NBC receives mail from shooter

[Danzig]

"Roughly one-fifth said they know someone who has been a victim of a crime involving firearms in recent years, with women, young people, minorities, city residents and low-income people among the likeliest. Of those, almost a quarter said they have considered acquiring a gun for themselves.

About one in three people said they already have a firearm, consistent with previous polling results. Men, whites and Southerners are the likeliest to own guns."


that's from another article i just read.....so, men, whites, and southerners (rural??) are most likely to OWN a gun, and also the least likely to have a crime committed against them....criminals know who the least likely to be protected are...after all, many cities ban gun ownership, so the criminals (who already break laws, so what will a gun law do?) know the chances of an urban dweller being able to defend himself is slim. thus, an easier target. police can't be everywhere.
glad i don't live in a city, and i never will. the right to defend oneself is a basic right, and it's been taken away, giving the edge to those who don't care about breaking one law while committing another.

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Danzig

"Roughly one-fifth said they know someone who has been a victim of a crime involving firearms in recent years, with women, young people, minorities, city residents and low-income people among the likeliest. Of those, almost a quarter said they have considered acquiring a gun for themselves.

About one in three people said they already have a firearm, consistent with previous polling results. Men, whites and Southerners are the likeliest to own guns."


that's from another article i just read.....so, men, whites, and southerners (rural??) are most likely to OWN a gun, and also the least likely to have a crime committed against them....criminals know who the least likely to be protected are...after all, many cities ban gun ownership, so the criminals (who already break laws, so what will a gun law do?) know the chances of an urban dweller being able to defend himself is slim. thus, an easier target. police can't be everywhere.
glad i don't live in a city, and i never will. the right to defend oneself is a basic right, and it's been taken away, giving the edge to those who don't care about breaking one law while committing another.

So, 80 percent of people surveyed did not know anyone who had been the victim of a crime involving guns, and 75 percent of those who did know (of that 20 percent) still did not want a gun. So only 5 percent of the people surveyed considered getting one. Correct?

Did the article say how many of the guns involved in those crimes cited by the 20 percent had been acquired legally?

Devil's advocate, Danzig- I'm amazed that the majority of people who knew of a crime involving guns still didn't want one. Because they've seen what they can do, do you think?

How about we attack poverty and urban blight-- I have a strong suspicion that would do more to fight crime than anything else. Oh right, because conservatives feel if you're poor, you must deserve it and could get out of it if you really, really wanted to.

[Mortimer]

I'm thinking that maybe one can buy stuff like this.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

So, 80 percent of people surveyed did not know anyone who had been the victim of a crime involving guns, and 75 percent of those who did know (of that 20 percent) still did not want a gun. So only 5 percent of the people surveyed considered getting one. Correct?

Did the article say how many of the guns involved in those crimes cited by the 20 percent had been acquired legally?

Devil's advocate, Danzig- I'm amazed that the majority of people who knew of a crime involving guns still didn't want one. Because they've seen what they can do, do you think?

How about we attack poverty and urban blight-- I have a strong suspicion that would do more to fight crime than anything else. Oh right, because conservatives feel if you're poor, you must deserve it and could get out of it if you really, really wanted to.

actually gen, i think more education is the key to many of our ills,

and scuds, i'm not from arkansas, and not a hillbilly. once again you seem to want to get to the lowest common denominator. my contention is, at close range, it doesn't matter if you get shot with a .22, a .38, or an uzi--and that if you can't buy the GUN, what the hell does it matter the bullet--are you going to throw it?

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

So, 80 percent of people surveyed did not know anyone who had been the victim of a crime involving guns, and 75 percent of those who did know (of that 20 percent) still did not want a gun. So only 5 percent of the people surveyed considered getting one. Correct?

Did the article say how many of the guns involved in those crimes cited by the 20 percent had been acquired legally?

Devil's advocate, Danzig- I'm amazed that the majority of people who knew of a crime involving guns still didn't want one. Because they've seen what they can do, do you think?

How about we attack poverty and urban blight-- I have a strong suspicion that would do more to fight crime than anything else. Oh right, because conservatives feel if you're poor, you must deserve it and could get out of it if you really, really wanted to.

and why does this once again have to become a partisan debate? and why reply TO ME about conservatives, i'm not one!

[Mortimer]

Oh great.

Here we go now.

[Danzig]

no, i'm done with this. you try to have a conversation, but some want to resort to the same tired, trite phrases, or start with the name calling bs. tis a shame.

[Mortimer]

Originally Posted by Danzig

no, i'm done with this. you try to have a conversation, but some want to resort to the same tired, trite phrases, or start with the name calling bs. tis a shame.

The bastardos.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by Danzig

and why does this once again have to become a partisan debate? and why reply TO ME about conservatives, i'm not one!

What can I do to change your mind?

[brianwspencer]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

What can I do to change your mind?

I'm going to throw up.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by brianwspencer

I'm going to throw up.

Oh goodie!

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Danzig

and why does this once again have to become a partisan debate? and why reply TO ME about conservatives, i'm not one!

