Obama love

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124451592762396883.html

Instead of defending Obama, perhaps you should look a little deeper at his agenda and what it means to you in the future. The special interests are a disgrace but there are chilling proposals that are on the table.

Chuck, that is one of the worst articles I've ever read. I work for the Labor Department and used to work for the Bureau of Labor Statistics. I know how it all works and that article is as partisan as it gets. And I know that the unemployment rate will hit 11% most likely before we recover. What I'm yet to see is where your quote from Obama is that we would never get higher than 8% unemployment. That's what I'm looking for. Are you really just spouting crap from Foxnews or do you have a legit source that shows Obama making an idiotic statement like the above?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Chuck, that is one of the worst articles I've ever read. I work for the Labor Department and used to work for the Bureau of Labor Statistics. I know how it all works and that article is as partisan as it gets. And I know that the unemployment rate will hit 11% most likely before we recover. What I'm yet to see is where your quote from Obama is that we would never get higher than 8% unemployment. That's what I'm looking for. Are you really just spouting crap from Foxnews or do you have a legit source that shows Obama making an idiotic statement like the above?

I just dont know what to say. If you know how it works then surely you know what Obama's people are saying about the "jobs saved" or "created" is bunk. The Wall Street Journal is a legit source.

. During a March hearing of the Senate Finance Committee, Chairman Max Baucus challenged Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner on the formula.

"You created a situation where you cannot be wrong," said the Montana Democrat. "If the economy loses two million jobs over the next few years, you can say yes, but it would've lost 5.5 million jobs. If we create a million jobs, you can say, well, it would have lost 2.5 million jobs. You've given yourself complete leverage where you cannot be wrong, because you can take any scenario and make yourself look correct."

I suppose you will say that Baucus is partisan and wrong on the subject too?

[hi_im_god]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I just dont know what to say. If you know how it works then surely you know what Obama's people are saying about the "jobs saved" or "created" is bunk. The Wall Street Journal is a legit source.

. During a March hearing of the Senate Finance Committee, Chairman Max Baucus challenged Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner on the formula.

"You created a situation where you cannot be wrong," said the Montana Democrat. "If the economy loses two million jobs over the next few years, you can say yes, but it would've lost 5.5 million jobs. If we create a million jobs, you can say, well, it would have lost 2.5 million jobs. You've given yourself complete leverage where you cannot be wrong, because you can take any scenario and make yourself look correct."

I suppose you will say that Baucus is partisan and wrong on the subject too?

or he'll just point out how you avoided answering the question he asked.

we all make mistakes. it's okay to admit them. then the conversation moves on.

or you could throw up another non-sequitur quote.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by hi_im_god

or he'll just point out how you avoided answering the question he asked.

we all make mistakes. it's okay to admit them. then the conversation moves on.

or you could throw up another non-sequitur quote.

The Obama administration warned at the height of the stimulus debate that without the recovery package, the jobless rate would hit 8.8 percent in 2010 -- advisers had said the recovery package could hold unemployment to 7 percent.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009...lus-criticism/

[Cannon Shell]

http://blog.taragana.com/n/white-hou...on-jobs-59484/
The assessment was the same as what Obama’s economists forecast in January, when they predicted that the economic stimulus would prevent unemployment from rising above 8 percent. But unemployment reached 8.9 percent in April and the chairwoman of the Council of Economic Advisers, Christina Romer, said over the weekend that current predictions that unemployment would reach 9.5 percent were “pretty realistic.

[Cannon Shell]

The assessment was the same as what Obama's economists forecast in January, when they predicted that the economic stimulus would prevent unemployment from rising above 8 percent. But unemployment reached 8.9 percent in April and the chairwoman of the Council of Economic Advisers, Christina Romer, said over the weekend that current predictions that unemployment would reach 9.5 percent were "pretty realistic.

"http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D9849NH00&show_article=1


The quote is from an AP article

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

http://blog.taragana.com/n/white-hou...on-jobs-59484/
The assessment was the same as what Obama’s economists forecast in January, when they predicted that the economic stimulus would prevent unemployment from rising above 8 percent. But unemployment reached 8.9 percent in April and the chairwoman of the Council of Economic Advisers, Christina Romer, said over the weekend that current predictions that unemployment would reach 9.5 percent were “pretty realistic.

