Winter Memories

[richard]

Singletary comes to mind . King Cugat, Chester House, Riskaverse .

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by richard

Singletary comes to mind . King Cugat, Manndar, Chester House .

Manndar never even raced at age 2. Chester House didn't run in America until the BC Classic. King Cugat was beaten in both of his Graded Stakes tries on turf at age 2.

For every Singletary, Artie Schiller, Paradise Creek etc .. there's a lot of forgotten ones .. a few from the 90's that I had saved on my comp...

American Day:



Crypic Rascal:



Promontory Gold: (dam was Possibly Perfect)



Swamp:

[richard]

Correct on Manndar . In general your point that good turf horses peak later in their careers seems vaild .

[Dahoss]

Wow, I forgot all about Cryptic Rascal. He looked like the next coming of Lure early on.

[Indian Charlie]

American Day's (half to Best Pal) turf msw was one of the most awesome maiden wins I've ever seen.

It really was a thing of beauty, seeing him win that day. The two most recent that I would rate in the same ballpark would be Barbaro's and Indian Charlie's.

The latter two however, were debut performances.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

Wow, I forgot all about Cryptic Rascal. He looked like the next coming of Lure early on.

Didn't Billy Badgett train him?

[Indian Charlie]

Whatever happened to Promontory Gold?

I have seen no progeny from him.

[hockey2315]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Didn't Billy Badgett train him?

Yes

[Linny]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

When I tried to rate the best 2yo turf horses of both genders during the last decade - and the 90's - I was pretty surprised how so many of them didn't develop or improve all that much going forward. I probably considered 50 or 60 or so horses in total... so it was very surprising to me. A lot of them were close to forgotten horses.

Although, a small few of them did become very good dirt horses. Barbaro, Peace Rules, and Big Brown.

Interactif was outstanding in his first two turf races last year - and he's 1-for-7 this year with the lone win a nose victory in the Hall of Fame .. and that's pretty good maturation in relation to a lot of the others I considered.

Incurable Optimist was a very good grass 2yo. The much maligned Pioneer of the Nile was a nice grass 2yo as well.

[NoLuvForPletch]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

The configuration of the two courses led to the different paces as is always the case in 1 1/16 races on the two courses. As for things being theoretically deep inside....there is more proof the other way. The third finisher was down inside most of the way and the first two finishers are significantly better than the rest of the field. No disrespect to your horse, but the race was bet very strangely, and the winner should have been a MUCH shorter price.

As for Winter Memories, she's obviously a nice horse, and I'm happy for Jimmy Toner, but it's a little premature to crown her a future champion.

None taken. Based on pedigree, the 4 is a very nice horse. He did nothing on the racetrack that made him any better than DC.

His maiden breaker went in the same time, on the same course, with the same varient as our debut. I'm still trying to figure out how his Beyer was 6 pts higher?

WM is a lovely filly.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by NoLuvForPletch

None taken. Based on pedigree, the 4 is a very nice horse. He did nothing on the racetrack that made him any better than DC.

His maiden breaker went in the same time, on the same course, with the same varient as our debut. I'm still trying to figure out how his Beyer was 6 pts higher?

WM is a lovely filly.

Not true at all. His maiden win was a very impressive effort. He was close to an extremely fast pace and held off all the closers. Last time, in the With Anticipation, he was badly squeezed at the start, resulting in him actually being last very early, and still managed a respectable race.

I wish you extremely well with Dual Citizenship....but he has never run as well as the winner.

[iamthelurker]

I remember Swamp, he was fun to watch.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by iamthelurker

I remember Swamp, he was fun to watch.

Go to class.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Linny

Incurable Optimist was a very good grass 2yo. The much maligned Pioneer of the Nile was a nice grass 2yo as well.

IO was the one I considered best of the 90's.

PotN wasn't even under consideration. He was 1-for-2 on the turf - a 4th to Ninth Client and a one length win over Lime Rickey in a MSW ... both races with figures in the 70's. Hardly Incurable Optimist esque.

[VOL JACK]

Speaking of impressive debuts on grass.
affirmatif's was as good as it gets.
(As a 3yo)
Look at what a slug he's turned out to be.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by VOL JACK

Speaking of impressive debuts on grass.
affirmatif's was as good as it gets.
(As a 3yo)
Look at what a slug he's turned out to be.

But, and thankfully, people keep betting him.

[chucklestheclown]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

But, and thankfully, people keep betting him.

Didn't you tell them to?

[iamthelurker]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Go to class.

I really dont like when you say that.

[GPK]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

When I tried to rate the best 2yo turf horses of both genders during the last decade - and the 90's - I was pretty surprised how so many of them didn't develop or improve all that much going forward. I probably considered 50 or 60 or so horses in total... so it was very surprising to me. A lot of them were close to forgotten horses.

Although, a small few of them did become very good dirt horses. Barbaro, Peace Rules, and Big Brown.

Interactif was outstanding in his first two turf races last year - and he's 1-for-7 this year with the lone win a nose victory in the Hall of Fame .. and that's pretty good maturation in relation to a lot of the others I considered.

English Channel only raced 1 time as a 2YO. He turned out pretty decent after that.

[Clip-Clop]

Originally Posted by GPK

English Channel only raced 1 time as a 2YO. He turned out pretty decent after that.

He was the man.