Circular Quay

I think that yes, the time may have been a tad slow, but that Romans filly that Blackthroat was speaking of was rumored before yesterday's race to be the real deal. That filly was amazing, breaking slow, a little rank, then had to go around them and just cruised. Shes going to be the fave in the Adirondack(I suspect the Schuylerville is too quick back for her).
I for one have always railed on about being leery of closing sprinters when they stretch out, but Quay isnt exactly just a closing sprinter. The fractions were hot and he wasn't all that far off. I think his crusing speed is pretty fast. The fact that he just starts to quicken near the end of the race is absolutely indicative of a horse who will relish going longer. WHen that occurs his cruising speed will keep him closer to the more moderate paces that races going longer will have.
I dunno who thinks he was tired but whoever that is needs to take a look again. He was not even sweaty on a warm day when he came back, he had the appearance of a horse who was in the paddock before a race. And to the poster who pointed out Rafael being unable to chill him out on the way back, I caught the same thing on tv. He looked like he was a handful coming back.
His intelligence is apparent as well, he appears to be a highly competitive and smart animal who actually understands his object out there, something that some horses never get and even more simply don't care about, ever.
As far as Scat daddy goes, i realize that the barn thinks hes the greatest thing they ever had. But hes a johannesburg and I don't like his future prospects to stretch nearly as much as I do Quay's. Many a barn has loved a horse who appeared to be the best ever they had and had another one achieve more.
Once upon a time there was a high profile barn(like Pletchers) that had a horse who from day one they told the media was the goods. He was very good and won the BC Juvenile. All the following spring the trainer and press spoke of nothing but him while his stable mate won some other stakes under the radar. Come Derby day they entered the gate with one being one of the faves and the other going off at a very long price. The glorified one ran 3rd to his stable mate who went off at 28-1. The glorified one did go on to win the Preakness, but his stable mate kept grinding out wins in races like the Belmont, Swaps, and Travers. The horses name? Thunder Gulch, who outperformed Timber Country. I wouldn't be at all shocked if his son Quay went on to outperform Scat Daddy.

[Thunder Gulch]

I'm a believer in Q- can we keep that nickname?

Circular Quay is not a fast horse. Nothing special there other than that he was ready earlier. If you think this horse is special and has a big future based on 2 slow races in the spring of the 2yr old season you know nothing about horses. Most of the big names you will hear next spring have not even raced yet. Everyone knows that. These early races like the Bashford every year get people talking about how great they are and they almost always flame out. If early races mean anything I guess those AP Indys should just pack it in.

Originally Posted by Hoisttheflag

Circular Quay is not a fast horse. Nothing special there other than that he was ready earlier. If you think this horse is special and has a big future based on 2 slow races in the spring of the 2yr old season you know nothing about horses. Most of the big names you will hear next spring have not even raced yet. Everyone knows that. These early races like the Bashford every year get people talking about how great they are and they almost always flame out. If early races mean anything I guess those AP Indys should just pack it in.

Ah the doubter returns!!! Yeah you are right, you would never wanna own one like that. Absolutely no talent at all.

Originally Posted by oracle80

Ah the doubter returns!!! Yeah you are right, you would never wanna own one like that. Absolutely no talent at all.

He won't even be a top 5 3yr old in that barn. He is not fast and everyone knows it. Typical Bashford Manor mediocrity. TWO YEAR OLD RACING AT THIS TIME OF YEAR MEANS NOTHING. How difficult is that for you to understand. It means they grew a little quicker, nothing else. This one isn't even fast.

Originally Posted by Hoisttheflag

He won't even be a top 5 3yr old in that barn. He is not fast and everyone knows it. Typical Bashford Manor mediocrity. TWO YEAR OLD RACING AT THIS TIME OF YEAR MEANS NOTHING. How difficult is that for you to understand. It means they grew a little quicker, nothing else. This one isn't even fast.

Umm, ok, whatever you say.

