Dear Right...

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by pgardn

I am sure the issues are distinct for you.
Some parallels will bypass addicts that read
only what fits their model.

Govt spending on the whole is wasteful?
Its just your waste is another persons food.

The military spends money and creates jobs.
Social programs do nothing but make dependents.

I got it.

But in both areas we can find many instances of
incompetence and waste. You choose to emphasize
a certain type of waste. Liberals another.

And Obama has "unleashed (like Godzilla)" a spending
"spree" (shopping for women's lingere). Just tossing
dollars about randomly. No innuendo or opinion there.

The largest.
You got that right.

As far as who is supposed to build military items...
Apparently not INDEPEDENT private contractors. I guess
government run contractors, might as well be. Its getting
really hazy. But you might want a privatized military.

Stop your whining. How exactly do i know what fits my "model" before I read it? Just another attempt at discrediting the source rather than the issue.

Govt spending is generally wasteful by virtually ALL accounts. Remember there are 8500 earmarks we have not even delved into. How many of them wouldnt be considered wasteful except by the people that they benefit. Remember that unlike private business or individuals, the pols that direct the spending dont have much to gain by keeping the money.

You want to compare military spending and social programs? That is fine with me.

Lets see where to start. Military spending creates growth, benefits American businesses, provides good paying jobs, and provides tax revenue. Most social programs ****** growth, do zippo for American business, provide more govt mouths to feed, and eat up tax revenue.

Are you attempting to minimize Obama's spending or say that it something other than frighteningly enormous?

Just how many companies out there build tanks and attack fighters? It isnt fuzzy at all. People have complained about Hailburton except they always fail to point out that sometimes there is only one company that can do the job required. What then?

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Stop your whining. How exactly do i know what fits my "model" before I read it? Just another attempt at discrediting the source rather than the issue.

Govt spending is generally wasteful by virtually ALL accounts. Remember there are 8500 earmarks we have not even delved into. How many of them wouldnt be considered wasteful except by the people that they benefit. Remember that unlike private business or individuals, the pols that direct the spending dont have much to gain by keeping the money.

You want to compare military spending and social programs? That is fine with me.

Lets see where to start.
1. Military spending creates growth, benefits American businesses, provides good paying jobs, and provides tax revenue. Most social programs ****** growth, do zippo for American business, provide more govt mouths to feed, and eat up tax revenue.

2. Are you attempting to minimize Obama's spending or say that it something other than frighteningly enormous?
3. Just how many companies out there build tanks and attack fighters? It isnt fuzzy at all. People have complained about Hailburton except they always fail to point out that sometimes there is only one company that can do the job required. What then?

1. Then why the hell did Bush I and Clinton close military bases
in this city thereby SAVING govt. money? THis type of blanket
statement is just pure BS. Radar totally locked in.

2. Scares me to death... but so does having the flow of money
grind to a halt. What will happen if we let these large banks fail?
Nothing? There are tons of diff. opinions on what will happen immediately after they fall.

3. Fine. Then call a frggn spade a frggn spade. Haliburton is a
Nationalized company? As are other defense contractors that
build specialty items. And is it possible that they pull a little
too much money from taxpayers? So they are the only ones...
is it possible that they cheat,oh forget about it because they
are the only ones that can build. Good for the economy my arse.
They steal money from taxpayers just like people who dont belong on
welfare.

[timmgirvan]

P: you're all f'd up on#3! This is the time-worn Democratic answer and rant about anything involving Cheney. Haliburton got the contracts primarily because they have total package when needing to get something done. Does Haliburton have cost over-runs like GM or Boeing,probably...but I don't hear the bitching about them like Haliburton. And if you think that company
is stealing, then you might as well paint 'em all with that brush!

Originally Posted by timmgirvan

P: you're all f'd up on#3! This is the time-worn Democratic answer and rant about anything involving Cheney. Haliburton got the contracts primarily because they have total package when needing to get something done. Does Haliburton have cost over-runs like GM or Boeing,probably...but I don't hear the bitching about them like Haliburton. And if you think that company
is stealing, then you might as well paint 'em all with that brush!

Actually Cannon mentioned Haliburton.
I just went with that. I was listening to C-span
last night about some other companies and the dealings
that went on between the congress and these companies.

You dont hear bitching about GM? are you kidding?
That fkkn company took govt money to be spent researching
battery systems and used to for advertising their giant cars...

Pardon my language.

burp...

