Nice Pick-4 payoffs with the 4% takeout at Ellis

[Dunbar]

To see the power of a 4% takeout, just take a look at yesterday's 4% Pick-4 at Ellis.

The winners of races 8-11 paid $10.80, $5.00, $12.00, $22.80.

What if Saratoga's 25% Pick-4 takeout had been in effect at Ellis? Then yesterday's $1 Pick-4 payoff would have been $1071. But with the 4% takeout, it paid $1371, not $1071. That extra $300 (an extra 28% profit) is what the 4% takeout brings to the game.

IMO, anyone who is not betting the Ellis Pick-4 is:
(1) missing out on what at the moment is the best bet in racing, and
(2) missing out on a chance to help the future of race betting, and therefore, the sport itself.

--Dunbar

[whodey17]

Originally Posted by Dunbar

To see the power of a 4% takeout, just take a look at yesterday's 4% Pick-4 at Ellis.

The winners of races 8-11 paid $10.80, $5.00, $12.00, $22.80.

What if Saratoga's 25% Pick-4 takeout had been in effect at Ellis? Then yesterday's $1 Pick-4 payoff would have been $1071. But with the 4% takeout, it paid $1371, not $1071. That extra $300 (an extra 28% profit) is what the 4% takeout brings to the game.

IMO, anyone who is not betting the Ellis Pick-4 is:
(1) missing out on what at the moment is the best bet in racing, and
(2) missing out on a chance to help the future of race betting, and therefore, the sport itself.

--Dunbar

Couldnt agree more. Good example as well.

[smuthg]

Originally Posted by Dunbar

To see the power of a 4% takeout, just take a look at yesterday's 4% Pick-4 at Ellis.

The winners of races 8-11 paid $10.80, $5.00, $12.00, $22.80.

What if Saratoga's 25% Pick-4 takeout had been in effect at Ellis? Then yesterday's $1 Pick-4 payoff would have been $1071. But with the 4% takeout, it paid $1371, not $1071. That extra $300 (an extra 28% profit) is what the 4% takeout brings to the game.

IMO, anyone who is not betting the Ellis Pick-4 is:
(1) missing out on what at the moment is the best bet in racing, and
(2) missing out on a chance to help the future of race betting, and therefore, the sport itself.

--Dunbar

or, in my case (3) stuck in a state (e.g. Missouri) that hates horse racing and bans account wagering.

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by smuthg

or, in my case (3) stuck in a state (e.g. Missouri) that hates horse racing and bans account wagering.

That sucks. I'm able to access my Penn National OTB acct's 800# using my cell phone. Not sure if the 800# would work if I was forced to call from a Missouri (or some other regressive state's) land line. In fact, I'm in Hawaii right now, a state with no gambling options, if I remember correctly.

--Dunbar

[Scav]

Have the pools continue to grow with this? I have no opportunity to play unless I go to the OTB, then I will be playing.....

[SniperSB23]

I've been playing it every morning to get my free past performances on Brisbet. Figure there is no better place for my money to be going.

[SentToStud]

Originally Posted by Scav

Have the pools continue to grow with this? I have no opportunity to play unless I go to the OTB, then I will be playing.....

They're getting $45,000 or so on Saturdays. Which is real good.

On Saturday:

Track / Total Handle / Late p-4 handle

Arlington / 6.3 mil / $55k
Ellis / 2.8 mil / $47k

[SniperSB23]

Seriously though, with 4% takeout they should really be able to get this thing up to $100,000 on weekends. You have to be crazy to not be putting your money into this pool. The results have hardly been unpredictable either.

[SentToStud]

Originally Posted by Cardus

That's a great comparison point. I didn't know how to relate its growth in terms other than comparing where it started to where it is today, and how it relates to its pools of other years.

What Ellis needs to do is run on Mondays and Tuesdays. They'd do well against Delaware and Philadelphia. Hell, even Delaware handles $20k on their p-4. Don't see why Ellis doesn't run those days when the competition is softer.

[gamblin4ever]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Seriously though, with 4% takeout they should really be able to get this thing up to $100,000 on weekends. You have to be crazy to not be putting your money into this pool. The results have hardly been unpredictable either.

I agree, but some players @ the place i go prefer to play the big tracks(Ap,Sar,Delmar)than play where they get better bang for their money.
I at least play the PK4 @ Ellis even if i don't play any other race there.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by gamblin4ever

I agree, but some players @ the place i go prefer to play the big tracks(Ap,Sar,Delmar)than play where they get better bang for their money.
I at least play the PK4 @ Ellis even if i don't play any other race there.

Next time they hit a P4 at one of those places give them the figure of how much they would have made for that exact same P4 at Ellis. Then see if they change their mind.

[dr. fager]

With the Claiming Crown there this weekend, pools should be at their best too I think Saturday. Although I don't know what kind of handle this brings in.

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Seriously though, with 4% takeout they should really be able to get this thing up to $100,000 on weekends. You have to be crazy to not be putting your money into this pool. The results have hardly been unpredictable either.

