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  #1  
Old 11-24-2006, 11:18 PM
todko todko is offline
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Invasor is no lightning bolt -- his times are relatively slow for an older horse. Discreet Cat is the sprinter's version of Bernardini -- he's beaten nobody.

Barbaro could beat either. Any distance. Any surface. Any condition.
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  #2  
Old 11-24-2006, 11:37 PM
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Hickory Hill Hoff Hickory Hill Hoff is offline
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Discreet Cat with another smashing victory tomorrow. Barbaro would be my 2nd chioce
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  #3  
Old 11-24-2006, 11:48 PM
todko todko is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hickory Hill Hoff
Discreet Cat with another smashing victory tomorrow. Barbaro would be my 2nd chioce
Against who? Sharp Humor iffy off a long layoff, bone chip injury, and one halfway respectable start back? That's the measure of greatness? Or Silver Train? Spotty to say the least. Abysmal last start.

Against how many? 4 others?

Discreet Cat doesn't break 1:34 and possibly even 1:35 tomorrow. Nothing special. Yet Beyer gives him a 118 or so speed figure. Same old story.

Why run Discreet Cat in the Breeders Cup when you can clean up easy money in overrated races like the Cigar? In the BC the truth might have been revealed.
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  #4  
Old 11-25-2006, 12:17 AM
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Hickory Hill Hoff Hickory Hill Hoff is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by todko
Against who? Sharp Humor iffy off a long layoff, bone chip injury, and one halfway respectable start back? That's the measure of greatness? Or Silver Train? Spotty to say the least. Abysmal last start.

Against how many? 4 others?

Discreet Cat doesn't break 1:34 and possibly even 1:35 tomorrow. Nothing special. Yet Beyer gives him a 118 or so speed figure. Same old story.

Why run Discreet Cat in the Breeders Cup when you can clean up easy money in overrated races like the Cigar? In the BC the truth might have been revealed.
We shall see...that's why they run the races
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  #5  
Old 11-25-2006, 02:06 AM
repent repent is offline
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Im not sure DCat can do any more tomorrow to win the award.
hes going to romp easy and ppl will again ask why he has not faced more.
you either believe he is a freak now or are going to have to wait until next year.

the best horse of the year?
well,
HOY has to go to Invasor.
more than deserving.
but then again, look what DCat did to him in March.

interesting though, the best horse to run in this country after those 2 has to be Hurricane Run.
he ran horrible in his only US start and really was out of form by the Fall.
but if you want to know who was the best turf horse that stepped foot on US soil this year, thats it.


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  #6  
Old 11-25-2006, 03:58 PM
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ateamstupid ateamstupid is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by todko
Discreet Cat doesn't break 1:34 and possibly even 1:35 tomorrow. Nothing special. Yet Beyer gives him a 118 or so speed figure. Same old story.
OOPS!!! I think he broke 1:35..
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  #7  
Old 11-25-2006, 04:06 PM
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If I replied to this yesterday it would have been Invasor...

But it's all DISCREET CAT now...
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  #8  
Old 11-25-2006, 04:12 PM
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King Glorious King Glorious is offline
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After the BC, I was set to give HOY to Invasor even though I thought Discreet Cat was the better horse. After today, I can't in good conscience vote for Invasor as the best horse to run in NA in 2006. I just can't. If one race can win it in other categories, one race can win it in HOY. Discreet Cat is the best horse in the world. It's not even close.
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  #9  
Old 11-25-2006, 04:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King Glorious
After the BC, I was set to give HOY to Invasor even though I thought Discreet Cat was the better horse. After today, I can't in good conscience vote for Invasor as the best horse to run in NA in 2006. I just can't. If one race can win it in other categories, one race can win it in HOY. Discreet Cat is the best horse in the world. It's not even close.
It may very well be possible that DC is the best horse running -- but Invasor better get HOY.

One race is enough to win Eclipse HOY only when no other horse has accomplished anything of note during the rest of the year. Reeling off four straight GI races in N. America is certainly more than worthy for HOY. Passing your only real "test" (a five horse test) with flying colors and brilliance is a great thing to behold, but certaily does not constitute a resumé for HOY.
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  #10  
Old 11-25-2006, 04:35 PM
ArlJim78 ArlJim78 is offline
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No way can horse of the year go to this horse despite his brillance.
He raced three times and beat a combined total of thirteen horses.
One race was an allowance, one a G2, and one G1 against mainly sprinters.