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by pgardn

1. Then why the hell did Bush I and Clinton close military bases
in this city thereby SAVING govt. money? THis type of blanket
statement is just pure BS. Radar totally locked in.

2. Scares me to death... but so does having the flow of money
grind to a halt. What will happen if we let these large banks fail?
Nothing? There are tons of diff. opinions on what will happen immediately after they fall.

3. Fine. Then call a frggn spade a frggn spade. Haliburton is a
Nationalized company? As are other defense contractors that
build specialty items. And is it possible that they pull a little
too much money from taxpayers? So they are the only ones...
is it possible that they cheat,oh forget about it because they
are the only ones that can build. Good for the economy my arse.
They steal money from taxpayers just like people who dont belong on
welfare.

Closing unnecessary bases and military spending on the whole are two entirely separate issues

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Closing unnecessary bases and military spending on the whole are two entirely separate issues

They are not separate issues.
The military spends money on military bases.
People lost unnecessary jobs...

So military spending can be wasteful.
I thought we agreed that a whole bunch of money
thrown at any agency by the govt. will produce waste.

There are a heck of a lot of good underpaid men and
women that deserve more money that do some of
the most difficult work of any US citizen. They
risk their mental health, their family structure- it is
a gigantic sacrifice.

And there are a hell of a lot of wasteful paper pushers
in the military. I know some of them. In the reserves
especially.

In general, as institutions get larger and complex,
oversight gets more difficult and waste occurs.
This is why I personally am
so fond of small businesses (like you run).

In a large frame of reference:

An entirely free market system does not exist in this country and never has. The government has always been involved in economic affairs varying in degree. At certain points in our history the economy has cratered and debates rage over the extent of government involvement in economic issues. A spectrum of beliefs reveal themselves.

The extremes:

RIGHT: Too much government involvement fostered, ignited, created an economic downturn and more government involvement will prolong, or even irreparably damage the economy.

LEFT: The market in this country is unable to regulate itself and the government has a major responsibility to restore the economy through whatever means necessary. Massive government intervention is not only necessary, but a duty. Our country needs a much more socialistic flavor.

If anyone wishes to push the extremes out further, please do.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by pgardn

In a large frame of reference:

An entirely free market system does not exist in this country and never has. The government has always been involved in economic affairs varying in degree. At certain points in our history the economy has cratered and debates rage over the extent of government involvement in economic issues. A spectrum of beliefs reveal themselves.

The extremes:

RIGHT: Too much government involvement fostered, ignited, created an economic downturn and more government involvement will prolong, or even irreparably damage the economy.

LEFT: The market in this country is unable to regulate itself and the government has a major responsibility to restore the economy through whatever means necessary. Massive government intervention is not only necessary, but a duty. Our country needs a much more socialistic flavor.

If anyone wishes to push the extremes out further, please do.

It is far more complex than this.

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

It is far more complex than this.

This is why I put a large frame of reference and called it
a spectrum. I think it is a good summary.

Primarily because I wrote it.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by pgardn

They are not separate issues.
The military spends money on military bases.
People lost unnecessary jobs...

So military spending can be wasteful.
I thought we agreed that a whole bunch of money
thrown at any agency by the govt. will produce waste.

There are a heck of a lot of good underpaid men and
women that deserve more money that do some of
the most difficult work of any US citizen. They
risk their mental health, their family structure- it is
a gigantic sacrifice.

And there are a hell of a lot of wasteful paper pushers
in the military. I know some of them. In the reserves
especially.

In general, as institutions get larger and complex,
oversight gets more difficult and waste occurs.
This is why I personally am
so fond of small businesses (like you run).

Welcome to the "new America

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

mumble, mumble, mumble. babble, babble, babble. blah, blah. with some questions sprinkled in here and there.

I sometimes get the sad feeling that rather than spending your days as a teenager doing productive things like playing video games, watching porn, gambling, and climbing up on the top of your parents house to throw eggs in the neighbors swimming pool ... you wasted them around sour rich people at places wherever sour rich people gather.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

I sometimes get the sad feeling that rather than spending your days as a teenager doing productive things like playing video games, watching porn, gambling, and climbing up on the top of your parents house to throw eggs in the neighbors swimming pool ... you wasted them around sour rich people at places wherever sour rich people gather.

unfortunately for you your own troubled childhood and its continuance into young adulthood doesnt equate to mine. I grew up in Saratoga. You cant get much better than that.

[herkhorse]

Saratoga is loaded with sour rich people.