Clemens: BigFATLIar

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Hey, John Rocker said no way ARod did anything. He is as credible as the trainer guy isnt he?

The funny thing is that HGH has not been proven effective at producing results like steroids have. It is not even hard to get.

May not be hard to get,but people need to make sure it can't be found out that you did get it(without a doctor confirming a deficiency.)Anything that is thought to make you look n' feel better is gunna be in demand.They just don't know enough about the effects on the body when you have excess HGH in you.If you take it without having a deficiency,then some think damn near everything starts growing. Could mean your heart enlarges,and for sure the joints will change.There are cancer concerns.I guess we will find out from the results these guys (guinea pigs) get in 15-20 years.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

May not be hard to get,but people need to make sure it can't be found out that you did get it(without a doctor confirming a deficiency.)Anything that is thought to make you look n' feel better is gunna be in demand.They just don't know enough about the effects on the body when you have excess HGH in you.If you take it without having a deficiency,then some think damn near everything starts growing. Could mean your heart enlarges,and for sure the joints will change.There are cancer concerns.I guess we will find out from the results these guys (guinea pigs) get in 15-20 years.

Search thet net for it, you can find about 8,000 places to quickly buy it. Anyone that wants it can just have a good friend get it for them. Going through a trainer who is supplying other people is just dumb cause that is the guy who is going to get busted and have to name names. The effects are still up for debate but it does increase muscle mass which could certainly create a placebo effect. Especially with how mental of a game baseball is.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Search thet net for it, you can find about 8,000 places to quickly buy it. Anyone that wants it can just have a good friend get it for them. Going through a trainer who is supplying other people is just dumb cause that is the guy who is going to get busted and have to name names. The effects are still up for debate but it does increase muscle mass which could certainly create a placebo effect. Especially with how mental of a game baseball is.

http://www.sabernomics.com/sabernomi...er-should-you/

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

http://www.sabernomics.com/sabernomi...er-should-you/

Right, hence the placebo effect. A guy is told this stuff will help him, sees his mucle mass increase, and suddenly starts player better cause he believes he is going to be better.

[Cannon Shell]

The fact that Congress is having hearing on this is troubling. The fact that this is simply political grandstanding over an issue that has no relevence to the American public at large and was not a crime comitted against anyone seems to have been missed by the media except in rare instances. HGH is readily available and just this morning there was a story on CNN about a Dr. in Beverly Hills who "specializes" in antiaging who admitted on camera on national tv that only about 25 % of his customers have a true medical need for it. If there truly are enforcable laws concerning this drug then they dont seem to be enforced. Despite my own personal enjoyment of the hearings there is only flimsy evidence that Congress should be involved with the internal regulations of a private enterprise. The NFL case concerning "spygate" is even a bigger farce. The fact that the NFL destroyed evidence on a technical matter concerning their own regulations after the guilty parties have been repremanded is NOT the business of Arlen Spector or any other Senator or congressman while they are on the federal govt's time. The constant threat of the antitrust excemption is just political bullying. I doubt that it is valid anyway. Other football leagues exist in the Arena league and the USFL and XFL were both failures. I personally find it troublesome that Congress has the time to spend on sports when there are so many other issues facing the country which are much more pressing but not nearly as interesting.

I mean is it in the best interest of the American people that we pursue a perjury case against Roger Clemens? What's next? Chuck Schumer calling for an investigation into the Yankees/Indians game that should have been halted due to flying insects? A congressional inquiry into the TENN/Rutgers womans game the other day when the clock "malfunctioned"?

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The fact that Congress is having hearing on this is troubling. The fact that this is simply political grandstanding over an issue that has no relevence to the American public at large and was not a crime comitted against anyone seems to have been missed by the media except in rare instances. HGH is readily available and just this morning there was a story on CNN about a Dr. in Beverly Hills who "specializes" in antiaging who admitted on camera on national tv that only about 25 % of his customers have a true medical need for it. If there truly are enforcable laws concerning this drug then they dont seem to be enforced. Despite my own personal enjoyment of the hearings there is only flimsy evidence that Congress should be involved with the internal regulations of a private enterprise. The NFL case concerning "spygate" is even a bigger farce. The fact that the NFL destroyed evidence on a technical matter concerning their own regulations after the guilty parties have been repremanded is NOT the business of Arlen Spector or any other Senator or congressman while they are on the federal govt's time. The constant threat of the antitrust excemption is just political bullying. I doubt that it is valid anyway. Other football leagues exist in the Arena league and the USFL and XFL were both failures. I personally find it troublesome that Congress has the time to spend on sports when there are so many other issues facing the country which are much more pressing but not nearly as interesting.

I mean is it in the best interest of the American people that we pursue a perjury case against Roger Clemens? What's next? Chuck Schumer calling for an investigation into the Yankees/Indians game that should have been halted due to flying insects? A congressional inquiry into the TENN/Rutgers womans game the other day when the clock "malfunctioned"?

