Eskendereya: 109 BSF for Wood

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

I did not think that track was slow today, 1:50 is avg for the Wood. Both 8550 and WR broke 1:22 at 7 panels...I'm not buying 109. Sorry

How do you explain the 1:51.43 in the Excelsior?

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

How do you explain the 1:51.43 in the Excelsior?

Very slow horses. More than a reason, are you serious?

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Very slow horses. More than a reason, are you serious?

Am I serious? Eskendereya ran almost 1.5 seconds faster than them. How low do you want to make the Excelsior figure? As bad as the field was, the top three finishers were still running 95-100s coming into the race.

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Am I serious? Eskendereya ran almost 1.5 seconds faster than them. How low do you want to make the Excelsior figure? As bad as the field was, the top three finishers were still running 95-100s coming into the race.

Beyers are for clowns. 88

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Beyers are for clowns. 88

Who are those numbers (the ones you totally pull out of your ass) for?

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Who are those numbers (the ones you totally pull out of your ass) for?

Excell

[MisterB]

I would think that performance was just what the doctor ordered 4 weeks out from the Derby. What will he run when asked? Looked like a Sunday morning work out.

[johnny pinwheel]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Beyers are for clowns. 88

i agree. Eskendereya loped around three wide behind a pace where no pressure was felt what so ever. the rider could of had the lead at any time. only one horse made a move (awesome act) and he came up with absolutely nothing at the end. they can give him a 109 , a 115 or a 120 for that matter. the horse might as well of been working out. this horse has not had to run hard yet this year. put him in there with 19 other horses with a couple that have nothing to lose when they go 46 to the half and it could be a whole new ball game. break out the bandwagon because i smell 8 to 5 coming....lol. i wish they gave him a 120 as if these numbers ever prove a thing. 24, 49, 1:13.5 and 1:37.7...oh yeah, he was flying...give me a break.

[Travis Stone]

Everyone also loves to dangle Pletcher's record but how many of those horses were hopeless? Keyed Entry, Join In the Dance (who ran okay considering), Wild Horses etc. And he's outperformed with a lot of them as well based on odds (Limehouse, Bluegrass Cat)... it just takes the right horse at the right time, and is not a reflection of his abilities as a trainer.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

Everyone also loves to dangle Pletcher's record but how many of those horses were hopeless? Keyed Entry, Join In the Dance (who ran okay considering), Wild Horses etc. And he's outperformed with a lot of them as well based on odds (Limehouse, Bluegrass Cat)... it just takes the right horse at the right time, and is not a reflection of his abilities as a trainer.

There were also a lot that weren't considered "hopeless" going in to the Derby and underperformed expectations. When you have a stable the size of Pletcher's, during most of the year, you have the luxury of picking your spots with your horses. For the Triple Crown and Breeders' Cup, you don't get that luxury. Given that fact, I think it's hard to say that his rather dismal record on the big days does not reflect on his operation's performance, especially when he seems to have almost all of the well-heeled owners who are specifically looking for success on those days.

[pointman]

Originally Posted by johnny pinwheel

i agree. Eskendereya loped around three wide behind a pace where no pressure was felt what so ever. the rider could of had the lead at any time. only one horse made a move (awesome act) and he came up with absolutely nothing at the end. they can give him a 109 , a 115 or a 120 for that matter. the horse might as well of been working out. this horse has not had to run hard yet this year. put him in there with 19 other horses with a couple that have nothing to lose when they go 46 to the half and it could be a whole new ball game. break out the bandwagon because i smell 8 to 5 coming....lol. i wish they gave him a 120 as if these numbers ever prove a thing. 24, 49, 1:13.5 and 1:37.7...oh yeah, he was flying...give me a break.

What more did you want him to do yesterday? The horse rated perfectly, exploded when asked and destroyed his competition yesterday. Regardless of price, he proved that as of right now he is the most likely winner of the Derby. Maybe he hasn't had to run hard because of his tactical speed and he is just that much better than what he has faced. Right now, I don't see anything that appears to be better than him. Of course, there are still four weeks until the Derby and a lot can change between now and then, but it is hard to argue that there is a better 3 year old out there than him at the moment.

[Travis Stone]

Originally Posted by pointman

What more did you want him to do yesterday? The horse rated perfectly, exploded when asked and destroyed his competition yesterday. Regardless of price, he proved that as of right now he is the most likely winner of the Derby. Maybe he hasn't had to run hard because of his tactical speed and he is just that much better than what he has faced. Right now, I don't see anything that appears to be better than him. Of course, there are still four weeks until the Derby and a lot can change between now and then, but it is hard to argue that there is a better 3 year old out there than him at the moment.

There isn't. No one has come close to the two performances he's posted. Now, the best horse doesn't always win the Derby (see Point Given in a long list), but no other 3-year-old has shown what Eskendereya has shown in his FOY win and Wood score.

[dylbert]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Beyers are for clowns. 88

Are you suffering from Dale Earnhart Jr. withdrawal on this NASCAR-less Sunday? Hence, the "88"...

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by dylbert

Are you suffering from Dale Earnhart Jr. withdrawal on this NASCAR-less Sunday? Hence, the "88"...

Haha. I don't understand the Nascar appeal. Unless you are actually in the race, I can't see being a spectator.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Am I serious? Eskendereya ran almost 1.5 seconds faster than them. How low do you want to make the Excelsior figure? As bad as the field was, the top three finishers were still running 95-100s coming into the race.

Isn't the explanation here the slow paces in both the Excelsior and the Wood? The final time of both races seemed a little slow for how the track was overall playing yesterday.

Eskendereya was very impressive, especially in comparison to the slow come home time for the Excelsior, but both of these races were contested in the manner that we often see in turf/synthetic races and result in final figures slower than the actual performance may warrant.

[JJP]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

Isn't the explanation here the slow paces in both the Excelsior and the Wood? The final time of both races seemed a little slow for how the track was overall playing yesterday.

Eskendereya was very impressive, especially in comparison to the slow come home time for the Excelsior, but both of these races were contested in the manner that we often see in turf/synthetic races and result in final figures slower than the actual performance may warrant.

It seems like there was a number of slow paced prep races. Horses like Sidneys Candy, American Lion, Discreetly Mine and others who were aided by slow paces are going to find the going much more difficult at Churchill. Not to take anything away from Eskendereya but in that GP stake, he clearly was aided by a slow pace, and he was close to another slow pace again yesterday. He might win at CD but will probably be overbet.

[Travis Stone]

Don't get too hung-up on this number. Regardless of whether or not it's 101, 109 or 119, Eskendereya posted an effort out there that no one in this crop has come close to.

[packerbacker7964]

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

Don't get too hung-up on this number. Regardless of whether or not it's 101, 109 or 119, Eskendereya posted an effort out there that no one in this crop has come close to.

see post #25

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by packerbacker7964

see post #25

People said the same thing about Frankel in the BC, about geldings winning the Derby and about NY breds winning the Derby. The history is damning but I've always thought it's only a matter of time for Pletcher.

NT

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Very slow horses. More than a reason, are you serious?

More Than A Reason ran a negative 1.5 last out on your numbers, TG .. and he had run a 1.50 or better in 4 of his last 5 races.

Esk will get a pretty huge sheet number because it's baked in that he carried 123lbs and was 3 wide on the turns.