JAZIL....Most Overrated horse in the history of horse racing....

[boswd]

Originally Posted by todko

This horse was taken out of his running style and perhaps hasn't recovered from the bone bruising he suffered after the Belmont.

Retire him.

Corinthian only went 1:48 on a fast Gulfstream track and with Jazil 10 lengths back of that effort it's obvious the horse is not right. If the horse was right he wouldn't be in allowance conditions to begin with.

That's not necissarly true about have a Stakes caliber horse run in an allowance race. Trainers use them all them time to kind of whip them back into racing shape before tackling the stronger competition. Very similiar concept that baseball uses when a player is making a comback to spend some time in the minors to get back into playing shape.

[slotdirt]

Let me just say that after watching the replay a few more times, I'm not quite as impressed with Corinthian, and I'm not that down on Jazil, for a variety of reasons.

[Danzig]

tremendous props to shadwell for returning jazil and invasor to the track-they could easily have retired them both.

funny isn't it, we talk of what could have been with bernardini and his ilk, while many down the ones that are still out there putting it all on the line.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by Danzig188

tremendous props to shadwell for returning jazil and invasor to the track-they could easily have retired them both.

funny isn't it, we talk of what could have been with bernardini and his ilk, while many down the ones that are still out there putting it all on the line.

Exactly. I for one appreciate seeing horses like Jazil running. Every horse does not have to be a front runner or a win machine to make racing interesting. Jazil has a certain style of running, maybe not the fastest one around and certainly one that might need a good pace set-up to win. So what? You can't just blindly single him, but its hard to totally rule him out in certain cases either.

Maybe the public has been over-rating his chances of winning, but there is no need to knock the horse for that. He is what he is.

[paisjpq]

Originally Posted by Danzig188

tremendous props to shadwell for returning jazil and invasor to the track-they could easily have retired them both.

funny isn't it, we talk of what could have been with bernardini and his ilk, while many down the ones that are still out there putting it all on the line.

also evidence that perhaps one brother is more 'sporting' than the other?

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by paisjpq

also evidence that perhaps one brother is more 'sporting' than the other?

Indeed it is!
I couldn't help but be PO'ed when I saw pics of Bernie running in the snow...he should be doing that on the track.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by Sightseek

Indeed it is!
I couldn't help but be PO'ed when I saw pics of Bernie running in the snow...he should be doing that on the track.

Where did you see those? I'd love to see them.

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

Where did you see those? I'd love to see them.

http://www.horsephotos.com/searchresults.jsp

On their homepage they have a photo of Circular Quay...he isn't the most attractive horse out there.

[Pedigree Ann]

After Corinthian was allowed to get the first half-mile in 47 3/5, which is a mild workout for a horse of his caliber, it's no surprise that he could sprint home in 1:00 2/5, which he could do standing on his head. Jazil's premature move was a result of the slow early pace and the jock not wanting to get stuck 10 lengths behind a 48 half. The race was the wrong shape for a closer like Jazil.

The question on Corinthian is what happens when he goes up against Barcola or some other speed freak (22.83 first quarter in the Donn). Will he run with them and still win by many, will he rate, or will he burn out?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Pedigree Ann

After Corinthian was allowed to get the first half-mile in 47 3/5, which is a mild workout for a horse of his caliber, it's no surprise that he could sprint home in 1:00 2/5, which he could do standing on his head. Jazil's premature move was a result of the slow early pace and the jock not wanting to get stuck 10 lengths behind a 48 half. The race was the wrong shape for a closer like Jazil.

The question on Corinthian is what happens when he goes up against Barcola or some other speed freak (22.83 first quarter in the Donn). Will he run with them and still win by many, will he rate, or will he burn out?

Corinthian is not a need the lead type and if some one dimensional horse like Barcola set rapid pace, it will fit well with Corinthians style. Jazil is a 2nd rate handicap horse who will rarely find a race with enough distance or pace to suit him. He needs something like the American version of the St. Ledger which does not nor ever will exist. Plenty of mediocre horses have won classics and he is one of them.

[Gander]

Well said Canon Shell and I doubt you'll take the bashing like Point Given 1985 did when he posted his thoughts about the 2 horses.

Corinthian is a versatile sort who can adapt to any race scenario. He doesnt rely on pace. He wins when he is the best, plain and simple. No excuses.

Excuses are like 100K cars in Miami...everybotty got em.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by Gander

Well said Canon Shell and I doubt you'll take the bashing like Point Given 1985 did when he posted his thoughts about the 2 horses.

Cannon didn't devote an entire thread to Jazil proclaiming him to be the most overrated horse in the history of horse racing, Gander.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

Cannon didn't devote an entire thread to Jazil proclaiming him to be the most overrated horse in the history of horse racing, Gander.

I dont think he is overrated, just ordinary. Funny thing about the Triple Crown is that everybody calls for all these changes but rarely is anything said about the Belmont. It really does not fit into the modern racing scene (good or bad) and without a triple crown on the line is really a mediocre event. I'm not suggesting a change but I am suprised that others haven't.

[Gander]

These are two entirely different types of posters.

They sure are. One is a scuccessful horse trainer and the other is a 21 year old college kid with a gambling vice.

[Pedigree Ann]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I dont think he is overrated, just ordinary. Funny thing about the Triple Crown is that everybody calls for all these changes but rarely is anything said about the Belmont. It really does not fit into the modern racing scene (good or bad) and without a triple crown on the line is really a mediocre event. I'm not suggesting a change but I am suprised that others haven't.

Let me suggest a change - make the Jockey CLub Gold Cup 2 miles again, the Woodward 12f, and revive the Saratoga, Pimlico, and Monmouth Cups. Then we'll separate the real classic horses from the pretenders.

[slotdirt]

Gander, what Cannon Shell said and how he said it was decidedly different than how this pointgiven character said what he had to say. When you call out the world on a horse like Jazil, you're going to take some grief for it. When you start several different threads proclaiming a horse won't finish in the exacta for a particular race, people are going to call you out on it when said horse comes in for the place. These are two entirely different types of posters.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

Gander, what Cannon Shell said and how he said it was decidedly different than how this pointgiven character said what he had to say. When you call out the world on a horse like Jazil, you're going to take some grief for it. When you start several different threads proclaiming a horse won't finish in the exacta for a particular race, people are going to call you out on it when said horse comes in for the place. These are two entirely different types of posters.

Point Givens are found everyday at every track in the country, probably all over the world. He had a strong opinion about Corinthian, got a much better price because of the presence of Jazil and was correct. However incorrect and outlandish statements are not tolerated by the community here and as such he left.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Point Givens are found everyday at every track in the country, probably all over the world. He had a strong opinion about Corinthian, got a much better price because of the presence of Jazil and was correct. However incorrect and outlandish statements are not tolerated by the community here and as such he left.

Nah, he's on right now. LOL

His "this is my last post" thread reminded me of some of Curt's drunken ramblings over on the old ESPN board. Too funny...

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Pedigree Ann

After Corinthian was allowed to get the first half-mile in 47 3/5, which is a mild workout for a horse of his caliber, it's no surprise that he could sprint home in 1:00 2/5, which he could do standing on his head. Jazil's premature move was a result of the slow early pace and the jock not wanting to get stuck 10 lengths behind a 48 half. The race was the wrong shape for a closer like Jazil.

The question on Corinthian is what happens when he goes up against Barcola or some other speed freak (22.83 first quarter in the Donn). Will he run with them and still win by many, will he rate, or will he burn out?

What did you think of Coin Silver standing stud in Ireland? Seems like a strange fit.