That's true, Danzig; you do tend to be pretty spread out over the political spectrum, but an opposition to gun restrictions tends to be associated with a conservative bent.

I think my frustration is that I agree with you, education and attacking the root causes of poverty would do a great deal towards combating gun violence, regardless of restrictions on guns. Where I get angry, and NOT at you personally; I feel bad you took it as a personal attack (though please tell me where I resorted to "name calling?" Unless you think being called "conservative" is being called a bad name? Tee hee) is that I feel the (generally) conservative attitude towards no restrictions on firearms carries no corresponding attempt to reduce gun violence- arm the rich so they can shoot the poor, so to speak, rather than trying to combat sources that lead to violence in the first place.

And I think the gun issue is very different in rural areas than it is in urban (as someone else said) and that it's hard to find a common ground because the circumstances are soooooo different.

[timmgirvan]

GR: I realize that We are at the opposite ends of the spectum politically, but saying that Conservatives feel that "the poor" deserve it and could change their lives if they really really wanted to,AND,"arm the rich to shoot the poor" is totally an unfair projection on your part! I don't know anyone who feel that poor folks(or old or disabled) are in those situations out of choice! But there are many people who abuse the systems set into place for the care of the aforementioned groups(workmens comp scams including doctors who overbill State), Welfare recipients who work "under the table" for cash,etc etc.There are individuals who scam SSI and myriad other examples of people trying get something that's not theirs/for nothing. Secondly, I don't have knowledge of any rich guys riding around their gated communities doing "drive-bys" cuz they don't like the job the gardener did. There are home invasion robberies every day here in SoCal and it's primarily the wanta-haves taking it from the older folks and the weak. Car-jackings,road rage,and Gangs dot the landscape as well. In these situations, conservative/liberal doesn't come up at all. People should be able to defend themselves and their homes,and kids should be safe from guns and predators...at all costs!

[somerfrost]

Originally Posted by timmgirvan

GR: I realize that We are at the opposite ends of the spectum politically, but saying that Conservatives feel that "the poor" deserve it and could change their lives if they really really wanted to,AND,"arm the rich to shoot the poor" is totally an unfair projection on your part! I don't know anyone who feel that poor folks(or old or disabled) are in those situations out of choice! But there are many people who abuse the systems set into place for the care of the aforementioned groups(workmens comp scams including doctors who overbill State), Welfare recipients who work "under the table" for cash,etc etc.There are individuals who scam SSI and myriad other examples of people trying get something that's not theirs/for nothing. Secondly, I don't have knowledge of any rich guys riding around their gated communities doing "drive-bys" cuz they don't like the job the gardener did. There are home invasion robberies every day here in SoCal and it's primarily the wanta-haves taking it from the older folks and the weak. Car-jackings,road rage,and Gangs dot the landscape as well. In these situations, conservative/liberal doesn't come up at all. People should be able to defend themselves and their homes,and kids should be safe from guns and predators...at all costs!

Not getting into this again EXCEPT....we always hear about how the poor scam the system etc etc...Welfare Cadillac crap...frankly that offends me! What about all the White Collar crime that never gets prosecuted, rick folks scamming the poor out of what little they have? Some old white guy sitting in an office in a highrise somewhere can ruin more lives with the stroke of a pen (or a click of a mouse) than 1000 drivebys or 10,000 welfare cheats! It would be amusing if not so tragic when folks say, "I don't think folks are poor cause they want to be or are lazy BUT....look at all the bad stuff they do!" What hypocracy!!!

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by somerfrost

Not getting into this again EXCEPT....we always hear about how the poor scam the system etc etc...Welfare Cadillac crap...frankly that offends me! What about all the White Collar crime that never gets prosecuted, rick folks scamming the poor out of what little they have? Some old white guy sitting in an office in a highrise somewhere can ruin more lives with the stroke of a pen (or a click of a mouse) than 1000 drivebys or 10,000 welfare cheats! It would be amusing if not so tragic when folks say, "I don't think folks are poor cause they want to be or are lazy BUT....look at all the bad stuff they do!" What hypocracy!!!

Tell that to the person who loses their loved one...

I agree with Timm.

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by somerfrost

Not getting into this again EXCEPT....we always hear about how the poor scam the system etc etc...Welfare Cadillac crap...frankly that offends me! What about all the White Collar crime that never gets prosecuted, rick folks scamming the poor out of what little they have? Some old white guy sitting in an office in a highrise somewhere can ruin more lives with the stroke of a pen (or a click of a mouse) than 1000 drivebys or 10,000 welfare cheats! It would be amusing if not so tragic when folks say, "I don't think folks are poor cause they want to be or are lazy BUT....look at all the bad stuff they do!" What hypocracy!!!

That is not the gist of what I said ...and you know it! You still make it out about the rich vs the poor and that's unfortunate. You lose all efficacy when you draw the line between the 2 'cultures' if you will. Do you start with the premise that if someone is wealthy....then he must have cheated or got it through force?? You arbitrarilly make the wealthy to be the bad guys...that's just wrong. I'm living on a pension,and unable to work, but I don't begrudge any who make good with their endeavors and skills!