John Shirreffs

[10 pnt move up]

Man, who knew Shirreffs was such a good trainer at getting them ready for the big race...thanks for letting us know!

[The Indomitable DrugS]

You didn't.

In fact, you argued that Zenyatta deserves extra credit points because she's trained by an ordinary trainer like Shirreffs while RA is trained by a wizard like Asmussen.

I'd take Shirreffs in every single aspect over Asmussen as a trainer. Even ability to move horses up coming from a different barn.

[10 pnt move up]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

You didn't.

In fact, you argued that Zenyatta deserves extra credit points because she's trained by an ordinary trainer like Shirreffs while RA is trained by a wizard like Asmussen.

I'd take Shirreffs in every single aspect over Asmussen as a trainer. Even ability to move horses up coming from a different barn.

I was making a joke about Asmussen and his often forays into the issues with drugs...you knew that though.

I do think its odd that a guy like Asmussen could have the horse of the year for three years in a row, and in the back of your head you wonder how much he may have "moved" the horses up, but both had talent so its his reputation that begs that question.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by 10 pnt move up

I do think its odd that a guy like Asmussen could have the horse of the year for three years in a row, and in the back of your head you wonder how much he may have "moved" the horses up, but both had talent so its his reputation that begs that question.

Couldn't the same be said about Shirreffs with Life Is Sweet and After Market.

He moved both of them up considerably off of Bill Mott.

I'm not so sure RA and Curlin were really move-ups either.

[10 pnt move up]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Couldn't the same be said about Shirreffs with Life Is Sweet and After Market.

He moved both of them up considerably off of Bill Mott.

I'm not so sure RA and Curlin were really move-ups either.

I think both got better with the surface switch (Life is Sweet) and easier competition (After Market). Though I default to your opinion.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by 10 pnt move up

I think both got better with the surface switch (Life is Sweet) and easier competition (After Market). Though I default to your opinion.

After Market got drilled in his final start for Mott, a N4X optional claimer at GP. I think he needed the ultra-firm turf out west as he didn't run back to his good 3YO races after a disastrous run in the Kent at Delaware.

NT

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by 10 pnt move up

I think both got better with the surface switch (Life is Sweet) and easier competition (After Market). Though I default to your opinion.

After Market finished dead last in a field of 8 in an alw race on the turf at Gulfstream in his final start for Bill Mott.

That was Jan 31st. Six months later .. he was the best in the West.

His pp's are right on top in this link...

http://www.drf.com/eclipse/2007/pps/maleturf.pdf


As for Life Is Sweet....

With Bill Mott: 2-for-7 .... zero for four in stakes races.

With John Shirreffs: 4-for-8 ... all races were either G1 or Gr 2 stakes. 3 of the 4 losses came to Zenyatta .. the other one came when 3rd to Rail Trip in the Hollywood Gold Cup.

As for the synthetic surface ... Life Is Sweet did run once on a synthetic track for Bill Mott .. she was 4th to Little Belle in the Ashland.

[10 pnt move up]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

After Market finished dead last in a field of 8 in an alw race on the turf at Gulfstream in his final start for Bill Mott.

That was Jan 31st. Six months later .. he was the best in the West.

His pp's are right on top in this link...

http://www.drf.com/eclipse/2007/pps/maleturf.pdf


As for Life Is Sweet....

With Bill Mott: 2-for-7 .... zero for four in stakes races.

With John Shirreffs: 4-for-8 ... all races were either G1 or Gr 2 stakes. 3 of the 4 losses came to Zenyatta .. the other one came when 3rd to Rail Trip in the Hollywood Gold Cup.

As for the synthetic surface ... Life Is Sweet did run once on a synthetic track for Bill Mott .. she was 4th to Little Belle in the Ashland.

so you do think he is cheating then, and this is the proof?

[JerseyJ]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

After Market finished dead last in a field of 8 in an alw race on the turf at Gulfstream in his final start for Bill Mott.

That was Jan 31st. Six months later .. he was the best in the West.

His pp's are right on top in this link...

http://www.drf.com/eclipse/2007/pps/maleturf.pdf


As for Life Is Sweet....

With Bill Mott: 2-for-7 .... zero for four in stakes races.

With John Shirreffs: 4-for-8 ... all races were either G1 or Gr 2 stakes. 3 of the 4 losses came to Zenyatta .. the other one came when 3rd to Rail Trip in the Hollywood Gold Cup.

As for the synthetic surface ... Life Is Sweet did run once on a synthetic track for Bill Mott .. she was 4th to Little Belle in the Ashland.

Please, take a look at After Market's PPs for a second...After Market finished a non-threatening 6th at 28-1 in the Kilroe Handicap and then was a non-threatening 5th with a perfect trip in a conditional money allowance. Finally he got into the winners circle in a weak 5 horse rendition of the Inglewood Handicap. Then he continued to get great setup, after great setup before coming home east and losing the Kelso BC Mile...Did he really improve that much out West or did he just beat up on crap out there???

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

After Market finished dead last in a field of 8 in an alw race on the turf at Gulfstream in his final start for Bill Mott.

That was Jan 31st. Six months later .. he was the best in the West.

His pp's are right on top in this link...

http://www.drf.com/eclipse/2007/pps/maleturf.pdf


As for Life Is Sweet....

With Bill Mott: 2-for-7 .... zero for four in stakes races.

With John Shirreffs: 4-for-8 ... all races were either G1 or Gr 2 stakes. 3 of the 4 losses came to Zenyatta .. the other one came when 3rd to Rail Trip in the Hollywood Gold Cup.

As for the synthetic surface ... Life Is Sweet did run once on a synthetic track for Bill Mott .. she was 4th to Little Belle in the Ashland.

What happened to Crossing The Line?

[10 pnt move up]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

I'm not so sure RA and Curlin were really move-ups either.

I never said they were, I said due to his numerous shady drug issues you never know.