Big Brown is no Preakness lock

[kgar311]

Originally Posted by Better Than Honour

Does anyone know the status of Harlem Rocker for the Preakness. This horse will be a serious problem for Big Brown. Obviously I hope Big Brown doesn't turn out like Barbaro, but Harlem Rocker could be this year's Bernardini.

Harlem Rocker is this weeks Court Vision.

It absolutely nausiates my to come on this site and watch the blatent hating that goes on here. Everytime a horse puts in a spectacular performance here you people are to bring a horse back down to earth with stupid rants about, well he aint no Street Sense or Real Quiet or who ever you want to compare him to. Lets state Fact: He cant win out of the 20 post...Wrong, He cant win off of 3 races...wrong his feet wont hold up...wrong. This horse had the odds stacked aganst him and he shined like a champion. I would just like to hear the excuses on how he cant win the Belmont after winning the Preakness by 15.
According to you people he is the worst horse ever to win the Derby.

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by kgar311

Harlem Rocker is this weeks Court Vision.

It absolutely nausiates my to come on this site and watch the blatent hating that goes on here. Everytime a horse puts in a spectacular performance here you people are to bring a horse back down to earth with stupid rants about, well he aint no Street Sense or Real Quiet or who ever you want to compare him to. Lets state Fact: He cant win out of the 20 post...Wrong, He cant win off of 3 races...wrong his feet wont hold up...wrong. This horse had the odds stacked aganst him and he shined like a champion. I would just like to hear the excuses on how he cant win the Belmont after winning the Preakness by 15.
According to you people his is the worst horse ever to win the Derby.

Well, I really didn't think there was any way Smarty Jones could lose the Belmont after winning the Preakness by 15. Then they ran the race. I don't think anyone has ever called him the worst horse to ever win the Derby one single time. I think what you are seeing is people questioning the strength of this crop of 3 yr olds, a general dislike of his connections and looking for a way to beat the favorite at the window.

[kgar311]

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

Well, I really didn't think there was any way Smarty Jones could lose the Belmont after winning the Preakness by 15. Then they ran the race. I don't think anyone has ever called him the worst horse to ever win the Derby one single time. I think what you are seeing is people questioning the strength of this crop of 3 yr olds, a general dislike of his connections and looking for a way to beat the favorite at the window.

Find me one thread where anybody gives this horse his due. Hell with the rest of the 18 piece of crap horses in the race. He drew away from the filly that was running out of her shoes and had the perfect trip. Just comparing what he did to her makes him special in my book. He single handedly broke that horse down because she ran her heart out to catch him and couldnt come close. And I dont want to hear anythng about her being a filly she was an awesome specimen.

[Payson Dave]

Originally Posted by kgar311

Find me one thread where anybody gives this horse his due. Hell with the rest of the 18 piece of crap horses in the race. He drew away from the filly that was running out of her shoes and had the perfect trip. Just comparing what he did to her makes him special in my book. He single handedly broke that horse down because she ran her heart out to catch him and couldnt come close. And I dont want to hear anythng about her being a filly she was an awesome specimen.

Hell here is one from back in early March....

Originally Posted by kentuckyrosesinmay

I know I'm a little late on this but

Big Brown is an absolute monster, but everyone already knew that from his maiden win at the Spa. What was so impressive about his win at GP was that he was never asked to run, and was actually held back down the stretch. They don't want him running too hard to save something in the tank and for fear of injury. When the horse broke his maiden, he ran too hard.

And 21.20 is still very fast for a quarter mile workout even though at last year's Keeneland sale, the track was playing extremely fast. I think that the fastest quarter mile was 20 3/5ths at that sale if I remember correctly, which was a new world record. However, at a sale where the track is playing a little more fair, anything under 21 and 3/5ths is considered to be very fast.

I'm glad this one made it back to the track, and also Zada Belle. Now if Gilchrist could only get Indyanne straight, and a certain trainer could get his monster to the races...that would be great! Also would like to see Magnificience come back.

