Is This Really the Best We Have?

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The more horseracing becomes a "business", the less joy there is in it, for fans and competitors alike. When people that are worth hundreds of millions of dollars retire horses because "they have residual value" or "nothing left to prove" you are heading down the wrong path. The biggest problem with expensive and talented horses is that the connections are afraid to lose. It is the biggest difference between racing now and 20 years ago. One of the reasons that the Pletchers of the world "space " so much is to try to find the softest spot possible, to try to keep the horses and his personal record intact. Not that I blame them, because they are playing by the rules that the owners and breeders have set. Breeders lowered their standards in the late 70's to early 80's to produce more horses to keep up with the first bloodstock boom. In doing so they accepted more flawed horses, soundness, bleeding, conformation, etc. Now with huge stallion books that problem is even greater but the bloodstock machine which sucks in hundreds of millions of dollars per year needs to continue to be fed. So a filly that has a race record of 2 wins in 4 starts is bred to a stallion that made nine starts and the market will continue to buy those types of horses.

Sorry to sound so pessimistic but horseracing is really becoming a soulless "sport"

This is exactly the way I feel. I couldn't have written it better myself. And the best part in it was when u said "not that I blame them". It's hard to blame them but that doesn't mean we have to like it.

[SniperSB23]

The only idea I have ever heard that could help solve the problem is to not allow any horse to stand stud until they were 5 years old. Unfortunately there is about as good a chance of that happening as there was for Bluegrass Cat running as a 4yo.

[Gander]

This is the only meaningful post on this thread. Thanks Merasq!

this thread has not helped my hangover one bit...i find myself agreeing with king g AND dixie in the space of 5 minutes and my head is spinning (but if sun king is a sprinter u better gettahold of zito asap )-later gaters

[jpops757]

Originally Posted by Betsy

Mike has to explain also why Teammate is not in his top 10 for 3 year old fillies, even though she's finished good 2nd twice to Pine Island in the Alabama and Gazelle.

Last I saw he had at 7.

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

The only idea I have ever heard that could help solve the problem is to not allow any horse to stand stud until they were 5 years old. Unfortunately there is about as good a chance of that happening as there was for Bluegrass Cat running as a 4yo.

Agree completely, Sniper. Restricting breeding is not unheard of. They do not allow artificial insemination, for example. Yet whenever the idea of restricting breeding until a horse is 5 is brought up, people say it wouldn't be fair to the owners/breeders. Meanwhile, the sport seems to be in a downward spiral that will eventually do in the owners/breeders anyway. Or maybe it will be reduced to the sheiks racing against each other in the deserts of the Middle East.

--Dunbar

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

This is exactly the way I feel. I couldn't have written it better myself. And the best part in it was when u said "not that I blame them". It's hard to blame them but that doesn't mean we have to like it.

I know a lot of blame is placed on trainers and though I have to admit I may be a bit biased the problem really lies with the owners. All these huge syndication deals and high profile yearling and 2 year old prices has many owners with stars in their eyes.

Quick story. Friend of mine has been the business as an owner on a serious level for 3 years. Says to me the other day "You know what my goal is in horseracing? Sell one of those 3 million dollar yearlings." I said to him what happened to trying to win big races and having fun. He said "I cant compete with the Arabs or Pletcher's owners, but maybe I could sell them an expensive horse". I told him that sounds more like horse breeding than horse racing.
The moral of the story is that this guy and many other owners are trying to come up with valuble breeding stock rather than racehorses. And the way the game is played, racing them once they have accomplished something, even one graded win or placing(with mares) is just too risky to their way of thinking.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

I don't think that is his point. Watchmaker has a separate list for sprinters and for turf horses. This list is more intended for older males in the dirt routing division.

ahh, i see. thanks!!

[Betsy]

Originally Posted by jpops757

Last I saw he had at 7.

Did he? Thanks for pointing that out -I checked a few days ago, and she wasn't on there.

Betsy she was added right after she ran 2nd to Pine island for the 2nd time in the Gazelle. You can't really blame him for not having her in there after her dreadful efforts in the Acorn and CCA. She still hasn't won a grade one either. But putting her in last week at #7 was quite proper in light of her back to back 2nd place finishes in grade ones.

[Pedigree Ann]

THe Blood-horse free handicap for older males of 1981 (at 10f) compiled by F.E. Kilroe (turf horses deleted):

129-John Henry
127-Flying Paster
123-Temperence Hill
122-Eleven Stitches
122-Tahitian King
121-Super Moment
121-Tunerup
120-Amber Pass
120-Irish Tower
120-Wickerr

This is not a new complaint. Wickerr won a G2 and a listed race on dirt; Irish Tower won 2 G3s and a listed race, but was second in the Met Mile. Tunerup hadn't even won a stakes race, but had been second in a G1 and a G2. Finding a top 10 isn't easy in many years.

[SniperSB23]

This would be my list:

1 - Invasor
2 - Lava Man
3 - Sun King
4 - Brass Hat
5- Wanderin Boy
6 - Surf Cat
7 - Premium Tap
8 - Suave
9 - Second of June
10 - Magnum