Originally Posted by oracle80

Umm, ok, whatever you say.

You think you know everything and know Pletcher, go ask the barn what they have. He is not a top 5 2yr old in that barn. He is running in sprints and he isn't even running faster than the girls.

[miraja2]

Originally Posted by Hoisttheflag

He won't even be a top 5 3yr old in that barn. He is not fast and everyone knows it. Typical Bashford Manor mediocrity. TWO YEAR OLD RACING AT THIS TIME OF YEAR MEANS NOTHING. How difficult is that for you to understand. It means they grew a little quicker, nothing else. This one isn't even fast.

Yeah he might not be a top 5yr old three years from now either. WHO CARES!
Nobody talked about how this horse would do next spring. You sound like those of us who are excited about the horse predicted he would win the Derby and the BC Classic next year. Nobody did! We are smart enough to know that it is impossible to predict who will be good 3yo the previous July. This horse looks like a very good 2yo to me (and others). If he stays healthy I like his chances in some of the bigger 2yo races this fall. That is what I said to begin this thread, and I still think that. If you disagree with that, fine. But please don't make it seem like we were saying he was lock to win the Derby or anything like that. ArlJim is right. YOU were the one to bring up how good he would be as a 3yo.

Originally Posted by miraja2

Yeah he might not be a top 5yr old three years from now either. WHO CARES!
Nobody talked about how this horse would do next spring. You sound like those of us who are excited about the horse predicted he would win the Derby and the BC Classic next year. Nobody did! We are smart enough to know that it is impossible to predict who will be good 3yo the previous July. This horse looks like a very good 2yo to me (and others). If he stays healthy I like his chances in some of the bigger 2yo races this fall. That is what I said to begin this thread, and I still think that. If you disagree with that, fine. But please don't make it seem like we were saying he was lock to win the Derby or anything like that. ArlJim is right. YOU were the one to bring up how good he would be as a 3yo.

I am all for reason, and a reasonable person sees a nice horse, not "the best 2yr old in the last 10yrs". He's an ok horse, every single year we get these early budding 2yr olds and every year they flame out. His times are nothing special and I know for certain they think they have numerous better 2yr olds in their barn. That is just the Pletcher barn too. Last I checked other trainers have 2yr olds too. We haven't even seen Pletcher's $16M horse either. The Dogwood horse is a significantly better horse than CQ. I would expect Pletcher to keep CQ away from him as long as possible.

[miraja2]

"TWO YEAR OLD RACING AT THIS TIME OF YEAR MEANS NOTHING."

I don't understand it when people say things like this.
I guess they mean it doesn't help you predict who will win the TC races 10 months from now.....which is obvioulsy true. But I mean, come on, they still mean something. It was still a stakes race. They do give out an eclipse award for 2yo and I would think graded stakes wins probably are a factor in determining that.
If all you care about is the TC races then I suppose you are correct, they don't mean anything. I enjoy watching 2yo racing for its own sake, and NOT because I may be watching a horse that might possibly compete in the Kentucky Derby.

Originally Posted by miraja2

"TWO YEAR OLD RACING AT THIS TIME OF YEAR MEANS NOTHING."

I don't understand it when people say things like this.
I guess they mean it doesn't help you predict who will win the TC races 10 months from now.....which is obvioulsy true. But I mean, come on, they still mean something. It was still a stakes race. They do give out an eclipse award for 2yo and I would think graded stakes wins probably are a factor in determining that.
If all you care about is the TC races then I suppose you are correct, they don't mean anything. I enjoy watching 2yo racing for its own sake, and NOT because I may be watching a horse that might possibly compete in the Kentucky Derby.

No, it means 2yr olds change quickly and you haven't see most of them yet.
This horse is not one of the best "2yr olds in the last ten years" which is really the argument being made by one poster on this thread. That statement is insanity.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by miraja2

"TWO YEAR OLD RACING AT THIS TIME OF YEAR MEANS NOTHING."

