My theory and feelings on Polytrack

[kentuckyrosesinmay]

[quote=Cunningham Racing]A) I am one who believes that horse shoes hurt horses and their health more than they help horses - so that isn't the best analogy to use with me because I agree..
QUOTE]

Ah, now we're talking sense. Yes, they make them prone to sore soles later on because going barefoot toughens their soles. Plus, you have to worry about farriers quicking your horse, loose shoes, shoes coming off (which can badly damage their hoof wall), and farriers doing a bad job that inevitably throws your horse off-balance possibly creating soundness issues.

Of course, shoes definitely serve their purpose though in helping diseases such as laminitis and navicular. Also, corrective shoeing helps horses with faulty conformation or bad movement. However, like in the case of my horse, shoes may have been his demise. He has sore soles probably due to shoeing (I can't train him or show him at some of those big horse complexes with paved roads and gravel driveways around the stable). Now, I have to get $100 padded shoes put on him every five weeks. We tried going barefoot and putting him on jello and other supplements and Freezex to toughen up his feet for months, but it didn't work. Our last resort was padded gel shoes. He's actually as sound as can be now.

[Cajungator26]

[quote=kentuckyrosesinmay]

Originally Posted by Cunningham Racing

A) I am one who believes that horse shoes hurt horses and their health more than they help horses - so that isn't the best analogy to use with me because I agree..
QUOTE]

Ah, now we're talking sense. Yes, they make them prone to sore soles later on because going barefoot toughens their soles. Plus, you have to worry about farriers quicking your horse, loose shoes, shoes coming off (which can badly damage their hoof wall), and farriers doing a bad job that inevitably throws your horse off-balance possibly creating soundness issues.

Unfortunately, we ask so much out of performance horses that their soles literally can't handle the kind of pressure they're putting on them. This causes us to HAVE to use at least front shoes. I tried numerous times to go without shoes on our horses, but a few of them just couldn't handle the jumping without the front shoes at least. It's a tough call...

[kentuckyrosesinmay]

[quote=Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by kentuckyrosesinmay

Unfortunately, we ask so much out of performance horses that their soles literally can't handle the kind of pressure they're putting on them. This causes us to HAVE to use at least front shoes. I tried numerous times to go without shoes on our horses, but a few of them just couldn't handle the jumping without the front shoes at least. It's a tough call...

I added to my post above just to let you know. We usually take the shoes off the horses in the off season and put them back on when we start heavy training again. You almost have to use or do have to use them when you are training them, jumping them, and showing them. Riding horses is just hard on them period.

[Cajungator26]

[quote=kentuckyrosesinmay]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

I added to my post above just to let you know. We usually take the shoes off the horses in the off season and put them back on when we start heavy training again. You almost have to use or do have to use them when you are training them, jumping them, and showing them. Riding horses is just hard on them period.

We did the same thing... it's tough in Florida though because technically there is no off season. LOL I'd want to take them off in the summer, but it rains a lot here and thrush runs rampant. We also see a lot of crumbling soles and hoof walls due to the moisture. Frustrating stuff...

[Kasept]

Funny that this toe grab issue came up.. Dan Fick of Jockey Club was on the show tonight and one of the topics we covered was the Grayson Foundation call for toe grabs to be eliminated.. Here's Hegarty's piece on it from DRF and a report from Anvils magazine from a few years ago when the California study elaborated on the issue:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15319949/

http://www.horseshoes.com/advice/alkane1/tgrbandi.htm

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Funny that this toe grab issue came up.. Dan Fick of Jockey Club was on the show tonight and one of the topics we covered was the Grayson Foundation call for toe grabs to be eliminated.. Here's Hegarty's piece on it from DRF and a report from Anvils magazine from a few years ago when the California study elaborated on the issue:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15319949/

http://www.horseshoes.com/advice/alkane1/tgrbandi.htm

Good article, thank you.

[Swap Fliparoo]

My TB has good feet, and is always barefoot. We do some light jumping and showing; unless he walks on gravel he's fine.

