85 in a 50!!

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

Even if he didn't jump over the rails, is he really a shoe-in to win the Gotham, over the same surface and distance?

He handled the surface fine when he ran a 105BSF? The horse bugged out and needs Ramon IF he is physically OK and trains on OK he is the FAV and most likely winner IF he goes in the Gotham

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by freddymo

He handled the surface fine when he ran a 105BSF? The horse bugged out and needs Ramon IF he is physically OK and trains on OK he is the FAV and most likely winner IF he goes in the Gotham

Contessa was just on HRTV and thinks it was an equipment problem but wants to talk to Chavez. I'd say this is the last time Chavez is on the horse.

NT

[SOREHOOF]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

Contessa was just on HRTV and thinks it was an equipment problem but wants to talk to Chavez. I'd say this is the last time Chavez is on the horse.

NT

Chavez did nothing wrong, he had to bail.

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by freddymo

He handled the surface fine when he ran a 105BSF? The horse bugged out and needs Ramon IF he is physically OK and trains on OK he is the FAV and most likely winner IF he goes in the Gotham

When I said "same surface and distance" I meant "the same conditions as today's race". I didn't mean it as 2 separate strikes against him.

I was basically poking fun at your unfortunate wording ("he blew the turn and the jock pulled him up"--as though it was no big deal) immediately after touting him as the Gotham winner.

Nonetheless, I'd still argue with you even if you had merely said the race was a "throwout". This was not a stumbled start, slipped saddle, broken rein, etc.

If I had to take a guess, I'd suggest that the horse was very rank and resented any sort of restraint from Chavez, causing him to bolt. That spells one thing in my mind..."runoff".

And while his trainer may be able to get him to navigate the turn next time out, there's still undiscovered country afterward in terms of the route of ground. If he is truly a "runoff" then lots of luck keeping up a breakneck pace around two turns.

His best chance would be to show up in a first condition, but even a drop in class isn't always good insurance to get a sprinter to stretch out, especially a rank one. Witness Zensational's pathetic attempt last year.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

When I said "same surface and distance" I meant "the same conditions as today's race". I didn't mean it as 2 separate strikes against him.

I was basically poking fun at your unfortunate wording ("he blew the turn and the jock pulled him up"--as though it was no big deal) immediately after touting him as the Gotham winner.

Nonetheless, I'd still argue with you even if you had merely said the race was a "throwout". This was not a stumbled start, slipped saddle, broken rein, etc.

If I had to take a guess, I'd suggest that the horse was very rank and resented any sort of restraint from Chavez, causing him to bolt. That spells one thing in my mind..."runoff".

And while his trainer may be able to get him to navigate the turn next time out, there's still undiscovered country afterward in terms of the route of ground. If he is truly a "runoff" then lots of luck keeping up a breakneck pace around two turns.

His best chance would be to show up in a first condition, but even a drop in class isn't always good insurance to get a sprinter to stretch out, especially a rank one. Witness Zensational's pathetic attempt last year.

Maybe? Maybe he just needs some time in the morning. They could have sold him and didnt so Contessa must THINK(whatever that is worth) that he will be ok around 2 turns?

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by freddymo

Maybe? Maybe he just needs some time in the morning. They could have sold him and didnt so Contessa must THINK(whatever that is worth) that he will be ok around 2 turns?

I doubt any perceived route ability is a factor in deciding not to sell. I think the raw talent displayed is enough to keep from letting him go. There's some money and glory in sprinting. Hopefully they don't allow their Derby Fever to thwart a one-turn career as someone else suggested.

That said, I'm going to go out on a limb here and say the horse will be lucky to emulate even horses like Corazondelcampeon or Sea Of Pleasure (who's connections also turned down big dough to roll the dice).

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

I doubt any perceived route ability is a factor in deciding not to sell. I think the raw talent displayed is enough to keep from letting him go. There's some money and glory in sprinting. Hopefully they don't allow their Derby Fever to thwart a one-turn career as someone else suggested.

That said, I'm going to go out on a limb here and say the horse will be lucky to emulate even horses like Corazondelcampeon or Sea Of Pleasure (who's connections also turned down big dough to roll the dice).

I will take the 6/1 on him to run and win the Gotham for 100.00 if he doesnt show up u win

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by freddymo

I will take the 6/1 on him to run and win the Gotham for 100.00 if he doesnt show up u win

I'm not sure my mom will let me borrow that much. Let me ask my parole officer.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

I'm not sure my mom will let me borrow that much. Let me ask my parole officer.