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by kgar311

Find me one thread where anybody gives this horse his due. Hell with the rest of the 18 piece of crap horses in the race. He drew away from the filly that was running out of her shoes and had the perfect trip. Just comparing what he did to her makes him special in my book. He single handedly broke that horse down because she ran her heart out to catch him and couldnt come close. And I dont want to hear anythng about her being a filly she was an awesome specimen.

I'll just say he's a very good horse right now. That's as far as I am willing to go. I also don't think he is remotely close to being the worst Ky Derby winner despite the lack of class he beat. There have been a million Big Brown threads, I'm sure at some point someone said good things about him.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by kgar311

Harlem Rocker is this weeks Court Vision.

I stopped reading after this comment.

I'm assuming I didn't miss much.

[kgar311]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I stopped reading after this comment.

I'm assuming I didn't miss much.

Start making the excuses for Harlem Rocker right now on why he couldnt hold BB's jock in the Preakness

[The Bid]

I dont think hell need any excuses.

I would like to see Miners Claim run on a dirt surface, Preakness would be nice

[lemoncrush]

Originally Posted by The Bid

I dont think hell need any excuses.

I would like to see Miners Claim run on a dirt surface, Preakness would be nice

As would I. I know Casse shipped him back to Toronto, and mentioned possibly trying one of the big summer stakes (Haskell or Travers), although with only 2 races this year, he would seem fit to try the Preakness if they wanted.

I'd also like to see Ready's Echo, but that's probably unlikely. Pletcher mentioned on At the Races a few weeks ago that they may try him in the Peter Pan.

[zippyneedsawin]

Originally Posted by lemoncrush

As would I. I know Casse shipped him back to Toronto, and mentioned possibly trying one of the big summer stakes (Haskell or Travers), although with only 2 races this year, he would seem fit to try the Preakness if they wanted.

I'd also like to see Ready's Echo, but that's probably unlikely. Pletcher mentioned on At the Races a few weeks ago that they may try him in the Peter Pan.

He's listed among the probables for the Peter Pan, according to DRF.

[Better Than Honour]

Harlem Rocker is a very serious racehorse. He threw up a 106 beyer and he is still very green. This isn't Pyro or Colonel John. This is a horse that has proven he is fast. There is no reason to think he can't run a 110 beyer and that puts him right in the ballpark.

Like I said it the title of this post, Big Brown in no lock. He is your likely winner but no lock. The Harlem Rocker- Bernardini comparison has to be made. Harlem Rocker beat a very good horse in the Withers, very easily.

[cakes44]

Harlem Rocker got his big figure with a perfect trip sitting 3rd, 2 lengths off a contested 46.4 and 109.4 pace, in a 4 horse field. Big Brown received his last 2 #s starting from the dang parking lot.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by cakes44

Harlem Rocker got his big figure with a perfect trip sitting 3rd, 2 lengths off a contested 46.4 and 109.4 pace, in a 4 horse field. Big Brown received his last 2 #s starting from the dang parking lot.

Actually it was a relatively slow pace that gave the favored leader a strong advantage and forced Harlem Rocker to run closer to the pace than he would prefer. Despite the advantage to the leader, and disadvantage to Harlem Rocker, he ran J Be K down with the utmost of ease.

Harlem Rocker may prove better suited to a mile than longer distances, and while yet to prove himself a superstar whatsoever, Big Brown is a very nice horse, so the Preakness would be difficult for him to win. However, make no mistake, Harlem Rocker is a very good racehorse.

[kgar311]

Originally Posted by Better Than Honour

Harlem Rocker is a very serious racehorse. He threw up a 106 beyer and he is still very green. This isn't Pyro or Colonel John. This is a horse that has proven he is fast. There is no reason to think he can't run a 110 beyer and that puts him right in the ballpark.

Like I said it the title of this post, Big Brown in no lock. He is your likely winner but no lock. The Harlem Rocker- Bernardini comparison has to be made. Harlem Rocker beat a very good horse in the Withers, very easily.