Exactly. At least with baseball and HGH, even though the laws aren't enforced, they at least have actual laws. The NFL thing is a complete joke. Not only are they not laws but the regulations of a private league but the guilty party already ADMITTED that they were guilty. It's actually beyond a joke.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Again,it is no surprise a trainer wants to go easy on guys cheating to get an edge on the other competitors in the workplace.I'm sure there are guys that could have made another 5 mil if they had taken these drugs and hung around a couple more years. After 40, it's difficult to keep body fat off,and HGH does do that.That alone would help guys with stamina(whether real physical stamina,or that resulting from the positive mental aspects of being in shape.)

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Again,it is no surprise a trainer wants to go easy on guys cheating to get an edge on the other competitors in the workplace.I'm sure there are guys that could have made another 5 mil if they had taken these drugs and hung around a couple more years. After 40, it's difficult to keep body fat off,and HGH does do that.That alone would help guys with stamina(whether real physical stamina,or that resulting from the positive mental aspects of being in shape.)

At least we dont have to blow people like in the music business...

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

At least we dont have to blow people like in the music business...

daboatdon'tgonowhere.........<no,no>....

itjugoinacirco......<yea,yea>....

n' she justawearaponcho......<o' kay>...

n' daboat itjugoinacirco........<yea,yea>..

o'thisbedafellātiō........<o' kay>





I know..It's a mastapiece.What can I say? ITZAGIFT

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Again,it is no surprise a trainer wants to go easy on guys cheating to get an edge on the other competitors in the workplace.I'm sure there are guys that could have made another 5 mil if they had taken these drugs and hung around a couple more years. After 40, it's difficult to keep body fat off,and HGH does do that.That alone would help guys with stamina(whether real physical stamina,or that resulting from the positive mental aspects of being in shape.)

I'm not getting why you keep saying that people want to go easy on them. I don't think Cannon is saying that at all and I know I'm not. But nobody has said yet what congress can do to them other than go after the ones that denied it with perjury charges. All of the guys that admitted they used it, what can congress do to them? Nothing. And even going after the guys that denied it with perjury charges, is this really the best use of taxpayer money? Most people already believe they are lying anyway so why spend millions in taxpayer money to put them in jail for lying about something that most of us believed they were lying about anyway but still supported, as evidenced by baseball continually setting attendance and revenue records? Maybe you care Scuds and that's fine. But overall, the public believes they cheat and don't really care. There have got to be more pressing issues for congress to tackle than what grown men decide to put in their bodies to gain an edge. The only people they are hurting.....is themselves.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Maybe you care Scuds and that's fine. But overall, the public believes they cheat and don't really care. There have got to be more pressing issues for congress to tackle than what grown men decide to put in their bodies to gain an edge. The only people they are hurting.....is themselves.

Where you are wrong (both of you) is when you keep saying there is no crime against anybody.It's a lie.They illegally took HGH and or steroids without having A disease or A deficiency(OF HGH.) That's illegal.Now,that is not the biggest problem.The biggest problem is they took them to cheat somebody.You're not getting that part.The ethics involved here.This is cheating other players who had to compete with them.O.K.,and the fact you don't particularly care about cheating is because we don't go hard enough on people who cheat in professional situations.Kids see these guys get off,and they think it's o.k. to take bribes or whatever.Eventually ya just got a bunch of animals eating each other.If you don't have ethics in society,then the only thing that matters is who has the power at any given moment.Both of you have Machiavellian tendencies,and that's where this attitude comes from(this attitude that cheating is no big deal,and just get over it.)

You guys have no idea how many useless hearings go on besides baseball and steriods. You say these guys have better things to do... What? They grandstand with hearings all the time.

I personally hope they try Clemens for perjury. Make a statement to all these entertainers that they just cant lie to under oath and to Grand Juries. Lock him up and send a statement about lying.

I know one thing for sure. The most bizarre Congressman I have now ever seen is Dan/Don Barton from Indiana. Republicans should be absolutely ashamed of this idiot. I need to look into this guy and how the hell he got elected to do anything. He is a clown. Anybody from Indiana, help me with this guy...

[alysheba4]

Originally Posted by pgardn

You guys have no idea how many useless hearings go on besides baseball and steriods. You say these guys have better things to do... What? They grandstand with hearings all the time.

I personally hope they try Clemens for perjury. Make a statement to all these entertainers that they just cant lie to under oath and to Grand Juries. Lock him up and send a statement about lying.

I know one thing for sure. The most bizarre Congressman I have now ever seen is Dan/Don Barton from Indiana. Republicans should be absolutely ashamed of this idiot. I need to look into this guy and how the hell he got elected to do anything. He is a clown. Anybody from Indiana, help me with this guy...

....... i heard he is way out there, was all over clinton about the lewinski situation.........while he had fathered a child out of wedlock with one of his staff????