You can use cigarettes or whatever the current currency is in THE BIG HOUSE

[Sightseek]

Before anyone tosses 85 as a hopeless nag - the bit broke before he bolted per Chavez's agent.

[TouchOfGrey]

Originally Posted by Sightseek

Before anyone tosses 85 as a hopeless nag - the bit broke before he bolted per Chavez's agent.

DRF:Eightyfiveinafifty leaves course after bit breaks

How does a bit break? Don't they check their equipment?

[Left Bank]

Originally Posted by Sightseek

Before anyone tosses 85 as a hopeless nag - the bit broke before he bolted per Chavez's agent.

When you're pulling as hard as you can with your feet in the dashboards,bits do tend to break.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by freddymo

Maybe? Maybe he just needs some time in the morning. They could have sold him and didnt so Contessa must THINK(whatever that is worth) that he will be ok around 2 turns?

Whoever "They" is F**U**C**K**E**D Up. New York with their 5 horse fields along with the West coast is now irrelevant as far as the Kentucky Derby goes. NYRA apoligists please have at me.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by jms62

Whoever "They" is F**U**C**K**E**D Up. New York with their 5 horse fields along with the West coast is now irrelevant as far as the Kentucky Derby goes. NYRA apoligists please have at me.

The Whirlaway was always a huge Ky Derby prep. You're right, it's just not the same.

NT

[jms62]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

The Whirlaway was always a huge Ky Derby prep. You're right, it's just not the same.

NT

First NYRA Apoligist takes a shot.. Think we may hit 6 horses for the next prep Nick? NY Debry Preps are a F**u**c***k**i**n**g Joke but I am sure you know that deep down inside. Unfortunately your job states otherwise and your credibility is basically ZERO that you even argue the point. Lets play Jeopardy Nick....

Answer 2008 Gotham Stakes
Question: What is the last Nyra Triple Crown Prep Race to offer a Superfecta Bet?

The plus side is any winner of a NYRA prep is a throwout May-01-2010

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by jms62

First NYRA Apoligist. Takes a shot.. Think we may hit 6 horses for the next prep Nick? NY Debry Preps are a F**u**c***k**i**n**g Joke but I am sure you know that deep down inside. Unfortunately your job states otherwise. Lets play Jeopardy Nick....

Answer 2008 Gotham Stakes
Question: What is the last Nyra Triple Crown Prep Race to offer a Superfecta Bet?

First of all, there was a super in the 2009 Gotham. It paid $351.70.

More importantly, and your frustration with field sizes in stakes lately is understood, but you have to know what you're dealing with in NY this time of year. Does anyone really consider the Count Fleet and Whirlaway Derby preps? If you have a quality 3YO right now you want him tested and that's just not what's going to happen as easily in NY as it will in other places.

NT

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by jms62

Answer 2008 Gotham Stakes
Question: What is the last Nyra Triple Crown Prep Race to offer a Superfecta Bet?

The lack of a super in the last two editions of the Wood had nothing to do with field size. In 2009, it had to do with the fact that Kelly Breen had an entry, thereby prohibiting super wagering under an arcane NY racing rule (even if they had a 12-horse field). Same thing in 2008 due to WinStar entry.

[Linny]

Originally Posted by jms62

First NYRA Apoligist takes a shot.. Think we may hit 6 horses for the next prep Nick? NY Debry Preps are a F**u**c***k**i**n**g Joke but I am sure you know that deep down inside. Unfortunately your job states otherwise and your credibility is basically ZERO that you even argue the point. Lets play Jeopardy Nick....

Answer 2008 Gotham Stakes
Question: What is the last Nyra Triple Crown Prep Race to offer a Superfecta Bet?

The plus side is any winner of a NYRA prep is a throwout May-01-2010

There was full field in the Wood last year or there would have been a super. Since when is the Whirlaway supposed to be a harbinger of great things? The Gothem? Maybe. The Wood? Yes.

Honestly anyone who thinks that a colt that gets a 105 going 6f in Jan at any track is a "Derby prospect" needs to go back and study the history of that fine Derby prospect This Ones For Phil. Is he a very nice colt? Yes. Was he every a likely Derby horse NO.
85 is bred to be a fast sprinter and he is one. I hope he's OK and that they can get him back for the Gotham after which he can veer prompty into races like Bay Shore and the Woody Stephens etc.