What if???

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by DaTruth

Those liars in the press. Making up quotes.

“It was very emotional when I retired her because I thought she absolutely did as much as any horse could do in their career,” Moss said of Zenyatta, who is unbeaten in 14 races.

Emphasis mine.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/17/sp...7zenyatta.html

It's all weird.

Jess Jackson says no to the Apple Blossom ... than he agrees to run .. but only if they run it 6 days later ... which pushed it to a Friday. Like that 6 extra days he was able to get was going to make a big differnce.

The dummy probably feels like he's been outmaneuvered once by Moss in November, once by Shirreffs cleverly catching him with a cranked up dirt horse at FG, and once by himself when he shrewdly bought himself an extra 6 days in order to agree to a race he ducks.... I think he's outmaneuvered a 4th time by not going because his horse would probably win.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

I assume Neko Bay will also move to dirt and run in the Oaklawn Park Handicap?

That would be the smart move... His top 2 career beyers came on dirt.

[prudery]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

They threw a day for her announcing offical retirement ...

They had her paraded in between stakes races ....

They renamed a stakes race named after Lady's Secret after her ...


It wasn't till Mid January when she was offically unretired.

I think it's great that they brought her back. Obviously she was never retired ... so who were they trying to fool? By they, I mean the press of course.

I believe you said no never mind if folk lie to the press ???

And I know all you said--you ain't changing my mind ...

Instead of going through this all over again, why not be happy we get to see another year of her--I know I am .

If fighting over this does it for ya--go ahead .

I am looking forward to Rachel getting fit, and Zenyatta continuing to continue ...

And if one relies on the NY Times as a reliable racing organ, so be it ...

[gales0678]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

This is what happens when the 3rd stringer in a barn beats the reigning HOY (and SPEED disciple darling). All the followers are left with is making a stink about whether Z was 'officially' retired or not. Who gives a ****? Z's caddy just dusted the HOY --- basically gutted her --- so much so that her connections have thrown in the towel. They don't want their FAST HOY to get roughed up any more. I can dig that. The 2 Z's in tandem would put such a beating on the FAST HOY that she'd never want to come out of her stall again.

Yeah, all the rest of this **** is peripheral --- the real issue is whether or not Z was 'officially' retired.

the loss is a loss , nothing more nothing less , she was probably at best 70 % of her max last sat

what is not right would be to rush her back through an accelerated training program just ot make a date with a horse that hasn't missed a day of training since oct

do me a favor steve , take 5 months off from the bike riding , when you are already say in august i'll come down to brooklyn and get you back on the bike so you can make the match race with vinny from queens by dec , i'll put you through double sessions in the brooklyn heat so that you can get into shape for the dec race , i'll work you so hard you'll be pucking up those cannolis , but don't worry come dec you'll be ready as i'm better than assmussen in getting someone to cycle off the bench

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

That would be the smart move... His top 2 career beyers came on dirt.

He won his debut on dirt at 21/1 with a 98 Beyer for Shirreffs several years ago.

The 98 debut Beyer probably puts him about 19th on the list of highest Beyers earned by a Shireffs runner in a debut race.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

He won his debut on dirt at 21/1 with a 98 Beyer for Shirreffs several years ago.

The 98 debut Beyer probably puts him about 19th on the list of highest Beyers earned by a Shireffs runner in a debut race.

His top 2 are low-mid 100's.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

All the followers are left with is making a stink about whether Z was 'officially' retired or not.

The fake retirement thing is meaningless ... though Gales seems obsessed by it.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

The fake retirement thing is meaningless ... though Gales seems obsessed by it.

Do you want me to take care of him?

[DaTruth]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

It's all weird.

Jess Jackson says no to the Apple Blossom ... than he agrees to run .. but only if they run it 6 days later ... which pushed it to a Friday. Like that 6 extra days he was able to get was going to make a big differnce.

The dummy probably feels like he's been outmaneuvered once by Moss in November, once by Shirreffs cleverly catching him with a cranked up dirt horse at FG, and once by himself when he shrewdly bought himself an extra 6 days in order to agree to a race he ducks.... I think he's outmaneuvered a 4th time by not going because his horse would probably win.

Yeah, Cella pulled a fast one on him by moving the race back a week. After he did that, Jackson should have waited a few weeks, then pulled out of the AB and said she was behind her training and wasn't going to be ready for the AB without sacrificing her form for most of the year. What the RA camp said on Sunday was just ridiculous.

