Worse KY Derby winner... - Page 3

dylbert · #41 11-13-2007, 10:23 PM

Giacomo is worst Derby winner ever... by open lengths, or by "a pole"! I don't anyone will recall Giacomo as some great force in history of thoroughbred ranks. Plodder, rather than Derby winner, is what I will remember him as.

Cannon Shell · #42 11-13-2007, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dylbert

Giacomo is worst Derby winner ever... by open lengths, or by "a pole"! I don't anyone will recall Giacomo as some great force in history of thoroughbred ranks. Plodder, rather than Derby winner, is what I will remember him as.

I was looking at a broodmare today at the Keeneland sale. Liked her pedigree, thought she had pretty good conformation. May be in my price range. Sounds good until I saw she was in foal to Giacomo. I dont want to pay to raise one of those so I passed.

The Indomitable DrugS · #43 11-13-2007, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dylbert

Giacomo is worst Derby winner ever... by open lengths

You obviously don't know about 1933 Kentucky Derby winner Brokers Tip.

His lifetime record was 14-1-2-1 ... and he is the only horse in history who's only career win came in the Derby.

He won the race in controvesial fashion...his jockey and the rider of the 2nd place finisher were fighting each other through the lane.

It's a story almost as remarkably absurd as Sir Barton....

A horse who entered the Kentucky Derby as a maiden, off of a 8 month layoff, and only running to serve the purpose as a pace setting rabbit for his stablemate. He runs off and wins by 5. Takes the Preakness next out, followed by the Withers, and than the Belmont.

From hopeless maiden rabbit at post time on May 10th - to the first horse to sweep the later to be named Triple Crown on June 11th.

The Indomitable DrugS · #44 11-13-2007, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I was looking at a broodmare today at the Keeneland sale. Liked her pedigree, thought she had pretty good conformation. May be in my price range. Sounds good until I saw she was in foal to Giacomo. I dont want to pay to raise one of those so I passed.

You think Giacomo will be that horrendously bad of a stallion?

His dam was the brilliant four time stakes winning sprinter Set Them Free - who hooked 2yo filly champ Eliza in their career debuts at Del Mar...and ran off together.

Besides Giacomo - she dropped another Santa Anita Derby winner - a nice turf horse - and a Sea Hero sired filly who was multiple Graded Stakes placed and 4th in the Juv Fillies.

There's both speed, turf, and I guess even synthetic (Tiago) influences in his pedigree...I'm not sure he will be as bad a stallion as everyone anticipates. That might not be saying much though.

dylbert · #45 11-13-2007, 11:00 PM

Do you have YouTube video of Broken Tip? Just kidding... my Giacomo comments are based on watching Derby since 1971.

1933 is digging deep for me -- I appreciate you sharing that piece of Derby history.

The Indomitable DrugS · #46 11-13-2007, 11:07 PM

Sadly, No video.

Here's the pic....

How great would it have been if the horse was DQ'd and placed 2nd? He'd be 0-for-14 lifetime....but still did cross the wire first in the Derby.

PPerfectfan · #47 11-13-2007, 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by philcski

Giacomo in a landslide. Only Derby I've attended live. Been to the Oaks 6 times, that works better for me.

Was thinking about it Sunday @ CD, it's almost harder to believe Closing Argument was about 3 strides from the wire from winning it after pressing that ridiculous pace the whole way around. He ran some race that day, literally out of nowhere (and never again.)

That freaking Giamaco cost me the tri AND super that day!!! I only had him in the bottom 3 spots. I loved, loved Closing Arguement. And told everyone that too. He had not run a bad race, on the board in all starts before the Derby.But honestly the only reason I had Dont Get Mad was because of B.Wayne Hughes being the owner and they said he was working great. trying to be honest.lol I also had $10across on C.A. My bestfriend who was just getting into betting was having a heartattack watching me have a heartattack as they turned for home and C.A was right there at 70/1. Freaking Giamaco, the nag.

