Standard and Poor's downgrades US to AA+

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Clip-Clop

Does anyone else in this discussion employ people?

Yes. But not illegals and undocumented workers as your projects do.

[jms62]

Market just shat itself again/

[Riot]

Originally Posted by joeydb

Or is it more likely, due to the uniformity of their action, that the conditions for making profit here in the United States was comprimised by unions and high labor rates, high taxes, excessive regulation, and the like?

Nope. They made plenty of profit. Our economy has boomed for years. They just wanted more.

Greed would be the pursuit of excessive profit, right? But stable and substantial profits at some level must be made if a company is to stay in business.

How much in taxes did the Top Ten richest companies in the United States pay last year, Joey? There are many charts and news articles - just google and post it here.

[joeydb]

Originally Posted by jms62

Clueless....

How is that strategy of "Moving Work where it is profitable" working out for the economy now Joey?

If the company is still here, and wouldn't have been otherwise, I guess it worked for that company.

Originally Posted by jms62

How is it working out for the housing recovery Joey?

The housing bubble was started from the mandated lending to otherwise unqualified buyers, directed by the government through the Community Reinvestment Act.

Originally Posted by jms62

High Taxes Joey? Most pay NONE...

They must forward the taxes - now as far as them paying none, you're correct in that most companies will not take a hit on profit to pay a levied tax, so that means the price of the product would have to go up. If that company thinks that the new price to pay the new tax would be noncompetitive with, say, a company outside the country not having to pay the tax, they're going to move.

Originally Posted by jms62

Corporations have a duty to employ citizens of the country in which they operate.

No they don't. They have a duty to their shareholders and the customers buying their products.

[Clip-Clop]

Originally Posted by Riot

Yes. But not illegals and undocumented workers as your projects do.

I have no control over the contractors that work on the same projects I work on. They hire the way they feel they need to. As for my company, we have hired 5 people all Americans and college graduates (crazy right?) in the last 16 months all while the sky is falling.
Perhaps cream rises to the top.
Glad your business is able to help out too!

[Riot]

Originally Posted by wiphan

At least they didn't say they were going to print more $.....

If the Republicans won't allow any stimulus/job creation, then all the fed has left is allowing inflation to creep up.

That's is the joke of this fake "we're going broke! We can't pay our bills!" discussion - we are a sovereign nation. We could always print all the money we want to pay off every bill we have.

Yes, we have to rein in spending. But it's not the ridiculous crisis the right has made it out to be for the past month, just to screw Obama.

[Clip-Clop]

Originally Posted by jms62

The difference is they knew when the economy turned around the jobs would come back... We don't have that today.. Too many people for far too few jobs. London is our future and it will happen sooner rather than later.

I am with you on the too many people and the likely hood of London type behaviors finding their way around. What is it that makes you think that jobs will never return? You seem like a reasonable person and I am actually curious and happy to hear and debate your opinions.
Also what would be your plan for creation of jobs?
It has to fall on the private sector one way or another, no?

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Clip-Clop

Grandparents for me actually. FDR was dealing with a completely different economic scenario and breed of American than we have today. The sense of entitlement that has imprinted itself on the psyche of the modern resident of this country is absolutely embarrassing.

Yes, it extends to the very richest of our nation wanting to live in this great country, while trying to get very single penny they can out of the economy, and screw anyone else. Especially the poor, the have nots, the hungery.

The rich are having a very bad time ... they have hoarded most of the money in the economy, 1.2 Trillion dollars. That means there is no money left for the other 90% to purchase their goods and services.

Of course, if your job is to make money by gambling (Wall Street) which way the country goes doesn't matter, as you can make as much money in the destruction of an empire as you can during the creation.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by jms62

Market just shat itself again/

Don't forget they all shorted, and were profit-taking last few days, too.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Riot

So you're sticking with, "If we just kicked them off unemployment, they'd find jobs".

If only that unemployed, $60,000 a year IT technologist would get a job trimming your hedges! If only they would take the jobs of the undocumented farm workers and construction workers.

How unbelievably naive.

I'm sorry but if that 60k per year IT worker cant find a job working IT, but can find a job trimming hedges. That is what he/she should do, while he/she continues to look for a job in IT.

whats the alternative? dont work and collect tax payer funded unemployment?

How unbelievably ignorant.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Clip-Clop

If your chosen profession is no longer available you adapt. I am not saying that everyone should or can work in construction or a field. I am saying that people need to get off their high horses about the job that is good enough for them and suck it up. I can guarantee if I needed the work and were willing to sacrifice enough to work at McDonald's, I am coming away with that job and I am going to impress and show up and collect my pay after working hard for the week. It comes down to motivation and a willingness to do something "beneath" you in order to survive. Not waiting around for someone else to take care of you. More people needed to grow up poor, this way they would be better equipped to handle it when it happened to them.

personal responsibility. nobody wants that.

