McNabb to Redskins

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Ive always liked Mcnabb. In reading all of the posts, its obvious that there is a difference in what is meant by "best eagle".

Best career? Mcnabb in a walk. Look at the success individually and the team success over the last decade.

Best Football player? White changed the game and is one of the best d lineman ever. Mcnabb will never be mentioned as one of the best Qb's ever.

Are you really saying that Reggie White's 8 years in Philadelphia were less successful individually than Donovan McNabbs? By what measure?

The statements made were that McNabb was the best player to ever wear an Eagles uniform. Reggie White was arguably the best player to ever wear a football uniform period and inarguably is in the top 5. Please tell me how Whites 8 year Eagle career was worse than McNabbs.

[slotdirt]

Cannon, remind me of all the great playoff successes Reggie White's teams had in his Eagles glory years?

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

Cannon, remind me of all the great playoff successes Reggie White's teams had in his Eagles glory years?

they had a below average offense. cant win if you cant score points.

Its not like we made it to the promise land with the other guy we are talking about either.

Though Van Brocklin and Bednarik won a championship or two

[slotdirt]

I just can't compare NFL championships to the Super Bowl era. First, because there were only like eight teams then and second, because the Lions, Browns, and Cardinals all won multiple NFL championships in that era. That pretty much invalidates anything that anybody ever did prior to the Super Bowl.

I also don't think many folks would say Reggie White was a top five player of all time either, but that is neither here nor there. Lawrence Taylor was a better defensive player in the same era, for starters. That's not even getting over to the offensive side.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

I just can't compare NFL championships to the Super Bowl era. First, because there were only like eight teams then and second, because the Lions, Browns, and Cardinals all won multiple NFL championships in that era. That pretty much invalidates anything that anybody ever did prior to the Super Bowl.

I also don't think many folks would say Reggie White was a top five player of all time either, but that is neither here nor there. Lawrence Taylor was a better defensive player in the same era, for starters. That's not even getting over to the offensive side.

You are the guy who is saying Donovan mcNabb was a better player than Reggie White and you are going to split hairs between him and Lawerence Taylor?

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

they had a below average offense. cant win if you cant score points.

Its not like we made it to the promise land with the other guy we are talking about either.

Though Van Brocklin and Bednarik won a championship or two

Statisically, thats not so much true. They were as high as 5th in the league in points scored twice during his tenure. They were way below average 3 time. They were very average (12th or 13th) 3 times.

Your point is well taken though. Those eagles teams were about defense from the coach on down with Randall being the only face of the offense.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

Cannon, remind me of all the great playoff successes Reggie White's teams had in his Eagles glory years?

Could you please explain to me how that has any relevance to Reggie White versus Donovan Mcnabb's "careers"?

Did RW have any control over the teams coaching decisions? Or offense? or Special teams? Or strength of other teams in the conference/division? Why does DM get credit for playing during an era where Dallas went 14 seasons without a playoff win? Or For Jim Johnsons defenses? Or the advantage of not being coached by Buddy Ryan?

For 8 years RW was the best player at his position in the NFL, let alone the Eagles. In 10 years McNabb has never been the best player at his position.
Reggie White missed 1 game in 8 years and never had anything but a great year. McNabb has missed quite a few games and has had a whole lot of bad games. Reggie Whites career with the Eagles was a huge success from day one till the day he left for GB. Can you say the same about McNabb?

Did one time during White's 8 years did you ever say "Boy we could do better if we replaced White with......"? That seemingly happened every week with McNabb.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Are you really saying that Reggie White's 8 years in Philadelphia were less successful individually than Donovan McNabbs? By what measure?

The statements made were that McNabb was the best player to ever wear an Eagles uniform. Reggie White was arguably the best player to ever wear a football uniform period and inarguably is in the top 5. Please tell me how Whites 8 year Eagle career was worse than McNabbs.

Inarguably top 5 EVER?

Hmmmm...

Joe Montana
Bart Starr
Johnny Unitas
Dan Marino
Walter Payton
Dick Butkus
Lawrence Taylor
Peyton Manning
Ray Nitschke
Sammy Baugh
Joe Greene
Deacon Jones
Deion Sanders
Jerry Rice
Kellen Winslow

Sure he is in that mix. But you COULD argue whether or not he is in the top five.

I know what you mean though.

[slotdirt]

I'm not splitting hairs - Lawrence Taylor was a better defensive player than Reggie White.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

I'm not splitting hairs - Lawrence Taylor was a better defensive player than Reggie White.

So it took you Lawerence Taylor to come up with a better defensive player than White yet you believe McNabb the superior player? Isn't that like making my argument for me?

This is a ridiclous argument. Ok so White is one of the top 10 NFL players in history. Feel better? Again tell me how Donovan McNabb was a more successful Quarterback than Reggie White was a defensive end?

[Smooth Operator]

Let this one go, Cannon

Only a biased idiot would think that McNabb was better than White.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Smooth Operator

Let this one go, Cannon

Only a biased idiot would think that McNabb was better than White.

Thats not nice. I just think they are arguing different things.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

So it took you Lawerence Taylor to come up with a better defensive player than White yet you believe McNabb the superior player? Isn't that like making my argument for me?

This is a ridiclous argument. Ok so White is one of the top 10 NFL players in history. Feel better? Again tell me how Donovan McNabb was a more successful Quarterback than Reggie White was a defensive end?

