7/10 (HOL): Hollywood Gold Cup & Triple Bend H. (G1's)

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

I do. They gain NOTHING by running her in that spot, assuming they're objective for coming back was Horse of the Year. They started the year with a two pronged path:

1) Beat the reigning Horse of the Year in OP
and/or
2 Win the Classic again

Since 1 fell through, circumstances beyond their control, they're left with 2.
Explain to me how beating Rail Trip or Richard's Kid helps her?

If she doesn't win the classic, she's not HOTY. If she doesn't do the Classic and wins the GC, she's not HOTY. See a pattern?

So you've bought into the whole "Classic or die" mantra that the Moss/Shirreffs/Zenyatta gang has propagated now. I would have thought that someone with the appreciation of racing you have would recognize that a campaign pointed towards one race doesn't necessarily have to include the easiest stops along the way. When dealing with a seemingly great horse, why take the easy road with 6-7 week (or more) breaks? I blame Pletcher as much as anyone for doing it too.

I can tell you this much, if she was running in races like the GC and Pacific Classic and winning them, a 2nd place finish in the BCC with an upset from a new shooter would still equal a HOTY. You still have to try to build a resume to some extent. One that goes a bit beyond the Vanity and Hirsch IMO.

NT

[the_fat_man]

So, your argument, now, is that a 6 year old mare needs to put in her most ambitious year of racing to date, then, turn in a good showing in the GC, to get HOTY. If she were my horse and I had your option on #2 above, I'd go with #2 every time. I'm pretty sure, under those circumstances, you'd go for #2 as well. This horse has done enough, IMO. Keep her fit and try dirt at CD.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

So, your argument, now, is that a 6 year old mare needs to put in her most ambitious year of racing to date, then, turn in a good showing in the GC, to get HOTY. If she were my horse and I had your option on #2 above, I'd go with #2 every time. I'm pretty sure, under those circumstances, you'd go for #2 as well. This horse has done enough, IMO. Keep her fit and try dirt at CD.

So because they've put her through similarly weak and unimaginative campaigns pre-BC in the last two years it's OK for them to do it again?

If she were my horse we would have logged so many frequent flier miles I'd practically own Tex Sutton. Clearly, I wouldn't have been afraid to lose.

NT

[Indian Charlie]

Wasn't that long ago, really, when the Z connections were almost certain they weren't running in the Classic last year. Now? Now it's the end all.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

So, your argument, now, is that a 6 year old mare needs to put in her most ambitious year of racing to date, then, turn in a good showing in the GC, to get HOTY. If she were my horse and I had your option on #2 above, I'd go with #2 every time. I'm pretty sure, under those circumstances, you'd go for #2 as well. This horse has done enough, IMO. Keep her fit and try dirt at CD.

lol
she's 6, not 16. 17 whole races under her belt...yeah, she's used up. when is she going to get started on her most ambitious year? there's no reason she can't take on males in a race other than the classic...surely you don't subscribe to the 'mares shouldn't take on males' theory? you don't think she'd run harder because it's out of her usual sex? she sure didn't look done in after the classic. besides, the classic alone didn't get her HOY last year, i doubt it alone gets her that this year either.

[Duvalier]

Zenyatta's not in either of these races. Why make every f'kn thread about Zenyatta or Rachel? Same people over and over.

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by Duvalier

Zenyatta's not in either of these races.

Isn't that the main complaint?

[Port Conway Lane]

She barely squeaks out a win in the Vanity against a horse who was trounced by males in her previous start and she is supposed to run in the Gold Cup against the best male in California. Makes sense.

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by Port Conway Lane

She barely squeaks out a win in the Vanity against a horse who was trounced by males in her previous start and she is supposed to run in the Gold Cup against the best male in California. Makes sense.

So you're saying she is clearly not the best horse in training?

[nomad]

Originally Posted by Port Conway Lane

She barely squeaks out a win in the Vanity against a horse who was trounced by males in her previous start and she is supposed to run in the Gold Cup against the best male in California. Makes sense.

you've got to be kidding

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by Danzig

lol
she's 6, not 16. 17 whole races under her belt...yeah, she's used up. when is she going to get started on her most ambitious year? there's no reason she can't take on males in a race other than the classic...surely you don't subscribe to the 'mares shouldn't take on males' theory? you don't think she'd run harder because it's out of her usual sex? she sure didn't look done in after the classic. besides, the classic alone didn't get her HOY last year, i doubt it alone gets her that this year either.

The Fat Man is just issuing a double bind here while trying to play both sides of the fence at the same time.

Zenyatta shouldn't run against Rail Trip because he's not important and beating him does nothing for her in regards to Horse Of The Year. At the same time, she shouldn't run against Rail Trip because he makes the Hollywood Gold Cup too ambitious a spot for her on the road (Easy Street?) towards HOY.

Maybe we should call him "The Fat Man With No Name" with all the spaghetti western posturing he does around here.

Better get a few coffins ready...