Jackson can turn things back to his favor by again being aggressive with RA. Choose among the Met Mile, Foster, Salvator Mile, Iselin, Whitney, and Woodward for possible starts. She doesn't have to beat males each time, just not embarrass herself (Lady' Secret was 1 for 4 against males in 1986). If she does that, Moss is going to have do more than beat up on the usual suspects in SoCal.

[CSC]

Interesting how originally was a "What if?" thread has seemed to morph into a John Sheriff's tribute page. Seriously this is some funny $hit, trying to see the biggest and brightest minds on the board try to rationalize how a glorified horse like Zenyatta has gone 15 races without a loss is almost worth the price of a admission.

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by CSC

Interesting how originally was a "What if?" thread has seemed to morph into a John Sheriff's tribute page. Seriously this is some funny $hit, trying to see the biggest and brightest minds on the board try to rationalize how a glorified horse like Zenatta has gone 15 races without a loss is almost worth the price of a admission.

I agree. Some rug burns on the knees.

[lemoncrush]

Originally Posted by DaTruth

Yeah, Jackson can turn things back to his favor by again being aggressive with RA. Choose among the Met Mile, Foster, Salvator Mile, Iselin, Whitney, and Woodward for possible starts. She doesn't have to beat males each time, just not embarrass herself (Lady' Secret was 1 for 4 against males in 1986). If she does that, Moss is going to have do more than beat up on the usual suspects in SoCal.

If she goes in the Met Mile, QR would crush her. But I would love to see her and Zenyatta in a race like the Stephen Foster or Whitney.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by lemoncrush

If she goes in the Met Mile, QR would crush her. But I would love to see her and Zenyatta in a race like the Stephen Foster or Whitney.

She would run a clear clear cut second and maybe get close to him if he was not on his game, but I think he would be way to much at 9f.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by lemoncrush

If she goes in the Met Mile, QR would crush her. But I would love to see her and Zenyatta in a race like the Stephen Foster or Whitney.

If all three were going to face one another late spring or early summer, I think the best race would be the now-9F Suburban. Quality Road would have ample time from a scheduled appointment in the Met Mile,and I'm sure the connections of the females could find races from a timing perspective that makes sense. The race could highlight the July 4th weekend of racing. With the Breeders' Cup at Churchill this fall, the Foster is a less appealing option, IMO.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

If all three were going to face one another late spring or early summer, I think the best race would be the now-9F Suburban. Quality Road would have ample time from a scheduled appointment in the Met Mile,and I'm sure the connections of the females could find races from a timing perspective that makes sense. The race could highlight the July 4th weekend of racing. With the Breeders' Cup at Churchill this fall, the Foster is a less appealing option, IMO.

I think the Whitney is the spot that we see them all.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

I think the Whitney is the spot that we see them all.

I don't know. I think the one-turn 9F would be more to the liking of the connections of RA and QR, and the big sweeping turns at Belmont would probably appeal more to Zenyatta's connections.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

I don't know. I think the one-turn 9F would be more to the liking of the connections of RA and QR, and the big sweeping turns at Belmont would probably appeal more to Zenyatta's connections.

Why do you think the connections of RA and QR would prefer one turn? I guess it's a bit more obvious with QR but I don't know what they would find appealing, given that both horses have speed, about going 9fs at Belmont.

NT

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

Why do you think the connections of RA and QR would prefer one turn? I guess it's a bit more obvious with QR but I don't know what they would find appealing, given that both horses have speed, about going 9fs at Belmont.

NT

9F at Saratoga has proven to be a very demanding race in recent years. Put two speed-types in the race together, and I'd think a closer like Zenyatta, assuming she could handle the turns, would probably relish the dynamics. Rachel has already won over the course and distance, so she'd have no excuses (having won the 9F Mother Goose at Belmont last year, and rated while doing it). I'm presuming that QR would be coming off a decent race in the Met Mile, with the nearly 5 weeks that Pletcher seems to like for his horses.

[10 pnt move up]

This is not going to happen at Saratoga...period.

There would be a much better chance at Belmont.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by 10 pnt move up

This is not going to happen at Saratoga...period.

There would be a much better chance at Belmont.

I think Z, if healthy runs all over the country this year. Saratoga will be a goal for them, IMO.