Its kind of like the time you got on me about comparing Dubai Millenium favorably to Bernardini. It is kind of a silly argument in that they play completely different positions on different sides of the ball and their prime years were seperated by about 15 years.

My point with Mcnabb had more to do with team success. He was the face of the eagles during the most successful period for the team during the modern era. Statisically, the two are impossible to compare although obviously Reggie White will certainly be more memorable 50 years from now.

[slotdirt]

My entire point is that Donovan McNabb probably had the best career in Eagles history. Whether he was a superior player at his particular position than Reggie White is semantics. There are a hell of a lot more quarterbacks in the HOF than defensive ends, so whether or not McNabb was ever the best quarterback in the league at any exact moment in time seems superflous to me, particularly when there were at least two players at his position playing concurrently in Tom Brady and Peyton Manning that would probably make a top ten all-time list before Reggie White ever did.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

My entire point is that Donovan McNabb probably had the best career in Eagles history. Whether he was a superior player at his particular position than Reggie White is semantics. There are a hell of a lot more quarterbacks in the HOF than defensive ends, so whether or not McNabb was ever the best quarterback in the league at any exact moment in time seems superflous to me, particularly when there were at least two players at his position playing concurrently in Tom Brady and Peyton Manning that would probably make a top ten all-time list before Reggie White ever did.

Excellent point

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

My entire point is that Donovan McNabb probably had the best career in Eagles history. Whether he was a superior player at his particular position than Reggie White is semantics. There are a hell of a lot more quarterbacks in the HOF than defensive ends, so whether or not McNabb was ever the best quarterback in the league at any exact moment in time seems superflous to me, particularly when there were at least two players at his position playing concurrently in Tom Brady and Peyton Manning that would probably make a top ten all-time list before Reggie White ever did.

And my point is that is just isnt better than Whites. In 8 years White was 1st team all pro 6 times and 2nd team all pro twice. If he had retired after those 8 seasons he goes into Hof 1st ballot.

This isnt a debate over Qb's versus DE's. This is a debate over who was a better football player and White clearly was.

Denigrating White doesnt help your cause. On almost any all time list he is in the top 10. Really it is silly to try to knock Reggie White as a player. he was pretty close to flawless at his position. This is about McNabb. He simply doesnt measure up as a football player to Reggie White.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Its kind of like the time you got on me about comparing Dubai Millenium favorably to Bernardini. It is kind of a silly argument in that they play completely different positions on different sides of the ball and their prime years were seperated by about 15 years.

My point with Mcnabb had more to do with team success. He was the face of the eagles during the most successful period for the team during the modern era. Statisically, the two are impossible to compare although obviously Reggie White will certainly be more memorable 50 years from now.

No it isnt close to the same. It is really quite simple. White was far superior at his position than McNabb was at his using virtually any measuring tool.

And if McNabb had more to do with his teams success than he also on the other hand takes more of the blame for for its failures of which there have been many. The Eagles success of the last 10 years has not exactly been a legandary run and what are you comparing it to? The past Eagles teams? Well what does the lack of success of the Eagles in the 60's and 70's or 80's have to do with McNabb? If they had won the Super Bowl 3 times in the early 70's does that make Mcnabb less successful? Is Rothelisberger less of a success as a QB because the Steelers were more dominant in the 70's? One thing has nothing to do with another. Perhaps if mcNabb's teams had won a couple Super bowls you could try to make a case. But to me who really doesnt care either way about the Eagles the Donovan mcNabb era will be remembered for missed opportunity than any huge era of success.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

No it isnt close to the same. It is really quite simple. White was far superior at his position than McNabb was at his using virtually any measuring tool.

And if McNabb had more to do with his teams success than he also on the other hand takes more of the blame for for its failures of which there have been many. The Eagles success of the last 10 years has not exactly been a legandary run and what are you comparing it to? The past Eagles teams? Well what does the lack of success of the Eagles in the 60's and 70's or 80's have to do with McNabb? If they had won the Super Bowl 3 times in the early 70's does that make Mcnabb less successful? Is Rothelisberger less of a success as a QB because the Steelers were more dominant in the 70's? One thing has nothing to do with another. Perhaps if mcNabb's teams had won a couple Super bowls you could try to make a case. But to me who really doesnt care either way about the Eagles the Donovan mcNabb era will be remembered for missed opportunity than any huge era of success.

Cool

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

No it isnt close to the same. It is really quite simple. White was far superior at his position than McNabb was at his using virtually any measuring tool.

And if McNabb had more to do with his teams success than he also on the other hand takes more of the blame for for its failures of which there have been many. The Eagles success of the last 10 years has not exactly been a legandary run and what are you comparing it to? The past Eagles teams? Well what does the lack of success of the Eagles in the 60's and 70's or 80's have to do with McNabb? If they had won the Super Bowl 3 times in the early 70's does that make Mcnabb less successful? Is Rothelisberger less of a success as a QB because the Steelers were more dominant in the 70's? One thing has nothing to do with another. Perhaps if mcNabb's teams had won a couple Super bowls you could try to make a case. But to me who really doesnt care either way about the Eagles the Donovan mcNabb era will be remembered for missed opportunity than any huge era of success.

Very true. Good post.