[Clip-Clop]

Originally Posted by Riot

Yes, it extends to the very richest of our nation wanting to live in this great country, while trying to get very single penny they can out of the economy, and screw anyone else. Especially the poor, the have nots, the hungery.

The rich are having a very bad time ... they have hoarded most of the money in the economy, 1.2 Trillion dollars. That means there is no money left for the other 90% to purchase their goods and services.

Of course, if your job is to make money by gambling (Wall Street) which way the country goes doesn't matter, as you can make as much money in the destruction of an empire as you can during the creation.

I made no distinction about who has this sense.
I am glad to know you are doing as much to help the poor and indigent in this country. I am certain you are volunteering your time and money to help.
Or does that responsibility fall on the "wealthy" too?

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

I'm sorry but if that 60k per year IT worker cant find a job working IT, but can find a job trimming hedges. That is what he/she should do, while he/she continues to look for a job in IT.

whats the alternative? dont work and collect tax payer funded unemployment?

How unbelievably ignorant.

Of course they should take any job they could get (and afford to live upon - even if it takes two jobs) - but those jobs are not available. They are not existent. There are not millions of jobs sitting there empty, unfilled because the lazy unemployed class won't take them.

How unbelievably ignorant.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Clip-Clop

I made no distinction about who has this sense.
I am glad to know you are doing as much to help the poor and indigent in this country. I am certain you are volunteering your time and money to help.
Or does that responsibility fall on the "wealthy" too?

Do you work in commercial construction or houses/apartments? I'd guess commercial. If not, I'd like to know where private housing is thriving in multiple states right now.

See, here's the agreement in our country, according to our founding fathers, and our Constitution and Bill of Rights: we all contribute to our common society, through taxes, to our common national welfare. And even if we don't like something ... wars, or welfare ... the deal is that you have a say through the ballot box, but when you are on the losing side, you still have to do it. So everyone in this country has a responsibility to contribute. The first contribution is being an informed voter.

[wiphan]

Originally Posted by Riot

If the Republicans won't allow any stimulus/job creation, then all the fed has left is allowing inflation to creep up.

That's is the joke of this fake "we're going broke! We can't pay our bills!" discussion - we are a sovereign nation. We could always print all the money we want to pay off every bill we have.

Yes, we have to rein in spending. But it's not the ridiculous crisis the right has made it out to be for the past month, just to screw Obama.

your inability to understand reality is quite funny. You have no clue on inflation, stimulus, fed policy,etc. Sorry I have to get back to work. 10 yr T note just hit all time low and it is time to make some $.

[Clip-Clop]

Originally Posted by Riot

Do you work in commercial construction or houses/apartments?

Primarily single family homes but we do work in the occasional multi-dwelling and rarer still in commercial.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by wiphan

your inability to understand reality is quite funny. You have no clue on inflation, stimulus, fed policy,etc. Sorry I have to get back to work. 10 yr T note just hit all time low and it is time to make some $.

Really? Do you have anything constructive to offer regarding the Feds options, or just want to be snarky? You want to talk about the Feds announcement (or lack of it) that there will be no QE3, that they are not doing anything? Or just wanna be snarky?

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Clip-Clop

Primarily single family homes but we do work in the occasional multi-dwelling and rarer still in commercial.

Seriously - where are single family homes being built right now? Where is housing growth?

[Clip-Clop]

Originally Posted by Riot

Do you work in commercial construction or houses/apartments? I'd guess commercial. If not, I'd like to know where private housing is thriving in multiple states right now.

See, here's the agreement in our country, according to our founding fathers, and our Constitution and Bill of Rights: we all contribute to our common society, through taxes, to our common national welfare. And even if we don't like something ... wars, or welfare ... the deal is that you have a say through the ballot box, but when you are on the losing side, you still have to do it. So everyone in this country has a responsibility to contribute. The first contribution is being an informed voter.

Private home building is thriving in CO, LA, GA, IN, NH, FL (only larger homes), AZ, CA (not southern). Those are where the majority of my projects are.
Informed voter has become an oxymoron.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Clip-Clop

Private home building is thriving in CO, LA, GA, IN, NH, FL (only larger homes), AZ, CA (not southern). Those are where the majority of my projects are.
Informed voter has become an oxymoron.

Indiana surprises me. Where? Central? In association with the wind farms?

AZ isn't going to have any water. I can't believe they are still building there.