[MaTH716]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Where you are wrong (both of you) is when you keep saying there is no crime against anybody.It's a lie.They illegally took HGH and or steroids without having A disease or A deficiency(OF HGH.) That's illegal.Now,that is not the biggest problem.The biggest problem is they took them to cheat somebody.You're not getting that part.The ethics involved here.This is cheating other players who had to compete with them.O.K.,and the fact you don't particularly care about cheating is because we don't go hard enough on people who cheat in professional situations.Kids see these guys get off,and they think it's o.k. to take bribes or whatever.Eventually ya just got a bunch of animals eating each other.If you don't have ethics in society,then the only thing that matters is who has the power at any given moment.Both of you have Machiavellian tendencies,and that's where this attitude comes from(this attitude that cheating is no big deal,and just get over it.)

This is all in a fantasy world. These are baseball players we are talking about. They get paid millions of dollars to play a damn game! The Mitchell report and these hearings got nothing accomplished. It's all perception, the majority of people think that Bonds and Clemens took steroids. But has it been proved? OJ was found innocent, and the perception is that he is guilty. People are going to believe what they want. What about everyone else that admitted that they took steroids? Last time I checked nothing has happened. All I was saying is that I believe that there are plenty of other major issues that congressman could tackle if they wanted to. Cheating in baseball is the biggest crisis in the country, are they going to go after corked bats and spit balls next? Is Gaylord Perry even still alive to recieve a subpoena? As far as the children go, Roger Clemens and Barry Bonds should be the biggest problem I have to protect my children from, instead of some of the scum / maniacs out there. This whole process has been nothing more than political grandstanding and a waste of taxpayers money.

Originally Posted by MaTH716

This is all in a fantasy world. These are baseball players we are talking about. They get paid millions of dollars to play a damn game! The Mitchell report and these hearings got nothing accomplished. It's all perception, the majority of people think that Bonds and Clemens took steroids. But has it been proved? OJ was found innocent, and the perception is that he is guilty. People are going to believe what they want. What about everyone else that admitted that they took steroids? Last time I checked nothing has happened. All I was saying is that I believe that there are plenty of other major issues that congressman could tackle if they wanted to. Cheating in baseball is the biggest crisis in the country, are they going to go after corked bats and spit balls next? Is Gaylord Perry even still alive to recieve a subpoena? As far as the children go, Roger Clemens and Barry Bonds should be the biggest problem I have to protect my children from, instead of some of the scum / maniacs out there. This whole process has been nothing more than political grandstanding and a waste of taxpayers money.

Gaylord Perry was dealing with federally prohibited drugs?

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The fact that Congress is having hearing on this is troubling. The fact that this is simply political grandstanding over an issue that has no relevence to the American public at large and was not a crime comitted against anyone seems to have been missed by the media except in rare instances. HGH is readily available and just this morning there was a story on CNN about a Dr. in Beverly Hills who "specializes" in antiaging who admitted on camera on national tv that only about 25 % of his customers have a true medical need for it. If there truly are enforcable laws concerning this drug then they dont seem to be enforced.

Well,it is indeed illegal to take HGH without a prescription.It is indeed against the law to give it to patients without a deficiency or a specific disease (like Aids.) This doctor(Berger) in Beverly Hills will probably be investigated,and reprimanded(after making 2 or 3 million bucks.) If there was a way to give you the positive effects only(then they would be doing it.)Hormones affect a lot of organs in the body.If you have excess hormone in your body,then you will suffer long-term consequences. Go ahead n' try it.You will see hormones aren't as limited or( specific) in their action, as you would like.Don't take your body's organs for granted.You mess with them(by taking excess hormones,) and they can fail on you.The last thing you want to do is give the message to people that it's like taking a lil extra cough medicine(or extra-strong coffee.)

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Well,it is indeed illegal to take HGH without a prescription.It is indeed against the law to give it to patients without a deficiency or a specific disease (like Aids.) This doctor(Berger) in Beverly Hills will probably be investigated,and reprimanded(after making 2 or 3 million bucks.) If there was a way to give you the positive effects only(then they would be doing it.)Hormones affect a lot of organs in the body.If you have excess hormone in your body,then you will suffer long-term consequences. Go ahead n' try it.You will see hormones aren't as limited or( specific) in their action, as you would like.Don't take your body's organs for granted.You mess with them(by taking excess hormones,) and they can fail on you.

Was the one Congressman correct that it is illegal to take B-12 without a prescription as well? Loved it how Clemens immediately blamed his Mom for it.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Was the one Congressman correct that it is illegal to take B-12 without a prescription as well? Loved it how Clemens immediately blamed his Mom for it.

Yeah,lidocaine,and B-12 are both prescription injectables.I don't think this guy would have been licensed to inject them,either(especially Lidocaine=only at the site of an injury...not buttocks.)Usually,just nurses and doctors can give these injections. To me,the big thing is the fact he and the others cheated.I mean for some reason people don't seem to be bothered by a guy trying to cheat to beat opponents who need to win just as much as he does.If you saw a golfer cheat,the golfer would not just get away with it.

[whodey17]

Clemens can lie all he wants. Bush will just pardon him if he is charged with something.

[Cannon Shell]

McNamee should be indicted for perjury for saying that he never heard of Vitamin b-12. Where did he get his degree? Arizona State?