As far as breathtaking performances go I can't argue, he is sensational.

But please why do we always have to throw around and debate HOY.
Who cares unless you're part of the connections?
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  #11  
Old 11-25-2006, 07:45 AM
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Kasept Kasept is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by todko
Invasor is no lightning bolt -- his times are relatively slow for an older horse. Discreet Cat is the sprinter's version of Bernardini -- he's beaten nobody.

Barbaro could beat either. Any distance. Any surface. Any condition.
Except Invasor is really NOT an older horse.. He's a Southern Hemisphere 3 year old, less than six months 'older' than our sophomores. When you win races like the PIM Special, Suburban, Whitney and BC Classic, you're the best horse, and Horse of the Year... Period.

Discreet Cat? The Jerome and Cigar Mile won't cut it as a HOY resume. And please don't drag out the ridiculous "UAE Derby". There aren't too many people that would count anything that transpires at Nad al Sheba as a legitimate result towards determining anything. (Ian Jory's two horses were likely drugged up by someone for gods sake... He's got the test results to prove it. And then there's the horrific treatment Buff Bradley and Brass Hat received as further evidence of the phony shenanigans that go on in the 'Desert Oasis'...)

Barbaro is Barbaro. It's difficult to quantify his half season in the context of those that ran complete seasons, but he wasn't the 'best' horse of 2006. Everyone is so quick to attack Bernardini's opponent list, but other than the great Derby performance, which itself is quantity over quality, who exactly was Barbaro beating in the Tropical Park Derby (Wise River 2nd, Lewis Michael 3rd); Holy Bull (Great Point 2nd, My Golden Song 3rd); and FL Derby (Sharp Humor 2nd, Sunriver 3rd)??? The also rans behind him in the three pre-Derby races were hardly frightening groups..

So that leaves a wonderful Derby performance as Barbaro's great accomplishment of the year. Fine. But it hardly makes him the 'best' horse of the year when there's a candidate that won 4 straight Grade I races that are among the most important of any racing year. And as a reminder of the initial point, Invasor has been facing elders from May onward. I can appreciate the adoration of Barbaro as much as anyone, but in these discussions, he simply doesn't qualify from a body of work basis.
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  #12  
Old 11-25-2006, 08:50 AM
Danzig Danzig is offline
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i answered the question, which was who you thought was the best, not who was HOY. invasor obviously deserves the award.
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  #13  
Old 11-25-2006, 10:25 AM
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Thunder Gulch Thunder Gulch is offline
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Ouija Board was the best horse to win in the US this year. Invasor had the best season, and will be a deserving HOY, but OB is a future "Hall of Fame" mare and was a bad trip in 2005 from winning 3 straight BC races. Add her globetrotting resume in open company and you have one of the best in recent memory.
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  #14  
Old 11-25-2006, 10:40 AM
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Invasor!! although I would side with Bernardini in a rematch at 10f 12f
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  #15  
Old 11-25-2006, 11:52 AM
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2Hot4TV 2Hot4TV is offline
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Barbaro

Afew think Discreet Cat should be on top, but in this country he has just raced thru his conditions and dodged his real competion. He will race today and ship back home.

If a race horse doesn't run into his 4yo year they are to be remember as a flash in the pan.
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  #16  
Old 11-25-2006, 11:55 AM
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ateamstupid ateamstupid is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Hot4TV
Barbaro

Afew think Discreet Cat should be on top, but in this country he has just raced thru his conditions and dodged his real competion. He will race today and ship back home.

If a race horse doesn't run into his 4yo year they are to be remember as a flash in the pan.
LOL!!! Guess Barbaro's a flash in the pan then?
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  #17  
Old 11-25-2006, 12:50 PM
Slewbopper Slewbopper is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Hot4TV
Barbaro



If a race horse doesn't run into his 4yo year they are to be remember as a flash in the pan.
I guess the two Big Reds, MOW and Sec, were flashes in the pan.
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