"Spaced" Races And "Fresh" Horses Are Killing The Sport

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Bold Brooklynite

Very, very naive.

All it takes is one big syndication deal ... and the trainer's share is enough to fix him up for life.

Sure it's nice to train winners of $1,000,000 and make $100,000 ... but it's a lot of hard work and you certainly can't be financially secure from it.

But get that $40,000,000 syndication deal ... and you make a few million in one swoop ... the equivalent of 25 years of toiling in the salt mines.

That's the main objective of today's trainers of G1-level horses ... win that one big one ... and start the negotiations.

You obviously did not read my post. I was not talking about horses that are worth tens of millions. I was talking about the other 99.9% of horses out there. By the way, even with the huge deals the trainers usually don't make big money unless the owners are very generous. The trainer will usually just get 1 share in the horse. With a really good horse like Saint Liam, Dutrow would make much more money if the horse kept on running. He's not going to make much from having 1 share in the horse. How much is 1 share worth in Saint Liam worth? Maybe $100,000. When the horse won the BC Classic, Dutrow made $300,000 in one day.

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

You obviously did not read my post. I was not talking about horses that are worth tens of millions. I was talking about the other 99.9% of horses out there. By the way, even with the huge deals the trainers usually don't make big money unless the owners are very generous. The trainer will usually just get 1 share in the horse.

That's not the way it works ...

... trainers usually get 2 - 4 shares ... making a $1,000,000 per share syndication worth $2-4 million for the trainer ...

... and it takes most trainers and awful lot of years to make that sort of money.

Meanwhile ... where is your football-field-long list of horses who have had multi-year championships or near-championships from a race-spacing regimen?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Bold Brooklynite

That's not the way it works ...

... trainers usually get 2 - 4 shares ... making a $1,000,000 per share syndication worth $2-4 million for the trainer ...

... and it takes most trainers and awful lot of years to make that sort of money.

Meanwhile ... where is your football-field-long list of horses who have had multi-year championships or near-championships from a race-spacing regimen?

Why would you want a multi-year championship when so much money is available in the breeding shed without it ?

I mean you want evidence to prove your theory even though you agree that there is no incentive to campaign like you want horses to.

[blackthroatedwind]

I wouldn't suggest this is the only reason, by any stretch of the imagination, but isn't there some concern that one reason many of these horses have such well spaced campaigns is often the recovery time from whatever medication they may be using is substantial?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I wouldn't suggest this is the only reason, by any stretch of the imagination, but isn't there some concern that one reason many of these horses have such well spaced campaigns is often the recovery time from whatever medication they may be using is substantial?

Recovery time from the medication itself?

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Recovery time from the medication itself?

In essense. Basically I'm suspicious in general, and the fact that we often see dramatic improvements in horses who subsequently hold that form for one, or maybe two races, and then often disappear for what may be quite a while, if not forever, makes me think that medications that improve performance also take a heavy toll on the horses. Thus I figure the spacing between races is somewhat related.

I'm probably just overly paranoid.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

In essense. Basically I'm suspicious in general, and the fact that we often see dramatic improvements in horses who subsequently hold that form for one, or maybe two races, and then often disappear for what may be quite a while, if not forever, makes me think that medications that improve performance also take a heavy toll on the horses. Thus I figure the spacing between races is somewhat related.

I'm probably just overly paranoid.

It is quite possible that unusually huge, out of character races will put a horse on the shelf for a bit longer than usual. It is possible that some of these efforts may be chemically induced. But I also think that trainers and owners are more aware of these efforts and are apt to give a bit more time as not to be criticized by the press and sheet guys.

There is nothing worse than talking an owner into doing something a little unconventional and having the DRF guy who writes the write up on the edge of the form flame you. Or run in a race because the owner wants to and the guy calls you an idiot for running in that spot.

People in this business especially owners are monkeysee/monkey do.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I wouldn't suggest this is the only reason, by any stretch of the imagination, but isn't there some concern that one reason many of these horses have such well spaced campaigns is often the recovery time from whatever medication they may be using is substantial?

I think the lasix alone knocks them out. It just completely dehydrates them. I would think the lasix alone probably makes it so it takes a few more days to recover, especially if it's a very hot day.

[Cajungator26]

Since we're on the discussion of soundness, I want to know which stallions are the best to go to for SOUNDNESS. The day I own a racehorse, I want one that isn't fragile.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

Since we're on the discussion of soundness, I want to know which stallions are the best to go to for SOUNDNESS. The day I own a racehorse, I want one that isn't fragile.

The stallion is only 1/2 of the equation.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The stallion is only 1/2 of the equation.

I understand that, thanks.

Let me rephrase myself. IF I had a nice, SOUND mare to breed, which stallion should I consider?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

I understand that, thanks.

Let me rephrase myself. IF I had a nice, SOUND mare to breed, which stallion should I consider?

Depends on her breeding and physical type.

I think that there are lots of sound horses out there, thousands and thousands. However, most are SLOW.