Ted Haggard

[Downthestretch55]

Rupert,
Here are your words:
"First of all, the post was not directed at you. It was directed at DTS and I never said that DTS would defend someone just beacuse they are a Muslim. I said that DTS probably wouldn't have been interetsed in the story and probably would not have posted the story if it was about a Muslim. That is what I said."

First of all, you are making an outrageous assumption that demands an apology. I will not tolerate your lie.
Secondly, your clumsy attempt to refocus the topic of the debate from Haggard to me, like somehow I am the reason for his actions, is also tranparent.
You are entitled to believe whatever you wish as am I.
I base mine on truth.

DTS

Pgardn,
You stated above that Rumsfeld has gotten the job done. I'd like clarification on that statement, as last I heard, the engagement in Iraq is far from completed.

DTS

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Downthestretch55

Rupert,
Here are your words:
"First of all, the post was not directed at you. It was directed at DTS and I never said that DTS would defend someone just beacuse they are a Muslim. I said that DTS probably wouldn't have been interetsed in the story and probably would not have posted the story if it was about a Muslim. That is what I said."

First of all, you are making an outrageous assumption that demands an apology. I will not tolerate your lie.
Secondly, your clumsy attempt to refocus the topic of the debate from Haggard to me, like somehow I am the reason for his actions, is also tranparent.
You are entitled to believe whatever you wish as am I.
I base mine on truth.

DTS

Pgardn,
You stated above that Rumsfeld has gotten the job done. I'd like clarification on that statement, as last I heard, the engagement in Iraq is far from completed.

DTS

You can correct me if I was wrong. Would you have been interested in the story and posted the story if it was about a Muslim? If you would have, then my assumption was wrong and I apologize.

Anyway, I'm done debating with you. It's a waste of time.

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

You can correct me if I was wrong. Would you have been interested in the story and posted the story if it was about a Muslim? If you would have, then my assumption was wrong and I apologize.

Anyway, I'm done debating with you. It's a waste of time.

In what way did I bring the word Muslim into the debate?
YOU brought that into the debate, not me.
Debating?
You have demonstrated your lack of skills.
I do agree that you are wrong.
Your "apology", couched in the words you stated, amount to bu-l ****.
To the "honey wagon" you go! Along with the war criminals you so dearly defend.
Good bye!!

Originally Posted by Downthestretch55

Pgardn,
You stated above that Rumsfeld has gotten the job done. I'd like clarification on that statement, as last I heard, the engagement in Iraq is far from completed.

DTS

DTS.

We won the war militarily. We wiped the Iraqi military out. Did you miss that? We invaded and removed Iraq as a country we thought was a nuclear and biological threat to us directly.

Now as far as stabilizing the country after wiping out the regime that held so many factions from killing each other with brutal authority, well, that has clearly not gone well.

Our first objective was met with success. We removed what we thought was a threat. (No WMD's but we did not know that. We had people scouring all sites detected as biological and nuclear threats) Clearly should have spent some time thinking about stabilizing the country. After we got rid of the regime and finding no WMD's, then we had an entirely different objective that was not well thought out at all.
Then it was, ok then... well we did get rid of a brutal dictator (excuse for not finding WMD's)... uhhh, lets get this country fixed, uhhhh...

What is incorrect about my analysis and opinion.

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by pgardn

DTS.

We won the war militarily. We wiped the Iraqi military out. Did you miss that? We invaded and removed Iraq as a country we thought was a nuclear and biological threat to us directly.

Now as far as stabilizing the country after wiping out the regime that held so many factions from killing each other with brutal authority, well, that has clearly not gone well.

Our first objective was met with success. We removed what we thought was a threat. (No WMD's but we did not know that. We had people scouring all sites detected as biological and nuclear threats) Clearly should have spent some time thinking about stabilizing the country. After we got rid of the regime and finding no WMD's, then we had an entirely different objective that was not well thought out at all.
Then it was, ok then... well we did get rid of a brutal dictator (excuse for not finding WMD's)... uhhh, lets get this country fixed, uhhhh...

What is incorrect about my analysis and opinion.

Pgardn,
Considering that there were UN inspectors looking for wmd's prior to the invasion, perhaps it would have been more prudent to allow them to continue.
I agree that this country needs to "get fixed".
DTS

Originally Posted by Downthestretch55

Pgardn,
Considering that there were UN inspectors looking for wmd's prior to the invasion, perhaps it would have been more prudent to allow them to continue.
I agree that this country needs to "get fixed".
DTS

There was this continuing problem of the inspectors not being allowed to do their job. Continually harassed and not let into sites... You have got to remember this. The inspectors knew very little because they were not allowed to do their job. Read the UN reports... You certainly did not forget this? If they would have been allowed into sites none of this might have taken place. If Saddam had cooperated, we would not be in this mess. You have got to see this.

