Done till Spa. F horse racing

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

There was certainly plenty of justification for the stewards' call. But there are plenty of smart people who don't think the horse should have come down. Andy Beyer was on Steve's show. He didn't think the horse should have come down. Dave Grening was on Steve's show. He didn't think the horse should have come down and neither did Steve.

Richard Migliore disagreed with the DQ and so did Chuck Simon. On the other hand, there are plenty of smart people on the other side of the argument.

Anyway, the point is that it is silly to assume that anyone who disagreed with the call is either an idiot or has an ulterior motive. That is obviously not the case.

I don’t care who agrees or disagrees.

The only real reason I’ve seen so far is it was the Derby and it’s a roughly run race. Sorry, but in my opinion that is BS. We’ve never had a front runner take out multiple horses when he comes out 3-4 paths at the 1/4 pole. Kind of amazing we haven’t, but we haven’t. If you don’t DQ there you set a Gallop Racer precedent for every other Derby.

[ADJMK]

https://www.scmp.com/sport/racing/ar...ange-kim-kelly

[jms62]

Originally Posted by ADJMK

https://www.scmp.com/sport/racing/ar...ange-kim-kelly

So here is the thing. I am hearing folks talk about doing something like they do in Hong Kong. Give the jockey days and a fine. This works in Hong Kong because there are very few tracks and they run a limited schedule and it is a single jurisdiction. Easy to see why that giving the jockey days or a fine doesn't work here. DQ'ing the horse sends a message that this won't be tolerated and I think that message was sent regarding the Kentucky Derby going forward. My original thought on this was it shouldn't be a DQ at that point in the race based upon the replay I saw. Once I saw Scott Carson's twitter posting showing a different angle it became a no brainer for me. The horse had to be DQ'd.

[Kitan]

Originally Posted by jms62

So here is the thing. I am hearing folks talk about doing something like they do in Hong Kong. Give the jockey days and a fine. This works in Hong Kong because there are very few tracks and they run a limited schedule and it is a single jurisdiction. Easy to see why that giving the jockey days or a fine doesn't work here. DQ'ing the horse sends a message that this won't be tolerated and I think that message was sent regarding the Kentucky Derby going forward. My original thought on this was it shouldn't be a DQ at that point in the race based upon the replay I saw. Once I saw Scott Carson's twitter posting showing a different angle it became a no brainer for me. The horse had to be DQ'd.

I don't agree. The same thing happens in Australia, where they run at infinite tracks a week.

I mentioned this (why the rule needs to be re-looked at and its implementation elsewhere) in another thread:
http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/sho...6138&page=5#82 (also posts 80 and 83)

[Dahoss]

I got a chance to listen to Pletcher on Outside the Lines tonight. I recommend people listen to it for an unbiased opinion. Unlike Baffert, he doesn’t train for the West’s.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

I got a chance to listen to Pletcher on Outside the Lines tonight. I recommend people listen to it for an unbiased opinion. Unlike Baffert, he doesn’t train for the West’s.

He was great.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Kitan

I don't agree. The same thing happens in Australia, where they run at infinite tracks a week.

I mentioned this (why the rule needs to be re-looked at and its implementation elsewhere) in another thread:
http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/sho...6138&page=5#82 (also posts 80 and 83)

I saw your posting the other thread and still disagree. Please tell me how this would work in this scenario given that we have no central authority. Let’s use Saez as an example. He is banned 10 days , 20 days from Churchill Downs? Even if he rode at Churchill regularly it is the Kentucky Derby a once in a lifetime win for most. How many would gladly trade a 30 day vacation for that. In your scenario it works because of the structure in place in those countries.

[Kitan]

Originally Posted by jms62

I saw your posting the other thread and still disagree. Please tell me how this would work in this scenario given that we have no central authority. Let’s use Saez as an example. He is banned 10 days , 20 days from Churchill Downs? Even if he rode at Churchill regularly it is the Kentucky Derby a once in a lifetime win for most. How many would gladly trade a 30 day vacation for that. In your scenario it works because of the structure in place in those countries.

Why can't there be a reform and build a central authority? All the counterpoints I've read are basically showing the flaws in the North American system compared to the organization in other major jurisdictions. Sure, they have their own flaws, but much fewer and less major. And, this would then make things uniform globally!

I rarely hear about jockey suspensions in USA, and I'm not up to speed with the latest ones. But, the 25 day ban of the Australian jockey that I mentioned in the other thread prevented him from riding an odds-on fav in an international G1 in Hong Kong, let alone G1s in his own country. If Saez was banned from CD, would he be allowed to ride elsewhere?

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Kitan

Why can't there be a reform and build a central authority? All the counterpoints I've read are basically showing the flaws in the North American system compared to the organization in other major jurisdictions. Sure, they have their own flaws, but much fewer and less major. And, this would then make things uniform globally!

I rarely hear about jockey suspensions in USA, and I'm not up to speed with the latest ones. But, the 25 day ban of the Australian jockey that I mentioned in the other thread prevented him from riding an odds-on fav in an international G1 in Hong Kong, let alone G1s in his own country. If Saez was banned from CD, would he be allowed to ride elsewhere?

I asked how it would work given the current state and you countered by offering a solution that would require a complete overhaul that isn’t happening anytime soon if ever. That is the unfortunate reality and the reasons why would completely derail this thread. It would be a question you should ask of someone much smarter than myself like Steve. My simple take is Horse Racing has been operating in survival mode for years now with some jurisdictions stronger than
others. I don’t see them willing to cede power or dollars for the overall betterment of the sport. Those in power still operate like it is 1965 and they are the only game in town. Hopefully when they pass the torch to the younger generation new ideas are infused to overhaul it but that probably will be at a point where many of us are gone or betting on a much tighter budget.