I recall reading about toe grabs in the past; had never known they were correlated w/ breakdowns

[Danzig]

[quote=Kasept]Funny that this toe grab issue came up.. Dan Fick of Jockey Club was on the show tonight and one of the topics we covered was the Grayson Foundation call for toe grabs to be eliminated.. Here's Hegarty's piece on it from DRF and a report from Anvils magazine from a few years ago when the California study elaborated on the issue:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15319949/

http://www.horseshoes.com/advice/alkane1/tgrbandi.htm[/QUOTE

i saw an article about toe grabs and their evils a few weeks ago...makes you wonder why everyone doesn't do away with them...

also, about shoeing...what about glue on shoes? i know they've been used on some horses due to hoof problems, are they a viable alternative? i would think if you don't have anything to correct that you could just use those, right?

[paisjpq]

[quote=Danzig188]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Funny that this toe grab issue came up.. Dan Fick of Jockey Club was on the show tonight and one of the topics we covered was the Grayson Foundation call for toe grabs to be eliminated.. Here's Hegarty's piece on it from DRF and a report from Anvils magazine from a few years ago when the California study elaborated on the issue:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15319949/

http://www.horseshoes.com/advice/alkane1/tgrbandi.htm[/QUOTE

i saw an article about toe grabs and their evils a few weeks ago...makes you wonder why everyone doesn't do away with them...

also, about shoeing...what about glue on shoes? i know they've been used on some horses due to hoof problems, are they a viable alternative? i would think if you don't have anything to correct that you could just use those, right?

the thing with glue ons is that they are very expensive it adds about $100 per pair to your shoeing bill (not that that should be a problem in the racing industry) the glue will alter the integrity of the hoof composition long-term (dry's it out big time).
One of my best friends is a farrier...he says: a glue-on shoe will not fully bond to the hoof wall for about 2 cycles...the glue takes all of the moisture out of the foot...after the first cycle you are left with a dried out 'shelly' crmbling hoof...until the foot is acclimated to the glue the foot is really a mess...if anything goes wrong and the glue ons are not working there is no viable hoof wall left to put a nail into...and you have to wait until the foot regraows (up to 9 months)
they are difficult to put on and remove...and if a horse happens to step on it and get it off they usually take of a significant portion of hoof wall with it...unless they are using 'Sigafoos' shoes that have a kevlar cuff that goes over the foot and does not detatch when the shoe falls off.

[quote=Danzig188]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Funny that this toe grab issue came up.. Dan Fick of Jockey Club was on the show tonight and one of the topics we covered was the Grayson Foundation call for toe grabs to be eliminated.. Here's Hegarty's piece on it from DRF and a report from Anvils magazine from a few years ago when the California study elaborated on the issue:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15319949/

http://www.horseshoes.com/advice/alkane1/tgrbandi.htm[/QUOTE

i saw an article about toe grabs and their evils a few weeks ago...makes you wonder why everyone doesn't do away with them...

also, about shoeing...what about glue on shoes? i know they've been used on some horses due to hoof problems, are they a viable alternative? i would think if you don't have anything to correct that you could just use those, right?

I like them for horses with bad feet, but they are VERY expensive and need to be changed frequently....they're not really economical for anything other than top allowance and stakes horses....

Originally Posted by Bababooyee

OK...but do you use either on your horses? I mean, if you really want what is closest to "nature" for horses, what do you do with yours?


Don't get me wrong, I understand the horsemanship and tradition concerns about polytrack. I appreciate that more than I have made clear on these forums.

Nevertheless, there is much more to the anti-polytrack hysterics than "Tradition!" and "Bring back horsemanship!" The fact of the matter is, and at least you have been honest enough to admit it, that it has a lot to do with money for the anti-polytrack crowd, too...which is incredibly ironic as that is one of the main attacks used on track owners.

And, FWIW, while I tend to be in favor of poly (or at least open to it), I do appreciate the sentiment that maybe this whole synthetic track phenomenon is moving a little fast...ie, why not see how it pans out at the track that have installed it before we start mandating its installation across the land.

I admit that I allow shoes to be used on ALL of my horses in training, but I also believe in my blacksmith...If I watch my horses go and think that they are shod poorly and they aren't breaking over cleanly and correctly, then I will bring it to my trainers attention AND YES I HAVE DONE IT BEFORE...as a matter of fact, the only thing that I disagree with my trainer on is the shoeing....