Past Posting Proven once again.....perhaps 49 combinations of one race!!

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Mumtaz

I'll try that at Keeneland meet, just to see if it works (enter a horse to win, cancel just after the break) ... there are machines where I can readily see the break happen live for certain races.

Now, that's another thing I've noticed. I've seen where both Youbet and Xpressbet have a 1-2 second delay - or not - in the telecast of races vs. live. It varies, it's not consistent. I've watched many a race on Xpressbet or Youbet play out with the "live" call via "At The Races" (I'm listening via computer feed) on delay - but to hear the race feed via ATR play with the video on Xpressbet or Youbet delayed is weird.

Youbet video is delayed longer than TVG which is at least 10 seconds behind live.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Youbet video is delayed longer than TVG which is at least 10 seconds behind live.

So if the video is delayed to the ADW, and I can bet up until the video shows gate opening on my ADW at times - does that mean I am dumping into the pool long seconds after the real gate has opened at the track and the race is underway?

Sounds like it.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Mumtaz

So if the video is delayed to the ADW, and I can bet up until the video shows gate opening on my ADW at times - does that mean I am dumping into the pool long seconds after the real gate has opened at the track and the race is underway?

Sounds like it.

I had on the 2nd at OP on the computer and on HRTV at the same time today. TV was at least 10 seconds faster.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by cmfhb411

until we figure out how to shut down any chance of past-posting
( regardless of whether it's a bet or a cancellation ),
my idea ( see post 9-this thread ) is the best one available.

I keep telling you that they tried your idea and got so many complaints that they scraped it. At least come up with an original idea

[golfer]

The one horse in the last race at Aqueduct was 4-1 when the gate opened, 7-2 at the half mile pole, and 3-1 down the stretch, while winning by a handful.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by golfer

The one horse in the last race at Aqueduct was 4-1 when the gate opened, 7-2 at the half mile pole, and 3-1 down the stretch, while winning by a handful.

The 4-1 was the price BEFORE the flash when the gates open...

The 7-2 is the price BETWEEN the flash before the gates opened and at the opening of the gates...

The 3-1 is the price OFF THE FINAL TOTE FORCE which comes 10 seconds after the gates open...

Understand that these prices get into the television visual package in that order ONLY IF THERE IS A CHANGE IN THE RUNNING ORDER... The odds are NOT changing as the race is being run the way that visual makes it appear...

NO MNEY GETS IN THE POOL AFTER THE 10 SECOND FORCE..

[golfer]

Originally Posted by Kasept

The 4-1 was the price BEFORE the flash when the gates open...

The 7-2 is the price BETWEEN the flash before the gates opened and at the opening of the gates...

The 3-1 is the price OFF THE FINAL TOTE FORCE which comes 10 seconds after the gates open...

Understand that these prices get into the television visual package in that order ONLY IF THERE IS A CHANGE IN THE RUNNING ORDER... The odds are NOT changing as the race is being run the way that visual makes it appear...

NO MNEY GETS IN THE POOL AFTER THE 10 SECOND FORCE..

Steve, there is at least a 99% chance that all of the above is true, but can you speak with 100% certainty? Because if you can, you are privy to some information or computer programming code that I am not.
The bottom line is, just like with horsemen who want a level playing field, I only want all pari-mutual wagerers to have a completely level one as well. I don't care if you bet $10 or $10,000, NO ONE should have an advantage over another based on the tote system.
The problem, in my estimation, is the tracks have no financial interest in guaranteeing this, as they care not who wins and loses, as long as they get their $ off the top.

[fpsoxfan]

Originally Posted by golfer

The one horse in the last race at Aqueduct was 4-1 when the gate opened, 7-2 at the half mile pole, and 3-1 down the stretch, while winning by a handful.

The odds in that race were dancing like crazy from the first flash to last flash.
I wouldn't go jumping to any conclusions. The one was a Paraneck firster who took a lot of money at first flash and I was a little surprised. I don't remembering it drifting as high as 4-1.