I agree with this emphatically. Yet today's pool was an embarrassing $25,000. I say "embarrassing", because I find it embarrassing that the best bet in horseracing can only attract $25,053 worth of bets. Hell, my bet was 1/70th of the entire pool! Aren't there at least a couple hundred horseplayers in the entire country willing to pump some money into this pool?

Is any track going to think about lowering take when Ellis draws a whopping 25,000 with it's 4%?

btw, today's payoff on a 50c ticket was $6,012. Not bad for $23.80, $6.20, $14, $18.40. A 50c parlay would have paid $1188. The Pick-4 paid more than 5 times as much as the parlay.

--Dunbar

[10 pnt move up]

Originally Posted by Dunbar

I agree with this emphatically. Yet today's pool was an embarrassing $25,000. I say "embarrassing", because I find it embarrassing that the best bet in horseracing can only attract $25,053 worth of bets. Hell, my bet was 1/70th of the entire pool! Aren't there at least a couple hundred horseplayers in the entire country willing to pump some money into this pool?

Is any track going to think about lowering take when Ellis draws a whopping 25,000 with it's 4%?

btw, today's payoff on a 50c ticket was $6,012. Not bad for $23.80, $6.20, $14, $18.40. A 50c parlay would have paid $1188. The Pick-4 paid more than 5 times as much as the parlay.

--Dunbar

most horse players cant even figure out the parlays or know what they mean, you post while spot on is probably greek to alot of people.

[gamblin4ever]

For most horseplayers to realize the benefit of Ellis, one of the big 3(Churchill,NYRA,& Magna) will have to reduce takeout.
Magna will have reduced takeout (14%) when Laurel starts their meet. Hopefully players will start to see the increased payout from Laurel and start looking @ Ellis.

If the Laurel meet is sucessful maybe Magna will make the change @ all their tracks,hopefully.

Of course most players like to bet tracks where the better quality horses are,IMO

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by gamblin4ever

For most horseplayers to realize the benefit of Ellis, one of the big 3(Churchill,NYRA,& Magna) will have to reduce takeout.
Magna will have reduced takeout (14%) when Laurel starts their meet. Hopefully players will start to see the increased payout from Laurel and start looking @ Ellis.

If the Laurel meet is sucessful maybe Magna will make the change @ all their tracks,hopefully.

Of course most players like to bet tracks where the better quality horses are,IMO

If Ellis is not successful, I don't think Laurel will be successful. The impact of an 11% takeout, while important, is not nearly as dramatic as a 4% takeout. If horseplayers are not flocking to Ellis's 4% pick-4, they are hardly going to notice Laurel.

Horseplayers who are genuinly interested in the future of the sport from a betting perspective should be playing the Ellis 4% even if they have no interest in that track or those particular horses.

Every $100 you bet at Ellis is a $4 investment in future lower takeout. That's all it will cost you in the long run, even if you throw darts at the PP's.

--Dunbar

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Dunbar

If Ellis is not successful, I don't think Laurel will be successful. The impact of an 11% takeout, while important, is not nearly as dramatic as a 4% takeout. If horseplayers are not flocking to Ellis's 4% pick-4, they are hardly going to notice Laurel.

Horseplayers who are genuinly interested in the future of the sport from a betting perspective should be playing the Ellis 4% even if they have no interest in that track or those particular horses.

Every $100 you bet at Ellis is a $4 investment in future lower takeout. That's all it will cost you in the long run, even if you throw darts at the PP's.

--Dunbar

I threw darts at the entries last week and thanks to scratches hit it 4 times (for 50 cents) on a $4 ticket.

[philcski]

Originally Posted by Dunbar

If Ellis is not successful, I don't think Laurel will be successful. The impact of an 11% takeout, while important, is not nearly as dramatic as a 4% takeout. If horseplayers are not flocking to Ellis's 4% pick-4, they are hardly going to notice Laurel.

Horseplayers who are genuinly interested in the future of the sport from a betting perspective should be playing the Ellis 4% even if they have no interest in that track or those particular horses.

Every $100 you bet at Ellis is a $4 investment in future lower takeout. That's all it will cost you in the long run, even if you throw darts at the PP's.

--Dunbar

The response has been tremendous- they have been averaging almost 3X the old pools, not to mention more exposure in the other pools.

Hopefully Laurel gets the same.

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by philcski

The response has been tremendous- they have been averaging almost 3X the old pools, not to mention more exposure in the other pools.

Hopefully Laurel gets the same.

I hope they are happy with that 3X, Phil. I find the numbers uninspiring. My $300-$400 bets are 1 to 1.5% of the pool, and I don't even like betting Pick-4s. In fact, I don't think I've ever bet a Pick-4 before this 4% takeout.

There was over $20 million bet on horseracing in the US yesterday. Those bets were all made into pools with 15% to 25% or more takeout. But the one bet which could have a dramatic impact on the future of betting could only attract $36,970 worth of interest. I think some of that other $19.96 million could have been better spent on the 4% Pick-4.

--Dunbar