ahh..the good ole days..

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

honestly, I could care less whether we torture terrorists or not. I think we should get as much info out of terrorists as we can...

They are people who all they care about is killing us.

Do you think if they captured our soldiers or workers over there (which they do) they think "Oh, well it may be unethical to torture this guy... so we'll just not do it" HELL NO... they behead you on camera and then post it online and on TV.

I was very upset at CNN and the other news outlets for all the publicity they give to Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo Bay. All they are doing is feeding the Middle Eastern Terrorists more fuel for the fire. There were a lot of contractors kidnapped and beheaded over there when the Abu Ghraib situation was in the news all the time. I think it was shameful for the news outlets to make US out to be the bad guys. Anti-America propaganda used to make the world hate us a little more.

i think so too...
by the same token, we can't torture prisoners and then take offense when they treat our men and women in a similar manner. that is not to say that we should put enemy combatants up in a hilton garden inn either.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i think so too...
by the same token, we can't torture prisoners and then take offense when they treat our men and women in a similar manner. that is not to say that we should put enemy combatants up in a hilton garden inn either.

treat in a similar manner? LMAO we cutting heads off? or hanging them off bridges and setting them on fire? Didn't think so.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

treat in a similar manner? LMAO we cutting heads off? or hanging them off bridges and setting them on fire? Didn't think so.

i just read yesterday about a case against one of our own soldiers for blindfolding and then shooting four iraqis in the head. so, no, not a beheading-but certainly in a similar vein. glad you find it all so amusing.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i just read yesterday about a case against one of our own soldiers for blindfolding and then shooting four iraqis in the head. so, no, not a beheading-but certainly in a similar vein. glad you find it all so amusing.

I'm sure he'll be treated like a hero similar to how they treat theirs? And somehow I missed that story. A link would be helpful. Thanks

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

I'm sure he'll be treated like a hero similar to how they treat theirs? And somehow I missed that story. A link would be helpful. Thanks

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/...5lvbAD96E0T180


http://www.startribune.com/world/396...D3aPc:_Yyc:aUU

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Danzig

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/...5lvbAD96E0T180


http://www.startribune.com/world/396...D3aPc:_Yyc:aUU

Thanks not sure how the Chicago papers missed it as the guy is from Lockport about 30 miles south. "Facing life in a military prison," you left that out. By accident?

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

Thanks not sure how the Chicago papers missed it as the guy is from Lockport about 30 miles south. "Facing life in a military prison," you left that out. By accident?

yeah, i also left out all the other details in my passing reference to the case-like others involved, where the trial was, where the shootings occurred, etc, etc.

[Danzig]

i just want to be very clear here. i don't think we are 'just like them' or acting 'just like them'. and i want it to stay that way. i get that war is hell, i understand we must take care of ourselves first. but we don't need to cross a fine line, where we become almost like what we're fighting-and try to justify it by saying we're the ones wearing the white hats here.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i just want to be very clear here. i don't think we are 'just like them' or acting 'just like them'. and i want it to stay that way. i get that war is hell, i understand we must take care of ourselves first. but we don't need to cross a fine line, where we become almost like what we're fighting-and try to justify it by saying we're the ones wearing the white hats here.

I'm sure many will disagree but in a war you pick a side and do what you can to win. There is no high road when dealing with terrorists, there is no credit given to moral treatment of prisoners or civilians. You are dealing with savages with no morals, many trying to use violence against our troops as a way to gain respect and power in their little world. Trying to fight a "fair" way just leads to defeat in both reality and in the public opinion.

[AeWingnut]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I'm sure many will disagree but in a war you pick a side and do what you can to win. There is no high road when dealing with terrorists, there is no credit given to moral treatment of prisoners or civilians. You are dealing with savages with no morals, many trying to use violence against our troops as a way to gain respect and power in their little world. Trying to fight a "fair" way just leads to defeat in both reality and in the public opinion.

http://blogs.news.com.au/dailytelegr...h/hassan_chop/



“The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property - either as a child, a wife, or a concubine - must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men.” – Sir Winston Churchill

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I'm sure many will disagree but in a war you pick a side and do what you can to win. There is no high road when dealing with terrorists, there is no credit given to moral treatment of prisoners or civilians. You are dealing with savages with no morals, many trying to use violence against our troops as a way to gain respect and power in their little world. Trying to fight a "fair" way just leads to defeat in both reality and in the public opinion.

calling this a war is a misnomer. terrorism is a form of criminality-we aren't fighting a country, a standing army-the 21st century version of germany or north korea. the tactics that won us 2 world wars will not work here. i know you can't fight a fair war, i just happen to think this should be treated in a different way, and that our army, navy and air force aren't the tools to be used.
gang wars in l.a. aren't handled by the u.s. military, and terrorism shouldn't and can't be either.