And where is your Obama quote? Now anyone who is categorized as an Obama economist by any media qualifies? Come on Chuck, you're better than that.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

And where is your Obama quote? Now anyone who is categorized as an Obama economist by any media qualifies? Come on Chuck, you're better than that.

I never said that Obama himself said it. Reread my post. Stop being petty and admit that Obama's people made this statement. Do you really think the AP and WSJ would print that assertion without it having been said? They made the statement that unemployment wouldnt go over 8% when talking up the stimulus package. If you guys would actually listen to what these people say maybe you wouldn't b so taken with his eloquent speeches.

http://otrans.3cdn.net/45593e8ecbd339d074_l3m6bt1te.pdf


This is Obama's team's assessment of th stimulus packages effect on unemployment. On page 5 reference the graph. Better than quotes, actual visual evidence.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I just dont know what to say. If you know how it works then surely you know what Obama's people are saying about the "jobs saved" or "created" is bunk. The Wall Street Journal is a legit source.

. During a March hearing of the Senate Finance Committee, Chairman Max Baucus challenged Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner on the formula.

"You created a situation where you cannot be wrong," said the Montana Democrat. "If the economy loses two million jobs over the next few years, you can say yes, but it would've lost 5.5 million jobs. If we create a million jobs, you can say, well, it would have lost 2.5 million jobs. You've given yourself complete leverage where you cannot be wrong, because you can take any scenario and make yourself look correct."

I suppose you will say that Baucus is partisan and wrong on the subject too?

Yes, I'm an expert on how everyone misuses statistics. I've worked in government the past seven years under both Republican and Democrats and both want to spin the same numbers the same way. I know how silly it is and I know how silly the numbers in the Wall Street Journal were. And if you can find an Obama quote where he said we'd never get above 8% unemployment then I'll laugh my ass off at that. But really I don't think he's that dumb to say that. Anyone with a clue knows the economy may be turning now but there is always an unemployment lag after the recession ends so we will hit 11% before this is all said and done. And for anyone who understands how the unemployment statistics works they will understand that it will actually be a positive thing. That may sound weird but the unemployment rate is the percentage of people seeking a job that cannot get one related to the total labor force. So that means anyone who has given up "or discouraged workers" as they are known, will not count in the unemployment rate. So later this year the economy picks up even though we are at 10.5% unemployment all other signs are positive that we are recovering. So guess what happens? All those discouraged workers suddenly start looking for jobs again, now instead of counting as out of the labor force they count as unemployed. So we wind up with the unemployment rate jumping even though the economy is recovering. It is the way it works and is why I'd be shocked if Obama was on record saying the unemployment rate would never get above 8%.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Yes, I'm an expert on how everyone misuses statistics. I've worked in government the past seven years under both Republican and Democrats and both want to spin the same numbers the same way. I know how silly it is and I know how silly the numbers in the Wall Street Journal were. And if you can find an Obama quote where he said we'd never get above 8% unemployment then I'll laugh my ass off at that. But really I don't think he's that dumb to say that. Anyone with a clue knows the economy may be turning now but there is always an unemployment lag after the recession ends so we will hit 11% before this is all said and done. And for anyone who understands how the unemployment statistics works they will understand that it will actually be a positive thing. That may sound weird but the unemployment rate is the percentage of people seeking a job that cannot get one related to the total labor force. So that means anyone who has given up "or discouraged workers" as they are known, will not count in the unemployment rate. So later this year the economy picks up even though we are at 10.5% unemployment all other signs are positive that we are recovering. So guess what happens? All those discouraged workers suddenly start looking for jobs again, now instead of counting as out of the labor force they count as unemployed. So we wind up with the unemployment rate jumping even though the economy is recovering. It is the way it works and is why I'd be shocked if Obama was on record saying the unemployment rate would never get above 8%.

At the beginning of January there were 134,300,000 people employed in the US
At the beginning of May there were 132,400,000 people employed in the US

How is this good?

And how exactly do they measure the amount of "discouraged" workers?

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

At the beginning of January there were 134,300,000 people employed in the US
At the beginning of May there were 132,400,000 people employed in the US

How is this good?

