The Michael Gill/Penn National Riders Saga

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Riot

1. If you are not rich enough as an owner to race horses and not abuse them in an attempt to earn money, you don't need to be in the business.

2. If you think money trumps the lives of horses, you don't need to be in the business.

3. If you want to consciously abuse animals in the name of business, by racing them when they should not be raced, just to make money, you need to not be in the sport.

4. If "It doesn't work well, I've tried" is your excuse, that other people force you to abuse your own animals to make money to pay your bills, then you need not only to not be in the sport, you need a spine transplant.

5. If the above post defining "two fundamental things" is truely how you think of horses and horse racing, you need to not be in the sport.

as much as in pains me, Sharp Post.

[Cannon Shell]

One complete untruth posted several times in this thread is that Gill makes money on his horse racing operation. That being said this thread is still several levels above the drivel in the comment section on Paulicks site...

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

One complete untruth posted several times in this thread is that Gill makes money on his horse racing operation. That being said this thread is still several levels above the drivel in the comment section on Paulicks site...

How would you know his P&L.. Your telling me he is doing this for the thrill of winning 5 claimers? I don't know if he is making money or losing money?

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by freddymo

How would you know his P&L.. Your telling me he is doing this for the thrill of winning 5 claimers? I don't know if he is making money or losing money?

He's an ego maniac Freddy, why else would he operate the way he is?

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Sightseek

He's an ego maniac Freddy, why else would he operate the way he is?

I don't know anything about Gill or his personality.. Have you met him or is your ego maniac chacterizeration based on track lure? He might be the jerk or a great charity sweet guy for all I know? I will say that if the jocks who are typically free agents only interested in there themselves are unified something appears to be very wrong.

I think the guy business is Mortgages in New England well that business can't be extremely profitable currently anyway.. I would think he is looking to earn not crack a bottle of Petrus when his 40 nickle claimer bounces on a field.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by freddymo

How would you know his P&L.. Your telling me he is doing this for the thrill of winning 5 claimers? I don't know if he is making money or losing money?

Of course he's losing money... though not as much as before cause of the purses.

And no question he gets a big thrill from winning nickle claimers.

It's all about having action.

It's not like he hasn't tried buying expensive horses. He's bought several unraced horses for low-to-mid six figures.

The most memorable of which was Forest Music.

Forest Music was the first horse to ever work a 1/4 mile in 20 and change at the Calder 2yo sale. She won her debut like a freak for Gill/Shuman in 1:08 2/5ths - got a 105 Beyer.

Two weeks later, they shipped the obvious sprinter across country to run in the BC Juvie Fillies in the Halfbridled-Ashado race. They basically set her way back.

The very first race after Gill sold her ... she went and dominated the Grade 2 Honorable Miss at Saratoga for Stonestreet/Asmussen.

The guy doesn't have the patience of your typical wealthy snob owner.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

The very first race after Gill sold her ... she went and dominated the Grade 2 Honorable Miss at Saratoga for Stonestreet/Asmussen.

Talk about easy money.

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

It's all about having action.

.

If he was a politician he would just go out and get himself a hooker.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by freddymo

How would you know his P&L.. Your telling me he is doing this for the thrill of winning 5 claimers? I don't know if he is making money or losing money?

I have a little experience in what it costs to have thoroughbreds in training. He cant make money. It is impossible even for a gyp operation. Whether he is using the loss for some kind of tax relief is another question.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I have a little experience in what it costs to have thoroughbreds in training. He cant make money. It is impossible even for a gyp operation. Whether he is using the loss for some kind of tax relief is another question.

The interesting thing is that he runs them under his specific name, and not under an LLC.

IRS will be able to have a field day just on that very stance if they ever bust out the hobby vs business on him..

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by Scav

The interesting thing is that he runs them under his specific name, and not under an LLC.

IRS will be able to have a field day just on that very stance if they ever bust out the hobby vs business on him..

That's addressed in today's piece...

http://www.paulickreport.com/blog/gi...hats-so-wrong/

He's been involved in a 5 year evaluation by IRS on the hobby/business equation:

Though he said he has lost tens of millions of dollars over the years, Gill claims he didn’t “put one penny of my money into the business last year. I can go to the IRS and say this is a business, it isn’t a hobby.” Gill said he is in a five-year audit with the Internal Revenue Service over whether or not his racing stable is a legitimate business.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Kasept

That's addressed in today's piece...

http://www.paulickreport.com/blog/gi...hats-so-wrong/

He's been involved in a 5 year evaluation by IRS on the hobby/business equation:

Though he said he has lost tens of millions of dollars over the years, Gill claims he didn’t “put one penny of my money into the business last year. I can go to the IRS and say this is a business, it isn’t a hobby.” Gill said he is in a five-year audit with the Internal Revenue Service over whether or not his racing stable is a legitimate business.

That has to be quite fun, yikes.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Kasept

That's addressed in today's piece...

http://www.paulickreport.com/blog/gi...hats-so-wrong/

He's been involved in a 5 year evaluation by IRS on the hobby/business equation:

Though he said he has lost tens of millions of dollars over the years, Gill claims he didn’t “put one penny of my money into the business last year. I can go to the IRS and say this is a business, it isn’t a hobby.” Gill said he is in a five-year audit with the Internal Revenue Service over whether or not his racing stable is a legitimate business.

He loves to pay for things and people cash. Keeps the on the books expenses down, makes it easier to try to declare a profit and avoids all those pesky payroll taxes and workmans compensation audits.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I have a little experience in what it costs to have thoroughbreds in training. He cant make money. It is impossible even for a gyp operation. Whether he is using the loss for some kind of tax relief is another question.

He is paying less then 50 a day and I am sure his vetting is highly discounted.. He has more then a few that get claimed away at prices above his purchase price. AND he wins a lot

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by freddymo

He is paying less then 50 a day and I am sure his vetting is highly discounted.. He has more then a few that get claimed away at prices above his purchase price. AND he wins a lot

At $50 a day he is getting murdered.

[Left Bank]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

One complete untruth posted several times in this thread is that Gill makes money on his horse racing operation. That being said this thread is still several levels above the drivel in the comment section on Paulicks site...