horse on a cold day then you shouldnt be surprised when she is slow to get into the race. This is consistent from claiming horses to mythical horses.

I understand what warming horses up is . I am also a rider .

The morning comment had to do with your saying she had never been in 40 degree weather .

Feel free to disagee--and no one needs my permission here--but I believe the connections know the difference between hot and cold .

The mare was outside all day--she didn't come straight from a stall .

She was moving around all day and got to the post moving .

Perhaps you think the lack of a conventional gallop pre-race caused her to start slow, perhaps it did OR did not .

But you are not allowing the possibility that it didn't .

They know the horse and the temperature . They could have been wrong, as you or I could have ...

I live in New England . My riding horses get warmed up in ALL weather . If I ride in 12 degree weather extra precautions and a rug are used .

It was 40 .

I am not saying you don't have a point, but I am saying there are less conventional ways to warm up that may also work--everyone else stayed in their stalls before the walkover all day , and 40 degrees isn't arctic zone temp ..


Mythical horses don't need warmups--but you know that .

Nothing that went to the post yesterday was mythical, it was real flesh and blood thoroughbreds--at least to me .

[Indian Charlie]

You are from New England?

That does it, I'm going back to Cali.

[prudery]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

You are from New England?

That does it, I'm going back to Cali.

I am from NY, I live in New England .

Car service is available to Logan if you wish .

But disappointingly, one is never too far or close on the net...

[Princess Doreen]

The article doesn't state if Shirreffs was asked if Zenyatta was deserving of HOY. I'll bet he was. Was he supposed to have said, "NO"?

[randallscott35]

Another clown http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports...3758700.column

[Cannon Shell]

"The voting Turf Writers Assn. of America has a big responsibility here. If it accepts the argument that whichever horse wins the Breeders' Cup Classic is horse of the year, then it confirms that racing will always be a good-old-boy network, with the only thing that matters is what comes from, and happens, east of the Mississippi.

A vote that way also says that there isn't even consistency in the bias, since last year's Breeders' Cup Classic was won by Zenyatta, and she was second to Eastern horse Rachel Alexandra in the horse-of-the-year voting.

A vote for Zenyatta indicates recognition of her racing results and the positive intangibles she gave her sport."

oh boy...

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by monipenny

Voters are not always voting for the best horse this year broheim. The body of work that Zenyatta has compiled and being 3 1/2 lengths clear sends a clear ringing endorsement to how wonderful a racemare she is. Ok, I will agree Blame won and people usually only remember who wins the Super Bowl and not the runners up. But, horses just as actors winning academy awards are sometimes rewarded for there life's work. And this does not always reflect a horses or actors finest work with being given such a award. My hope was to see a great race and that I most certainly did.

Why would you need to agree that Blame won? Was there some question?

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by monipenny

Voters are not always voting for the best horse this year broheim. The body of work that Zenyatta has compiled and being 3 1/2 lengths clear sends a clear ringing endorsement to how wonderful a racemare she is. Ok, I will agree Blame won and people usually only remember who wins the Super Bowl and not the runners up. But, horses just as actors winning academy awards are sometimes rewarded for there life's work. And this does not always reflect a horses or actors finest work with being given such a award. My hope was to see a great race and that I most certainly did.

But that is what voters should be voting on. Which is why there really should be no discussion. The award is horse of the year. On the track this year Blame had a better year. End of story.

I understand that she is going to get votes, but she shouldn't.

[gaut10]

The horses dont care if they win the awards. We do. its just like funerals, we are the only ones who care what the funeral is like.

Blame defeated tougher fields all year b/c his connections allowed him to do so. she did not b/c her connections chose not too. Horse racing in California is soft b/c of bad decisions by CHRB.

its obvious the big mare has no problems competing with any level of horses. while it is the connections perrogative to manicure her campaign, it adds no ammunition to their HOY campaign. Could have been a moot point had she run at TOGA and/or Belmont in the fall.

fyi, i think she is fabulous mare, but I am not in favor of paper champions.

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

"The voting Turf Writers Assn. of America has a big responsibility here. If it accepts the argument that whichever horse wins the Breeders' Cup Classic is horse of the year, then it confirms that racing will always be a good-old-boy network, with the only thing that matters is what comes from, and happens, east of the Mississippi.

A vote that way also says that there isn't even consistency in the bias, since last year's Breeders' Cup Classic was won by Zenyatta, and she was second to Eastern horse Rachel Alexandra in the horse-of-the-year voting.

A vote for Zenyatta indicates recognition of her racing results and the positive intangibles she gave her sport."

oh boy...

Horrifying.

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Apparently it is a humanitarian award now. Maybe Bono should get it next year.

Well said.

Shirreffs' bevy of ludicrous quotes this year have been an absolute treasure trove of idiocy and insincerity. First there was the 'showcase her to the country' BS, then there was the daunting Rockies, then there was Rail Trip the highest mountain, then there was 'I'm not sending her to the Beldame because I'll have no way of keeping tabs on my other 7 horses on the west coast', then there was 'she should get HOY because she's Zenyatta'. I'm sure I'm forgetting a few. The guy has made a complete ass out of himself almost every time he's opened his mouth about her.

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by Merlinsky

Except it couldn't. She's still Queen Z, and she's still going in the Hall of Fame but he beat her fair and square in her only race in open company this year, and no, she didn't fly past him after the wire. He kept digging in. His nose stayed in front. People need to calm down about this award somehow being a lifetime achievement award. It's not. We already have awards for that.

It's a weird deflation to have after a finish like that. I guess it really does feel to a lot of people like when Birdstone beat Smarty Jones. I do wanna congratulate Claiborne Farm for an amazing accomplishment with a homebred in their 100th year. I hope they threw a bit party back at the farm. They seemed to feel a bit guilty over the win, and when something like this happens they deserve an opportunity to break out the champagne. Now I'm sure the party to be at involved Goldikova's connections. Freddie thinks Goldi's better than Miesque and he would know, as he's the one who rode her back in the day. Amazing mare.

Heck, Zenyatta deserves some champagne too. Someone go give Mike Smith a hug and an "it's not your fault" Good Will Hunting-style therapy session.

In private balloting, I give the POT award (Post-Of-Thread) to this one by Merlinsky. Very well said. I like the idea of those 3 camps breaking out the champagne.

The only part of the post I personally disagreed with was that the finish was deflating. I thought the finish was great--it would settle two questions and bring everyone together. It showed Zenyatta WAS a terrific mare regardless of who she raced against, while at the same time showing that she shouldn't be given HOY. I was definitely wrong on it bringing everyone together!

--Dunbar

[Princess Doreen]

Dwyre states in his article -

"At Churchill this year, one horse had to be put down after an accident Thursday and another during a Breeders' Cup race Saturday."

Did I miss something? I know Calvin Derailed jumped off Atta Boy Roy after the wire, but it was later stated that they couldn't find anything wrong with the horse.

Was there some other horse that was injured and put down?