Does Mine That Bird Win Again?

[boswd]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

You guys are right. They were grade 1's back then. One of the races went from grade 1 to no longer exists and the other is some weird grade 3 now.

Either way, 5 straight grade 1's. Invasor is one of the great champions of all time.

Yeah the Suburban droped a Grade to a II, I have no idea why and it's a very historical race and what happend to the Pimlico Special is just a damn shame. That race was a piece of Horse Racing Americana.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by boswd

Yeah the Suburban droped a Grade to a II, I have no idea why and it's a very historical race and what happend to the Pimlico Special is just a damn shame. That race was a piece of Horse Racing Americana.

It's because of the impact of the Dubai World Cup, plus the trainers' desire to have 4-6 weeks between races. The Foster and Whitney are now the two principle Eastern handicap races during the summer. The Iselin is another handicap race that essentially disappeared.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

It's because of the impact of the Dubai World Cup, plus the trainers' desire to have 4-6 weeks between races. The Foster and Whitney are now the two principle Eastern handicap races during the summer. The Iselin is another handicap race that essentially disappeared.

I just don't understand how based on the last three years you could possibly keep the Foster a G1 while downgrading the Suburban. Both had a HOY win once in the past three years. The other two winners of the Foster were Seek Gold and Flashy Bull. The other two winners of the Suburban were Political Force and Frost Giant. Can you really say that the Foster was deserving of remaining a G1 while the Suburban had to be downgraded on the basis of the last three years?

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

I just don't understand how based on the last three years you could possibly keep the Foster a G1 while downgrading the Suburban. Both had a HOY win once in the past three years. The other two winners of the Foster were Seek Gold and Flashy Bull. The other two winners of the Suburban were Political Force and Frost Giant. Can you really say that the Foster was deserving of remaining a G1 while the Suburban had to be downgraded on the basis of the last three years?

If based on the past three years, neither is probably deserving of Grade I status. That being said, my sense is that the weakness of the Foster winners is a reflection of the weakness in the handicap division; the weakness of the Suburban winners is a reflection of a race that has fallen out of favor.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

If based on the past three years, neither is probably deserving of Grade I status. That being said, my sense is that the weakness of the Foster winners is a reflection of the weakness in the handicap division; the weakness of the Suburban winners is a reflection of a race that has fallen out of favor.

It's a pretty sad state of racing when there is exactly one 10 furlong Grade 1 left for open competition on the dirt. There are more 10 furlong G1's restricted to 3yo fillies on the dirt.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

It's a pretty sad state of racing when there is exactly one 10 furlong Grade 1 left for open competition on the dirt. There are more 10 furlong G1's restricted to 3yo fillies on the dirt.

And the CCA Oaks is another historic race that is probably no longer deserving of its Grade I status.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

And the CCA Oaks is another historic race that is probably no longer deserving of its Grade I status.

I am not sure the tiarra needs to be deleted from the future. Just because it had a suspect field doesn't mean you toss the baby out with the bath water

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

If based on the past three years, neither is probably deserving of Grade I status. That being said, my sense is that the weakness of the Foster winners is a reflection of the weakness in the handicap division; the weakness of the Suburban winners is a reflection of a race that has fallen out of favor.

Based upon the quality of the older horse division in the US the last 2 years, no 3 and up race should be a Grade 1. The grading system is a huge waste of time and misleading anyway.

[boswd]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

It's because of the impact of the Dubai World Cup, plus the trainers' desire to have 4-6 weeks between races. The Foster and Whitney are now the two principle Eastern handicap races during the summer. The Iselin is another handicap race that essentially disappeared.

Yeah same thing as the Breeders Cup. As much as I love and think the sport deserves a day like the BC, I think it has ruined alot of great races, trainers want more time between races, don't want to push them too hard, will avoid competition all just for that one day.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by boswd

Yeah the Suburban droped a Grade to a II, I have no idea why and it's a very historical race and what happend to the Pimlico Special is just a damn shame. That race was a piece of Horse Racing Americana.

It just doesnt draw the same fields as it use to. the last few runnings have been a joke. When was the last "good" suburban?

For the record, i think MTB is a nice little horse and will certainly win a few. I just don't think he has a chance to be any more than that.

[boswd]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

It just doesnt draw the same fields as it use to. the last few runnings have been a joke. When was the last "good" suburban?

For the record, i think MTB is a nice little horse and will certainly win a few. I just don't think he has a chance to be any more than that.

The last good Suburban? Well that would be the one Invasor won


In regards to MTB, again we'll see, but I think I agree with you, he just has that air about him. Will grab a good one from time to time but ehhh.

I'll wait until after the Travers. I think MTB will take to this track.

Only time will tell.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by boswd

The last good Suburban? Well that would be the one Invasor won

Actually, the Suburban that Invasor won was a dismal edition. The last "good Suburban," relative to what was in the handicap division, was probably the 2004 edition won by Peace Rules.