And you are right anything can happen in a race but I just cant get over the fact that NOBODY on this site can give credit where credit is due. It seems that so many people here are miserable in their own lives that they cant bring it upon themselves to give a little pat on the back to anyone that deserves it. Im Glad for Dutrow who is a NY trainer, living out of a stall about ten years ago, id be cocky too if I had a horse like that. And wow the owners found some success and their celebrating and you people cant stand it. Good for all of them.

[Better Than Honour]

Originally Posted by kgar311

And you are right anything can happen in a race but I just cant get over the fact that NOBODY on this site can give credit where credit is due. It seems that so many people here are miserable in their own lives that they cant bring it upon themselves to give a little pat on the back to anyone that deserves it. Im Glad for Dutrow who is a NY trainer, living out of a stall about ten years ago, id be cocky too if I had a horse like that. And wow the owners found some success and their celebrating and you people cant stand it. Good for all of them.

The horse is getting plenty of credit. He is an incredible animal but right now his success has a lot to do with the lack of talent. He will eventually have to beat a good horse.

As for Dutrow, he is a great horseman. The reputation he has is not because he gets caught cheater sometimes but because he shows no remorse. I would rather see somebody like Kiaran McLaughlin get a horse like this but it isn't like Dutrow hasn't paid his dues. He is as deserving as anyone.

As for IEAH, I am just not a fan of what they are trying to do to the horse business. But they are good at what they do.

[The Bid]

They are good at marketing

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by Better Than Honour

As for Dutrow, he is a great horseman. The reputation he has is not because he gets caught cheater sometimes but because he shows no remorse. I would rather see somebody like Kiaran McLaughlin get a horse like this but it isn't like Dutrow hasn't paid his dues. He is as deserving as anyone.

Dutrow's reputation is what it is because he has been caught cheating (who knows how many times he hasn't been caught cheating) and he shows no remorse.

As for saying that he is as "deserving as anyone," I think a lot more of the vast majority of people in this industry.

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by kgar311

And you are right anything can happen in a race but I just cant get over the fact that NOBODY on this site can give credit where credit is due. It seems that so many people here are miserable in their own lives that they cant bring it upon themselves to give a little pat on the back to anyone that deserves it. Im Glad for Dutrow who is a NY trainer, living out of a stall about ten years ago, id be cocky too if I had a horse like that. And wow the owners found some success and their celebrating and you people cant stand it. Good for all of them.

What the hell are you talking about? There's been plenty of praise for him and his effort. And real classy saying how impressed you were by Big Brown "breaking down" Eight Belles himself.

[kgar311]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

What the hell are you talking about? There's been plenty of praise for him and his effort. And real classy saying how impressed you were by Big Brown "breaking down" Eight Belles himself.

Im glad you saw that I was impressed with that. My tears were for the Joy of BB winning. Idiot.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by kgar311

And you are right anything can happen in a race but I just cant get over the fact that NOBODY on this site can give credit where credit is due.

You're not talking to people that have problems giving out credit.I just think it's very difficult to know who to give the credit to.So,if this horse isn't getting the credit you'd like to see,then it's because a lot of us have no idea how good he is.I can't say that another trainer would have got him to run this well.I can't say he is doing this on his own.I don't know.If you want to see a horse get full props then people need to be pretty sure he is doing it all on his own. Many people have doubts about that.They are skeptical of it.This is the price someone pays when they have multi suspensions for breaking the rules.Nobody knows how good his horse actually is.Do I know how good Benny the Bull,Kip Deville,and Big Brown really are? No,sorry, I don't know that.Given these 3 horses,would any other trainer have the country's best turf miler,sprinter,and 3 year old? Would Diamond Stripes have had that extra reserve energy to come back(after being easily passed in the stretch) and win the Godoplhin Mile?Would another trainer been able to get Big Brown to win with the 20th post in the Derby,and the 12 post at Gulfstream? If your answer is yes,then give Big Brown the credit.If your like many here(with doubts about it,)then we honestly don't have any idea how much credit to give the horse.You're asking us to give credit,and we don't know where it goes.