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by pgardn

There was this continuing problem of the inspectors not being allowed to do their job. Continually harassed and not let into sites... You have got to remember this. The inspectors knew very little because they were not allowed to do their job. Read the UN reports... You certainly did not forget this? If they would have been allowed into sites none of this might have taken place. If Saddam had cooperated, we would not be in this mess. You have got to see this.

Pgardn,
Dubbya gave Saddam an ulimitum...Leave within 48 hours. Remember?
Saddam was already in a box.
The invasion could have waited. There already were sanctions.
The real shame is that so many "bought" into this nonsense.
Like...if you disagreed with Dubbya's policy, you were "unpatriotic".
The words were, "You're either with us or against us."
Look at where that got us.
What ever happened to "free speech"?
Maybe it all got lost on the diversions like "intelligent design", "flag burning",
"gay marriage" and "stem cells".
In my humble view, we need not continue to waste more lives on the insanity that our "beloved" president has created.
Yes, there is a mess. "Stay the course" won't work anymore.
If Dubbya is indeed responsible for the direction that he's taken this country, and other countries also, it is time for answers to be found in the World Court in Hague, wherein he desrves to have a fair hearing on the charges of being the war criminal, that he is.
I can't wait for the trial.
DTS

Originally Posted by Downthestretch55

Pgardn,
Dubbya gave Saddam an ulimitum...Leave within 48 hours. Remember?
Saddam was already in a box.
The invasion could have waited. There already were sanctions.
The real shame is that so many "bought" into this nonsense.
Like...if you disagreed with Dubbya's policy, you were "unpatriotic".
The words were, "You're either with us or against us."
Look at where that got us.
What ever happened to "free speech"?
Maybe it all got lost on the diversions like "intelligent design", "flag burning",
"gay marriage" and "stem cells".
In my humble view, we need not continue to waste more lives on the insanity that our "beloved" president has created.
Yes, there is a mess. "Stay the course" won't work anymore.
If Dubbya is indeed responsible for the direction that he's taken this country, and other countries also, it is time for answers to be found in the World Court in Hague, wherein he desrves to have a fair hearing on the charges of being the war criminal, that he is.
I can't wait for the trial.
DTS

Ultimatum... what? How many times did we go around and around with them about inspections all thru the late 1990's. Its so easy to forget. Ultimatum after how many warnings? For God's sake those inspectors got thrown out of the country time after time. Did you completely forget this. Go back and read about the UN inspections in Iraq and what the inspectors had to deal with. I am more than willing to be accurate. You have got to hold to this also. If you say we should have given it more time even though Iraq constantly balked and lied etc.. chunked the inspectors out, that we STILL could have worked something in the long run, ok. But to completely forget how much trouble the UN had inspecting anything in Iraq is disingenious history, and thats being kind. I have no agenda here. I want accuracy. I want people to go back and put themselves in that moment and ask what was going on AT THAT TIME. You cant just take the easy way out and forget it all.

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by pgardn

Ultimatum... what? How many times did we go around and around with them about inspections all thru the late 1990's. Its so easy to forget. Ultimatum after how many warnings? For God's sake those inspectors got thrown out of the country time after time. Did you completely forget this. Go back and read about the UN inspections in Iraq and what the inspectors had to deal with. I am more than willing to be accurate. You have got to hold to this also. If you say we should have given it more time even though Iraq constantly balked and lied etc.. chunked the inspectors out, that we STILL could have worked something in the long run, ok. But to completely forget how much trouble the UN had inspecting anything in Iraq is disingenious history, and thats being kind. I have no agenda here. I want accuracy. I want people to go back and put themselves in that moment and ask what was going on AT THAT TIME. You cant just take the easy way out and forget it all.

Pgardn,
You might find this article interesting.http://www.commondreams.org/headlines05/1022-04.htm
DTS

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by pgardn

DTS.

We won the war militarily. We wiped the Iraqi military out. Did you miss that? We invaded and removed Iraq as a country we thought was a nuclear and biological threat to us directly.

Now as far as stabilizing the country after wiping out the regime that held so many factions from killing each other with brutal authority, well, that has clearly not gone well.

Our first objective was met with success. We removed what we thought was a threat. (No WMD's but we did not know that. We had people scouring all sites detected as biological and nuclear threats) Clearly should have spent some time thinking about stabilizing the country. After we got rid of the regime and finding no WMD's, then we had an entirely different objective that was not well thought out at all.
Then it was, ok then... well we did get rid of a brutal dictator (excuse for not finding WMD's)... uhhh, lets get this country fixed, uhhhh...

