Any Given Saturday

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

If he wasn't on anybody's Top Ten Derby List, or trained by Todd Pletcher, he would have barely raised a whisper with today's effort.

This I can agree with. Especially this far out from the Derby. But I thought this was sort of the fun of it all... Watching the 3 yos change form and develop.

[Gander]

Thats why I liked Oracles temper Tim

Its an acquired taste, thats for sure. Just hassling you Pgard. I care very little about the Derby until the week of.

Originally Posted by Gander

Thats why I liked Oracles temper Tim

Its an acquired taste, thats for sure.

It was so easy to provoke the guy and he would give some very interesting opinions. You went to school with him so I guess that might get tiresome. I enjoy the site when active discussion takes place, even over trivial stuff. I dont have a really nice track like you do, so this is the place I can get some feedback.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

I believe the Pletcher factor has hurt his odds a little in the futures.

This horse had run the best losing performance by any 2yo last year, when he was 2nd in his season finale, only Nobiz Like Shobiz's loss in the Champagne can really even be compared with it from that standpoint.

With a different trainer, I highly doubt this horse would have closed as low as the 14/1 he did last week---before even having a single 3yo run under him.

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

This horse had run the best losing performance by any 2yo last year, when he was 2nd in his season finale, only Nobiz Like Shobiz's loss in the Champagne can really even be compared with it from that standpoint.

That was the day they also ran the filly 2 year old stake (whatever the name) and every single one of those 2 year old fillies, except the winner, HIT A BRICK WALL when they entered the stretch. I mean, most of them were going a mile for the first time (and hardly any figured to be able to get a mile) BUT I've never seen such stopping (in unison) before.

And then there was NoBIZ, running along on the inside like a good boy until he hit the stretch and started acting like one of those fillies. Spanked by SCAT DADDY, no less.

And now I can put it all together. He didn't run like a sprinter filly trying to get a mile; he ran one of the 2 best losing performances of the year.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

And then there was NoBIZ, running along on the inside like a good boy until he hit the stretch and started acting like one of those fillies. Spanked by SCAT DADDY, no less.

And now I can put it all together. He didn't run like a sprinter filly trying to get a mile; he ran one of the 2 best losing performances of the year.

He had significant early trouble in that race.

Do you really believe he can't get a mile?

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

He had significant early trouble in that race.

Do you really believe he can't get a mile?

I haven't seen the race in a quite a while. I do recall that he got slammed into (another horse?) out of the gate. I also remember that he had an uneventful inside trip (in my mind) after that point.

Not a question of whether he can get a mile or not. I'm just trying to figure out why he basically collapsed mid to late stretch. And I definitely didn't think that Scat Daddy was much of a horse going into the Champagne.

He was trying to get in while struggling to change in the stretch last out, against a field he dominated. But, once he changed late, he was still trying to get in.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by pgardn

This I can agree with. Especially this far out from the Derby. But I thought this was sort of the fun of it all... Watching the 3 yos change form and develop.

I guess it is if you are following horses up to the Derby. Personally I am far too preoccupied with the daily minutia at Aqueduct and Gulfstream to worry about a race a week from now....not to mention one months away.

It will certainly be interesting to see a horse from Todd Pletcher incrimentally improve from race to race, and not just explode on the scene and disappear just as quickly, but until it happens I will remain dubious. Of course, the Pletcherization of racing has almost completely irradicated this aspect of the game. It's win and win now baby!