Zito: Commentator passing BC; Targets '09 season

Kasept · #1 10-07-2008, 01:04 PM

Coming back too slowly from Mass Cap.. Will return for 8yo year..

http://www.drf.com/news/article/98869.html

freddymo · #2 10-07-2008, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kasept

Coming back too slowly from Mass Cap.. Will return for 8yo year..

http://www.drf.com/news/article/98869.html

like if it was at Belmont he wouldnt be up to it?

Indian Charlie · #3 10-07-2008, 02:05 PM

Did you ban pg1985 again?

SniperSB23 · #4 10-07-2008, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by freddymo

like if it was at Belmont he wouldnt be up to it?

Would they have bothered working him yesterday if they weren't at least considering it? Seems to me Farmer wanted to give it a shot so they worked him and he wasn't ready.

KirisClown · #5 10-07-2008, 02:40 PM

It's the right move.. Give him all the time he needs to recuperate..

The older male divison will be horrendous again in 09... he'll have another good year on the track and another Whitney win...

cakes44 · #6 10-07-2008, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Would you ship a known fragile horse across the country to run on a surface he's never run on, while you have him in possibly the best form of his career?

The best form of his career part doesn't matter a whole lot here being that he will be laid up until 2009.

2MinsToPost · #7 10-07-2008, 02:42 PM

Man talk about proper management of a horse putting them in the right spots at the right times - 20 starts lifetime 13 wins 7 years old.

blackthroatedwind · #8 10-07-2008, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by freddymo

like if it was at Belmont he wouldnt be up to it?

I don't know about that. He runs best when given the proper time.

blackthroatedwind · #9 10-07-2008, 02:55 PM

Anybody that thinks Nick wouldn't like to take a shot in the BC Classic with Commentator isn't really thinking. What trainer wouldn't take a shot with a horse under 10:1 in a $5 Million race that could well earn his horse Horse of the Year with a victory?

The simple fact is he needs real time between his races to do his best running and the BC comes a little too soon for Commentator. Obviously, polytrack and California are part of the equation, but even with all that, if this horse was absolutely prepared he would be going. His connections are well aware of what's at stake.

Danzig · #10 10-07-2008, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Would they have bothered working him yesterday if they weren't at least considering it? Seems to me Farmer wanted to give it a shot so they worked him and he wasn't ready.

or maybe the work yesterday told them he wasn't coming back well, which is why they shelved him. he indicated he was tired, they're doing the right thing, regardless of what they may have been considering. i'd have been surprised had he shown up on the west coast for the bc, even if he worked like gangbusters. that surface is not inspiring confidence in many people.

#11 10-07-2008, 06:01 PM

As hard as it is for me to say this, this is 100% the correct decision

the_fat_man · #12 10-07-2008, 06:18 PM

I don't get it.

If the BC was the ultimate aim, why 'risk' running in SUF if the horse needs extra time between races?

And, given the EASY time of it he had at SUF, why the extra time to recover?
Here's a case where a horse (physically) bounced.

miraja2 · #13 10-07-2008, 06:46 PM

Clearly they need to add a 9f race.
They probably need a 10f one for the fillies too.

10 pnt move up · #14 10-07-2008, 11:35 PM

Commentator = Lava Man?

Just see a lot of similar qualities, while good horses, despite their records I never felt either falls into the great category.

blackthroatedwind · #15 10-08-2008, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10 pnt move up

Commentator = Lava Man?

Just see a lot of similar qualities, while good horses, despite their records I never felt either falls into the great category.

Lava Man couldn't compete outside of Southern California. Commentator has run huge races at Saratoga, Belmont, Keeneland, Churchill and Suffolk.

Now, Lava Man ran some very nice races, none as fast as quite a few Commentator ran, and Commentator has run fast races at more than a few distances, thus I just don't see the comparison.

VOL JACK · #16 10-08-2008, 12:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Lava Man couldn't compete outside of Southern California. Commentator has run huge races at Saratoga, Belmont, Keeneland, Churchill and Suffolk.

Now, Lava Man ran some very nice races, none as fast as quite a few Commentator ran, and Commentator has run fast races at more than a few distances, thus I just don't see the comparison.

Dont forget Gulfstream........LM did run a 120 beyer ONCE, in his first HWGC win.
Lava Man is a perfect example of why many beleive that Cali racing is just not up to par with the east coast.
The funny thing with LM is that his trainer seems to have a real niche for shipping east to pick up graded stakes.

Indian Charlie · #17 10-08-2008, 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10 pnt move up

Commentator = Lava Man?

Just see a lot of similar qualities, while good horses, despite their records I never felt either falls into the great category.

I think people tend to get a bit fuzzy headed about Commentator, but c'mon man, that's crazy talk.

They've never been in the same league, and as for the rest of your post, I really don't see similarities.

blackthroatedwind · #18 10-08-2008, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

I think people tend to get a bit fuzzy headed about Commentator, but c'mon man, that's crazy talk.

They've never been in the same league, and as for the rest of your post, I really don't see similarities.

I'm honestly confused.....which isn't in which one's league? I assume you mean Lava Man, as he was defeating Big Booster and Commentator was defeating future HOY Saint Liam and drowned Student Council who won last year's Pacific Classic.

Now, I don't think that's totally fair, as on his homecourt, Lava Man was vary good. But on raw talent? It's probably not that close.

miraja2 · #19 10-08-2008, 09:43 AM

I guess one of the similarities might be that each is/was very tough when they ran under certain conditions. Lava Man's limitations were geographical, while Commentator's are pace-based, but they both needed things a certain way to do much. Although I'm not sure that fact really distinguishes those two from 99% of the horses running.

For the most part, I don't think the two really compare very well. I have been far more impressed with Commentator's best then I ever was with Lava Man's best. I think Commentator is one of the more talented horses we have seen in recent years, while I would not put Lava Man on that list. On the other hand, Commentator's biggest weakness is that he lacks the ability to ever put together a truly impressive overall season (like Lava Man did in '06) because of all of his various physical problems. They are two very different animals.

The Indomitable DrugS · #20 10-08-2008, 09:51 AM

Lava Man has Commentator 7-to-2 in Grade 1 wins. He's won Gr 1's on dirt, turf, and synthetic. He's also got a big figure (120 Beyer) that came without a dreamy trip when he won the Hollywood Gold Cup by 9 lengths with next out Pacific Classic and Jockey Club Gold Cup winner Borrego checking in 2nd.

But he's also a horse who stuggled mightily as a claimer prior to Doug O' Neill claiming him - and with O'Neill - he failed in a miserable way all five times he ran outside of California.

Commentator currently has lost 6 of his last 8 Graded Stake attempts - is markedly less effective when pressured early - and needs a bunch of time between starts.

Commentator is obviously in the same leauge as Lava Man. He doesn't match up as well on accomplishments though ... but he remains sharp and carefully managed while LM is retired.

Both of them did the bulk of their damage at a time when the quality of racing was at it's lowest. I'd say they are pretty even - and both a little overrated.