Manny...

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Pujols is better

I think Pujols needs to play for about 6 more years at a level similar to what his level is right now for that statement to really be true.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

I think Pujols needs to play for about 6 more years at a level similar to what his level is right now for that statement to really be true.

8 years isnt enough? He is a better hitter than ramirez period. He outpaces him in every meaningful stat. He is a better pure hitter, scores more, hits more doubles, hit the same amount of HR's and Rbis, strikeouts far less, walks more, is better hitter for average, has a better OBP, a higher slugging percentage and has played in a far weaker hitting park with lesser hitters hitting in front of him and behind him. He is also a tremendous playoff hitter and has never had anything even remotely close to an off year. If it werent for Bonds he would have 4 MVP's to add to this years.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

8 years isnt enough? He is a better hitter than ramirez period. He outpaces him in every meaningful stat. He is a better pure hitter, scores more, hits more doubles, hit the same amount of HR's and Rbis, strikeouts far less, walks more, is better hitter for average, has a better OBP, a higher slugging percentage and has played in a far weaker hitting park with lesser hitters hitting in front of him and behind him. He is also a tremendous playoff hitter and has never had anything even remotely close to an off year. If it werent for Bonds he would have 4 MVP's to add to this years.

All of this is true. i dont think that is a slight on Manny though. Pujols has been an incredible player. It will be interesting to see how his elbow holds up.

[ateamstupid]

Pujols is the best hitter in the game, period. Manny's great, but neither he nor Ortiz are on the same level as Pujols.

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

8 years isnt enough? He is a better hitter than ramirez period. He outpaces him in every meaningful stat. He is a better pure hitter, scores more, hits more doubles, hit the same amount of HR's and Rbis, strikeouts far less, walks more, is better hitter for average, has a better OBP, a higher slugging percentage and has played in a far weaker hitting park with lesser hitters hitting in front of him and behind him. He is also a tremendous playoff hitter and has never had anything even remotely close to an off year. If it werent for Bonds he would have 4 MVP's to add to this years.

No it's not enough. Ramirez has hit over .320 4 times in his 30s. Pujols is still 28. Ramirez hit .349 at age 30 and .332 at age 36. There is every chance Pujols will be better in his 30s than Ramirez and from age 21 through age 28 PUjols has compiled better numbers than Ramirez....fine. It's way too early for me to say which one is definitively better. Was Pass was a better two year old than Curlin. Which one is better?? I still think longevity counts for something in both baseball and horse racing. Ramirez has done it at the highest level for 15 years now. Pujols hasn't done that yet. He likely will which is fine. When he does that I'll say he is definitively better. He'll never have better hair than Manny however.

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Wow. That was some horse racing analogy too.

It was horrible without question. Albert Pujols was 28 this year. Manny Ramirez had a better year at 28 than Pujols did this year.

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

It was horrible without question. Albert Pujols was 28 this year. Manny Ramirez had a better year at 28 than Pujols did this year.

LOL, Pujols hit .357 with 37 and 116. At 28, Manny hit .351 with 38 and 122. To you that's distinctively better? Manny also walked 86 times that year with 117 strikeouts, while this year Pujols walked 104 times with 54 strikeouts.

To me, walks to strikeout ratio is a very underrated statistic when it comes to judging hitters. Pujols hasn't had 70 strikeouts in a season since his rookie year, while Manny has had 100+ in 11 seasons. Even if you want to say their AVG/HR/RBI numbers are similar (which isn't really true), Pujols' ability to always make contact is unmatched by Manny (or just about anyone of his caliber).

[Mortimer]

Jhonny being Jhonny.

[Cannon Shell]

Honestly i'm not knocking manny in any way just pointing out the media frenzy that surrounds every guy that acts a little crazy. He is not the greatest righthanded batter right now let alone all time. There are other guys like Hank Aaron, Joe D, Willie Mays, Frank Robinson, Jimmie Foxx, in addition to Pujols who the media seems to have forgotten or worse just doesnt know about or ignores. Manny is a great hitter and you can say he is in the conversation but imo after 8 years Pujols is a better overall hitter than Manny.

[Mortimer]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Honestly i'm not knocking manny in any way just pointing out the media frenzy that surrounds every guy that acts a little crazy. He is not the greatest righthanded batter right now let alone all time. There are other guys like Hank Aaron, Joe D, Willie Mays, Frank Robinson, Jimmie Foxx, in addition to Pujols who the media seems to have forgotten or worse just doesnt know about or ignores. Manny is a great hitter and you can say he is in the conversation but imo after 8 years Pujols is a better overall hitter than Manny.

Double X is baseballs best kept secret.


Fans should take a look at his career record. It's amazing.When he was done he was 2nd to Ruth in hr's.

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by Mortimer

Jhonny being Jhonny.

You don't want me to start talking Jhonny do you??

I agree with Cannon that through 8 years of their careers...Pujols' first 8 years were better than Manny's. I am stubborn, but not that stubborn. And 8 years from now people will likely be calling Pujols the best right handed hitter in the history of the game perhaps.

And morty...of all the Indians myriad of problems this year...Jhonny Peralta was about number 99 in the list of 100 problems they had...with Cliff Lee being number 100 on that list.

[timmgirvan]

So back to Manny....Dodgers have Manny,Furcal and Lowe as free agents. Who stays and who flies the coop? For my money, I definately keep Furcal, want to keep Lowe around(but would keep an eye out for others) and let Manny go, even though they need his pop. I heard he wants a 6yr deal..so see ya!

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Do you really need me to explain why it's a bad anaolgy?

NO...I stated it was horrible. All analogies can be picked apart as the one I used should be.