god dang that looked bad

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by Danzig188

no, it wasn't just kickback. the wax isn't holding everything together like it was supposed to.
and why would they allow toe grabs if it was just kickback??

thanks to Sumitas, here's the link:
http://jen-thoroughbreds.blogspot.co...searching.html

[georgewashington]

Originally Posted by Downthestretch55

thanks to Sumitas, here's the link:
http://jen-thoroughbreds.blogspot.co...searching.html

You are giving me a blog. You can't be serious. Read the DRF article she is talking about or talk to horsemen at Woodbine. This blogger, and bloggers always have agendas, didn't read the article.

Here it is. I will cut out a useless paragraph or two for copyright reasons.

http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache...s&ct=clnk&cd=1

ETOBICOKE, Ontario - Woodbine's racing department held an open forum here late Friday morning and approximately 150 horsepeople took the time to show up at the sales pavilion.

While the agenda was open, the only subject discussed was the state of Polytrack, which has become a source of concern for both management and horsemen.

"We know we have a serious problem," Jamie Martin, Woodbine's senior vice president of racing, told the congregation. "We're addressing it as best we can, with maintenance procedures."

The problem with Polytrack has been kickback, caused by a separation of the Polytrack components during a recent stretch of colder weather. Brian Jabelman, Woodbine's director of racing surfaces, explained that the colder weather has been preventing the wax in the surface from fulfilling its function of holding the material together when the temperatures dropped.

"The fiber has been coming through the top," said Jabelman. "We're trying to break it down, mix it back into the surface. Adding water has helped."

Ray Sabourin, president of the Jockeys Benefit Association of Canada, was one of several riders present at Friday's meeting.

"It's a high kickback," said Sabourin. "It's nothing like we haven't dealt with, with the dirt - it hurts. The track's still safe; it just doesn't seem to be as good as everybody thought it was going to be."

Management and horsemen agreed that the amount of traffic on the Polytrack surface has exacerbated the problem. Woodbine will attempt to ease that situation by extending the training track season by two weeks, to Nov. 26.

Another immediate result of Friday's session has been a change of shoeing policy for Polytrack racing and training. Only flat shoes have been permitted, but, effective Saturday, Nov. 11, toe grabs up to a quarter of an inch will be allowed.

[georgewashington]

There is no safety issue at all at Woodbine. It is just tweaking that is need like most places. The stuff worked forever in Europe and works fine here. You don't like it for gambling ok, but there is no major problem with it anywhere.

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by georgewashington

There is no safety issue at all at Woodbine. It is just tweaking that is need like most places. The stuff worked forever in Europe and works fine here. You don't like it for gambling ok, but there is no major problem with it anywhere.

GW,
I really don't want to get into a poly debate.
If it seperates due to being frozen, doesn't that result in the "kick back"?
How can it be "tweaked" so that the wax is restored? Just curious.
DTS

[georgewashington]

Originally Posted by Downthestretch55

GW,
I really don't want to get into a poly debate.
If it seperates due to being frozen, doesn't that result in the "kick back"?
How can it be "tweaked" so that the wax is restored? Just curious.
DTS

It happens due to the cold weather. Water solves that problem. The track is fine just needs some tweaking. I heard they have it figured out, but must admit I have not heard anything from a reliable source I know there.

Enjoy your Thanksgiving everyone.

[SentToStud]

Originally Posted by georgewashington

It happens due to the cold weather. Water solves that problem. The track is fine just needs some tweaking. I heard they have it figured out, but must admit I have not heard anything from a reliable source I know there.

Enjoy your Thanksgiving everyone.

Think you're wrong. The track super said they did NOT want to put more water on it. When the track's in good shape and it takes water, it works well. When the wax "breaks down," whatever the hell that means, they have problems that water will not solve.

Ask your reliable source what they do to reattach the wax to the rest of the product. Once he tells you, call the track super because they don't know what to do at this point.

[ELA]

Are people just looking to argue or what? LOL. Anyway, these synthetic tracks are relatively new. The concept has been around a long time and in use at various training centers/farms. At a track, for a meet, of course it's different. Hundreds of horses, thousands for that matter, going over the track in the morning and then again in the afternoon. I think there was an expected learning curve here as far as maintenance and upkeep.

Regardless, those who are staunch supporters and feel this is the panacea and answer to the sport's ills will say it needs tweaking and it's supposed to be that way, etc. Those who think this is the worst thing to come along since Lasix or something like that, well of course they will say this is terrible and it's not working, the trainers hate it, etc.

I think the real answer is somewhere in the middle.

Eric

[georgewashington]

Originally Posted by SentToStud

Think you're wrong. The track super said they did NOT want to put more water on it. When the track's in good shape and it takes water, it works well. When the wax "breaks down," whatever the hell that means, they have problems that water will not solve.

Ask your reliable source what they do to reattach the wax to the rest of the product. Once he tells you, call the track super because they don't know what to do at this point.

They criticized it at Turfway too, tweaked it and now everyone loves it. Woodbine and Turfway weather are no different. They will fix it and then you can complain about the next polytrack that is installed. Keeneland had no problems. Great meet. Increase handle, no injuries. That is all I need to know. Didn't the three horses that prepped on the poly finish 1,2,3 in the BCJ?

[SentToStud]

Originally Posted by georgewashington

They criticized it at Turfway too, tweaked it and now everyone loves it. Woodbine and Turfway weather are no different. They will fix it and then you can complain about the next polytrack that is installed. Keeneland had no problems. Great meet. Increase handle, no injuries. That is all I need to know. Didn't the three horses that prepped on the poly finish 1,2,3 in the BCJ?

ok, you win? Frankly I don't care about it as much as you and I haven't bet a race at Woodbine in a month of Sundays. But first you miss the Woodbine story the rest of us read about their real problems that need more than your recommended tweaking. No big deal, then you turn to the good results Keeneland had. And what exactly does the BCJ result have to do with Woodbine's poly problems? You win.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

Originally Posted by georgewashington

They criticized it at Turfway too, tweaked it and now everyone loves it. Woodbine and Turfway weather are no different. They will fix it and then you can complain about the next polytrack that is installed. Keeneland had no problems. Great meet. Increase handle, no injuries. That is all I need to know. Didn't the three horses that prepped on the poly finish 1,2,3 in the BCJ?

a horse broke down at keenland..after the wire..the 6 with mckee up i think

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by georgewashington

There is no safety issue at all at Woodbine. It is just tweaking that is need like most places. The stuff worked forever in Europe and works fine here. You don't like it for gambling ok, but there is no major problem with it anywhere.

"We know we have a serious problem," Jamie Martin, Woodbine's senior vice president of racing


and i need help with reading?

[Danzig]

as to the wax....if you get wax you want to remove from anything...what do you do with the item? put it in the freezer, stuff comes right off.

this stuff is supposed to be the answer for tracks located up north who want to run during cold weather. if it doesn't hold up due to the weather, than it's pointless. huge investment, and now a serious problem. no amount of tweaking is going to keep wax where it belongs when it gets that cold.