I don't understand it when people say things like this.
I guess they mean it doesn't help you predict who will win the TC races 10 months from now.....which is obvioulsy true. But I mean, come on, they still mean something. It was still a stakes race. They do give out an eclipse award for 2yo and I would think graded stakes wins probably are a factor in determining that.
If all you care about is the TC races then I suppose you are correct, they don't mean anything. I enjoy watching 2yo racing for its own sake, and NOT because I may be watching a horse that might possibly compete in the Kentucky Derby.

i can't understand it either, especially when you consider that five of the past fourteen derby winners debuted in June and July. I remember that stat because I looked it up myself and posted it on the previous Circular Quay thread when he broke his maiden. This thread is almost a repeat of that one post for post. I guess some people just have no problem continuously regurgitating their insane statements.

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

i can't understand it either, especially when you consider that five of the past fourteen derby winners debuted in June and July. I remember that stat because I looked it up myself and posted it on the previous Circular Quay thread when he broke his maiden. This thread is almost a repeat of that one post for post. I guess some people just have no problem continuously regurgitating their insane statements.

If you mean "the best 2yr old in 10yrs" as a ridiculous statement you are correct. The "great" term is also ridiculous. I guess you don't need to be fast to be great any longer.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by Hoisttheflag

Circular Quay is not a fast horse. Nothing special there other than that he was ready earlier. If you think this horse is special and has a big future based on 2 slow races in the spring of the 2yr old season you know nothing about horses. Most of the big names you will hear next spring have not even raced yet. Everyone knows that. These early races like the Bashford every year get people talking about how great they are and they almost always flame out. If early races mean anything I guess those AP Indys should just pack it in.

Yeah, they should be embarrased to even accept the trophy for such a meaningless race.

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

Yeah, they should be embarrased to even accept the trophy for such a meaningless race.

Oracle is the one calling him great in this thread. He used the word great which is comical. Guys like Tabor aren't in it to win the Bashford Manor they are in it to win the derby and this horse and all horses that win the BM are not derby winners.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by Hoisttheflag

Oracle is the one calling him great in this thread. He used the word great which is comical. Guys like Tabor aren't in it to win the Bashford Manor they are in it to win the derby and this horse and all horses that win the BM are not derby winners.

Yes I've read all the comments on the thread and NO ONE, repeat NO ONE, tried to build this horse up to be the derby winner. You're using a strawman.

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

Yes I've read all the comments on the thread and NO ONE, repeat NO ONE, tried to build this horse up to be the derby winner. You're using a strawman.

Fine no derby, how about "His win just now was one of the most incredible things I ever saw. This horse is the goods, and he will run all day. I don't care who debuts where and does what to who, as long as this horse is in training there won't be a two year old who will touch him. And how scary is it that he wants to go farther. I havent seen a two year old like this horse in over ten years. Its about time!!!"

That is a ridiculous statement for a slow horse that won by 1 length. Everyone, and I mean everyone that knows the Pletcher barn (or his father) knows that the Dogwood one they have is a better horse and the other one Scat Daddy is also better. So i guess the "there won't be a two year who will touch him" statement isn't over the top.

[GPK]

is the Quay part pronounced:

Kay or
Key?

Everywhere I have seen the word Quay used, it was always properly pronounced as key.

[Pointg5]

Originally Posted by Hoisttheflag

Oracle is the one calling him great in this thread. He used the word great which is comical. Guys like Tabor aren't in it to win the Bashford Manor they are in it to win the derby and this horse and all horses that win the BM are not derby winners.

Guys like Tabor flew in to watch this race yesterday, it may be insignificant, but the guy has top quality horses all over, I found it interesting he flew in to see the race in person....

Originally Posted by Pointg5

Guys like Tabor flew in to watch this race yesterday, it may be insignificant, but the guy has top quality horses all over, I found it interesting he flew in to see the race in person....

Tabor flew in because he is attending the July 2 year olds in training sale at Keeneland.