[golfer]

Originally Posted by fpsoxfan

The odds in that race were dancing like crazy from the first flash to last flash.
I wouldn't go jumping to any conclusions. The one was a Paraneck firster who took a lot of money at first flash and I was a little surprised. I don't remembering it drifting as high as 4-1.

No conclusions drawn, just relating what I saw while betting on, then watching the race.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by cmfhb411

I get that people were complaining.
If you knew how to read, you would have noticed the portion of my previous post which stated "until we figure out".
Now everybody else, except you, seems to comprehend that my idea wasn't being proposed as a permanent deal.
Here are the facts:
Past-posting still exists, and the wagering public doesn't like it.
OK. If we shut off wagering 20 seconds earlier, past-posting stops.
But it only solves part of the problem. Our current systems can calculate final odds and display them no better than 45 seconds after the pools have been closed.
WHIIIIICH MEEEEEEANNNNNNS................now that the trust has been broken,
past-posting will still be suspected, since bettors will still see winners leave the
gate at 3/1 and cross the finish line at 9/5 odds.
There are two problems to be solved, not one.
The fans clearly want both issues addressed which can't be done overnight.
Therefore, we must bridge the gap between now and when that magical day reveals itself.
What's better than closing the pools 1-2 minutes before the gates open
as of today 3/29/2008 6:28 PM EST ?

Maybe you dont understand that way more customers were complaining when they tried it your way. There were big bettors that stopped betting on races at Churchill because they were tired of getting shutout or being forced to bet earlier than they wanted. They told management that they wouldnt be participating. So dont act like you have come up with some ingenious way to magically solve the problem. It has been attempted and was met with severe resistance from horseplayers.

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Maybe you dont understand that way more customers were complaining when they tried it your way. There were big bettors that stopped betting on races at Churchill because they were tired of getting shutout or being forced to bet earlier than they wanted. They told management that they wouldnt be participating. So dont act like you have come up with some ingenious way to magically solve the problem. It has been attempted and was met with severe resistance from horseplayers.

How do we know it isn't those same big bettors that are taking advantage of the flaws?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

How do we know it isn't those same big bettors that are taking advantage of the flaws?

There must be a lot of them because I was told they were getting a 100 complaints a day, more if there was some kind of delay at the gate.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by cmfhb411

Nothing magic or ingenious about it. You know the first time I brought this up ( and so does everyone else here. just look it up ) I took a trip down memory lane to complain about why the race tracks didn't stick to it despite the complaints.
Once again. Look it up. I never said this was something I came up with on my own. I'm just a fan of common sense.
Instead of mischaracterizing what I'm saying, try tell us what's better for the short run.

Everytime the issue is brought up you jump in with the same old, just shut down a minute before posttime. And everytime I repeat that they tried it but due to tremendous negative response, they stopped. So what makes you think that the same tremedous negative response wouldnt happen again? That is not even taking into consideration that the tracks almost never lose sight of the short term bottom line and how it would be negatively effected.

[fpsoxfan]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Everytime the issue is brought up you jump in with the same old, just shut down a minute before posttime. And everytime I repeat that they tried it but due to tremendous negative response, they stopped. So what makes you think that the same tremedous negative response wouldnt happen again? That is not even taking into consideration that the tracks almost never lose sight of the short term bottom line and how it would be negatively effected.

Not to mention the fact, how many times are the start of races delayed so that they can get to everyone in line. Like Chuck said, it was tried before and it SUCKED. And it will SUCK again if they decide to do this.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by cmfhb411

So unless we have the perfect solution immediately, stand by and do nothing.
sounds like an idea to me.

No, do something that has already failed

[Scav]

Originally Posted by cmfhb411

until we figure out how to shut down any chance of past-posting
( regardless of whether it's a bet or a cancellation ),
my idea ( see post 9-this thread ) is the best one available.

Arlington tried this after the P6 scandal, and people were livid, and rightfully so.

All these bozo's need to do is spend some money on technology and everything would be fixed. A simple sensor would solve ALL these problems.

[Riot]

All these bozo's need to do is spend some money on technology and everything would be fixed. A simple sensor would solve ALL these problems.

You are in the wrong major in school