going into afganistan with arms and armor to remove that regime of course is an army job. finding isolated groups of terrorists and those who support them monetarily is not.
we need to assist other countries with law enforcement and investigations, and of course get bank accounts frozen who fund these guys. one of the side effects of the world economy going down the toilet is that $$ getting funneled to these groups is on a rapid decline.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Danzig

calling this a war is a misnomer. terrorism is a form of criminality-we aren't fighting a country, a standing army-the 21st century version of germany or north korea. the tactics that won us 2 world wars will not work here. i know you can't fight a fair war, i just happen to think this should be treated in a different way, and that our army, navy and air force aren't the tools to be used.
gang wars in l.a. aren't handled by the u.s. military, and terrorism shouldn't and can't be either.

going into afganistan with arms and armor to remove that regime of course is an army job. finding isolated groups of terrorists and those who support them monetarily is not.
we need to assist other countries with law enforcement and investigations, and of course get bank accounts frozen who fund these guys. one of the side effects of the world economy going down the toilet is that $$ getting funneled to these groups is on a rapid decline.

You are kidding right? You are comparing gang wars in LA and Iraq and Afganistan?

we need to assist other countries with law enforcement? What exactly are we doing?

Where do you get your info? The world economy is negatively effecting terror? So the heroin that they export isnt selling so well?

Wow.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i think so too...
by the same token, we can't torture prisoners and then take offense when they treat our men and women in a similar manner. that is not to say that we should put enemy combatants up in a hilton garden inn either.

LOL we are nothing like them.

If they treated us in a similar manner... we wouldnt be at war to begin with. I dont think ANY United States citizens would have been flying airplanes into buildings in Pakistan or Afghanistan.

I wish they treated our soldiers in a similar manner.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

LOL we are nothing like them.

If they treated us in a similar manner... we wouldnt be at war to begin with. I dont think ANY United States citizens would have been flying airplanes into buildings in Pakistan or Afghanistan.

I wish they treated our soldiers in a similar manner.

you do know that we staged a ground attack,inside pakistan,last fall? without their govt's knowledge or permissions beforehand? that 20 civilians were killed?
certainly not an attack like we experienced, but that's one hell of a way to treat our supposed allies. i'm sure we garnered good will from their populace by doing that. no doubt they're falling over themselves to give us more of a hand with our war on terror.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Danzig

you do know that we staged a ground attack,inside pakistan,last fall? without their govt's knowledge or permissions beforehand? that 20 civilians were killed?
certainly not an attack like we experienced, but that's one hell of a way to treat our supposed allies. i'm sure we garnered good will from their populace by doing that. no doubt they're falling over themselves to give us more of a hand with our war on terror.

We are going after Al Queda members who live in Pakistan. Obama has been doing that ever since he was elected. It is where the fighting should have been in the first place. Afghanistan and Pakistan.

Pakistan has really done wonders for the war on terror considering most of Al Queda stays in the mountains of the Pakistan, and Pakistan just allowed the Taliban to govern an area of the country.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

We are going after Al Queda members who live in Pakistan. Obama has been doing that ever since he was elected. It is where the fighting should have been in the first place. Afghanistan and Pakistan.

Pakistan has really done wonders for the war on terror considering most of Al Queda stays in the mountains of the Pakistan, and Pakistan just allowed the Taliban to govern an area of the country.

i know-i wrote my u.s. senator, and later this evening (just got home) i'm going to write the u.n.!

pakistan has been no help at all. all we can really hope to do (imo) is keep them out of here. if pakistan wants to live that way, more power to them. but they'll find they have made a deal with the devil, as the taliban will only pull similar action elsewhere, until the whole country is under islamic law.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i know-i wrote my u.s. senator, and later this evening (just got home) i'm going to write the u.n.!

pakistan has been no help at all. all we can really hope to do (imo) is keep them out of here. if pakistan wants to live that way, more power to them. but they'll find they have made a deal with the devil, as the taliban will only pull similar action elsewhere, until the whole country is under islamic law.

Pakistan has nukes. We need to do a little more than hope they deal with the taliban.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Pakistan has nukes. We need to do a little more than hope they deal with the taliban.

you're right, which is why i don't understand their move to placate the taliban, and let them have what they wanted in the swat valley region.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Pakistan has nukes. We need to do a little more than hope they deal with the taliban.

Good.

But Pakistan's problem ought not be the US taxpayers financial burden.

We've proved our point and wasted enough money there. It's time to get out. It's time we get out of there and prop up some pile of dung warlords to keep the Taliban busy.

Obviously we're never going to have the slightest bit of social influence over there - and we sure as hell ain't taking over the country.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Danzig

you do know that we staged a ground attack,inside pakistan,last fall? without their govt's knowledge or permissions beforehand? that 20 civilians were killed?
certainly not an attack like we experienced, but that's one hell of a way to treat our supposed allies. i'm sure we garnered good will from their populace by doing that. no doubt they're falling over themselves to give us more of a hand with our war on terror.

And you know without a doubt that
1. The Paki govt did not know
2. that the civilians killed were killed by americans or even were civilians?
3. The population isnt going to be against us regardless of what we do?
4. The billions of aid we give them isnt enough?