And how exactly do they measure the amount of "discouraged" workers?

It's not good! No one is saying that. Although if you seasonally adjust the data it isn't as bad as it looks. No one doubts we are in a recession, the question is when we are getting out of it. And the unemployment rate is the worst gauge of it cause of how it is calculated. And is exactly why I think you are making up that Obama ever said it wouldn't get over 8%.

As crazy as it sounds the national unemployment rate is 100% based on the monthly Current Population Survey where people answer questions and are designated as employed, unemployed, or not in the labor force. Further questions distinguish between your reason for not being in the labor force which includes the discouraged worker category.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

It's not good! No one is saying that. Although if you seasonally adjust the data it isn't as bad as it looks. No one doubts we are in a recession, the question is when we are getting out of it. And the unemployment rate is the worst gauge of it cause of how it is calculated. And is exactly why I think you are making up that Obama ever said it wouldn't get over 8%.

The unemployment rate is close to 10%. It is bad anyway you cut it. Who said we are getting out of the recession anytime soon?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

And the unemployment rate is the worst gauge of it cause of how it is calculated. And is exactly why I think you are making up that Obama ever said it wouldn't get over 8%.

ok

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

ok

And Obama never said it. Had you said members of Obama's economic team said it wouldn't get above 8% you would have at least been half right. If you wanted to make your point and be accurate (rarely a consideration on here) you would have said "the Obama team said if the stimulus bill wasn't passed the rate would go above 8% yet look where we are now with the stimulus bill having passed". That would be a valid statement and would have made your point.

[Danzig]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090608/...obama_stimulus


For the first time, the administration admitted the economic forecasts it used to sell the stimulus were overly optimistic.

"At the time, our forecast seemed reasonable," Vice President Joe Biden's top economic adviser, Jared Bernstein, said Monday, explaining that the White House underestimated the scope of the recession. "Now, looking back, it was clearly too optimistic."

and i remember reading before the plan was voted on that many economists said it was too optimistic.

then there's this:

Obama’s promise to create so many jobs — a vow Vice-President Joe Biden made last month — quickly drew criticism from oponents and economists who have argued his stimulus plan thus far has not delivered. “I think these estimates are overly optimistic,” said Arpitha Bykere, a senior analyst with RGE Monitor. Bykere said it likely will be later this year before any meaningful job creation occurs from stimulus spending. The administration had always viewed the summer as a peak for stimulus spending, as better weather permitted more public works construction and federal agencies had processed requests from states and others. The government reported last week that the number of unemployed continues to rise; the unemployment rate now sits at 9.4 percent, the highest in more than 25 years. Hundreds of thousands of Americans continue to lose jobs each month, although fewer jobs were lost last month than expected. Just how much of an impact Obama’s recovery program had on the pace of job losses is up for debate. Obama has claimed as many as 150,000 jobs saved or created by his stimulus plan so far, even as government reports have shown the economy has lost more than 1.6 million jobs since Congress approved funding for the program in February.

Critical
Republicans remain critical of the stimulus spending, slamming it as a big government program that ultimately will do little for recovery. With only a fraction of the federal money actually spent thus far, it’s premature to give the stimulus plan credit for economic trends, congressional Republicans said last week. “I think the economy is just as likely to begin to recover on its own, wholly aside from this, before much of this has an impact. So I’m very skeptical that this massive sort of spending binge that we’ve engaged in is going to have much of an impact,” said Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, a Republican. Obama initially offered his stimulus plan as a way to put people back to work, a promise that 3.5 million jobs would be saved or created. The administration’s predictions that unemployment would rise no higher than 8 percent already have been shattered, leaving Obama’s advisers to caution that job growth takes time, even as recovery spending intensifies.

[Danzig]

http://www.whitehouse.gov/president-...eekly-address/


We begin this year and this Administration in the midst of an unprecedented crisis that calls for unprecedented action. Just this week, we saw more people file for unemployment than at any time in the last twenty-six years, and experts agree that if nothing is done, the unemployment rate could reach double digits.


I know that some are skeptical about the size and scale of this recovery plan. I understand that skepticism, which is why this recovery plan must and will include unprecedented measures that will allow the American people to hold my Administration accountable for these results.