What is incorrect about my analysis and opinion.

Good analysis. I agree with everything you said.

[Danzig]

--he desrves to have a fair hearing on the charges of being the war criminal, that he is...

welllll. if he's already been found guilty there dts, why not just sentence him?? how can the trial be fair if the verdict is a foregone conclusion??

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Danzig188

--he desrves to have a fair hearing on the charges of being the war criminal, that he is...

welllll. if he's already been found guilty there dts, why not just sentence him?? how can the trial be fair if the verdict is a foregone conclusion??

I can't wait to see the trial. I'm waiting for that and a Beatles' reunion. I'm not sure which is more likely of happening between a Beatles' reunion and a trial for Bush.

In case anyone doesn't know, a Beatles' reunion is impossible since Lennon and Harrison are no longer alive.

[SentToStud]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I can't wait to see the trial. I'm waiting for that and a Beatles' reunion. I'm not sure which is more likely of happening between a Beatles' reunion and a trial for Bush.

In case anyone doesn't know, a Beatles' reunion is impossible since Lennon and Harrison are no longer alive.

I wsa in the car for a couple hours yesterday morning and had "Breakfast with the Beatles" on the radio. They played all of the Ed Sullivan show appearances. It was great. Besides the music, Ed Sullivan was also great, "Let me tell you, they're fine, fine youngsters."

Welll, we dusted the Iraqi army pretty good.
We rooted out Sadaam pretty easily
But,
We chose to dismantle the Iraqi army which probably was a bad idea, since a lot of those guys now get their paychecks from the bad guys,
And,
While "freedom reigns" in Iraq, it really has done so only if you are not part of the Sunni group.
Just today,
The Ba'ath party has been reinstated in the Iraqi legislature.

On second thought, maybe Rumsfield is the only thing actually going right. The political decisions, on the other hand, have not gone well, purple fingers notwithstanding.

(I must work "root out" into my conversational vocabulary.)

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by SentToStud

I wsa in the car for a couple hours yesterday morning and had "Breakfast with the Beatles" on the radio. They played all of the Ed Sullivan show appearances. It was great. Besides the music, Ed Sullivan was also great, "Let me tell you, they're fine, fine youngsters."

Welll, we dusted the Iraqi army pretty good.
We rooted out Sadaam pretty easily
But,
We chose to dismantle the Iraqi army which probably was a bad idea, since a lot of those guys now get their paychecks from the bad guys,
And,
While "freedom reigns" in Iraq, it really has done so only if you are not part of the Sunni group.
Just today,
The Ba'ath party has been reinstated in the Iraqi legislature.

On second thought, maybe Rumsfield is the only thing actually going right. The political decisions, on the other hand, have not gone well, purple fingers notwithstanding.

(I must work "root out" into my conversational vocabulary.)

er...just be careful what people you say 'root out' to...and whether it is indeed out or not. hate to see you up on charges....

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Good analysis. I agree with everything you said.

For sure!
I have a slightly used bridge that I'd like to sell to you.
It connects Manhatten and Brooklyn.
I can give you a "good deal".
If you're not interested in this one, I have an "option" on one that's in San Francisco, it connects to Oakland.
Let me know if you want to put money down on either of them.
I'll give you a very good deal.
If you can afford the buying the "war on terror", wherein we create even more terrorists, to the tune monthy costs, for sure this will be a "money maker" for you.
Let me know if you're interested. This "deal" won't wait.
Do you also want to buy a slightly failed "war"?

[timmgirvan]

DTS: Hyperbole Hyperbole, you have found your Master! It's nice of you to sit on your perch and spin about the Great Villain Bush, as you haven't walked a mile in his shoes. Yes, it's unfortunate that Bush doesn't run the Administration with a poll(or pole) as his sorry-butt predesessor did,huh? You choose the facts you believe and articulate...surely you are aware that car burnings in France average 112 a day, and that England is in turmoil with Muslims stating "if you call us criminals, we will become criminals" The Popes' statements added fuel to the fire, and that Muslims have set 2015 as date to have full control of Germany. The Gathering Storm is real, and every part that we can neutralize is necessary. We have countries that their 'express purpose' in life is to destroy the US and Israel,and anyone else who dares stand in their way. You're dreaming if you think Bush and Rumsfeld would stand trial in ANY court! I would advocate complete end to funding any and all countries who would support that scheme. BTW..if you're a patriot as you say..then it behooves you to get with those people who monitor everything and GIVE them your solution to Iraq...or is it really aout the money?