Cannon Shell · #48 11-13-2007, 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

You think Giacomo will be that horrendously bad of a stallion?

yes

docicu3 · #49 11-13-2007, 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

yes

Tiago gonna prove to be a fluke??

Cajungator26 · #50 11-14-2007, 03:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

You think Giacomo will be that horrendously bad of a stallion?

His dam was the brilliant four time stakes winning sprinter Set Them Free - who hooked 2yo filly champ Eliza in their career debuts at Del Mar...and ran off together.

Besides Giacomo - she dropped another Santa Anita Derby winner - a nice turf horse - and a Sea Hero sired filly who was multiple Graded Stakes placed and 4th in the Juv Fillies.

There's both speed, turf, and I guess even synthetic (Tiago) influences in his pedigree...I'm not sure he will be as bad a stallion as everyone anticipates. That might not be saying much though.

Agree completely.

horseofcourse · #51 11-14-2007, 03:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig

lil e tee really wasn't that bad a horse. gets a lot of undeserved grief.

exactly. Only race he was ever off the board was the Preakness and won 7 of 13 starts in his career. He was a good horse. Pat Day likes him!

Indian Charlie · #52 11-14-2007, 04:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

exactly. Only race he was ever off the board was the Preakness and won 7 of 13 starts in his career. He was a good horse. Pat Day likes him!

yeah, and god wanted lil e tee to win the derby that year. that's why he had drysdale scratch ap indy.

Port Conway Lane · #53 11-14-2007, 04:59 AM

So who would win if the last 23 Derby winners hooked up? Spend A Buck? Alysheba?Sunday Silence?Unbridled?Smarty Jones?Barbaro?...would Giacomo run a suck up 4th?

Sightseek · #54 11-14-2007, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Fifth of all, Giacomo's mastery of Sun King - a dominant 3-for-3 in head-to-head matchups - really underlines the point that......nevermind - Sun King blows. Bad example.

Giacomo might be the second worst Derby winner since '84...but, lets not overlook all of his fine qualities. He has an Italian name, he won me money, and he was 4th beaten just four lengths to Invasor, Bernardini, and Premium Tap in the final start of his career. Sea Hero finished his career as a 4yo with seven straight losses - and went off at 7/2 or less in each and every one of those starts.

Giacomo was a better horse than ever given credit for....even if he was the 2nd worst Derby winner.

Sightseek · #55 11-14-2007, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

There was a story I've heard before about Whirlaway getting run down on the lead in the one mile Derby Trial as a 3/5 favorite a few days before the '41 Derby.

Supposedly, Ben Jones took a knife and cut away one of his blinkers in the paddock on Derby day - he won the race by 8 lengths in record time....and his win in the Preakness next out featured one of the most amazing last-to-first wins in a major stake - along with perhaps Damascus's '67 Travers.

I guess that qualifies as a blinker change if the stories are true.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6o-5TR0m5N8

philcski · #56 11-14-2007, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PPerfectfan

That freaking Giamaco cost me the tri AND super that day!!! I only had him in the bottom 3 spots. I loved, loved Closing Arguement. And told everyone that too. He had not run a bad race, on the board in all starts before the Derby.But honestly the only reason I had Dont Get Mad was because of B.Wayne Hughes being the owner and they said he was working great. trying to be honest.lol I also had $10across on C.A. My bestfriend who was just getting into betting was having a heartattack watching me have a heartattack as they turned for home and C.A was right there at 70/1. Freaking Giamaco, the nag.

I figured DGM for a clunk up 4th or 5th, he was sharp and fit the shape of the race- that's about the only thing I had right in that derby. Keyed Alex in exactas and tris but couldn't come up with Giacomo if I had the next day's newspaper. Hell, I didn't even think Closing Argument was an automatic toss.

If you guys can, watch the CD replay of the '05 Derby. About halfway down the stretch Krystbosch can't figure out who Closing Argument is, and you can hear him shuffle his race notes to find which one the 18 was. I'll give him a pass, I think he figured he'd have to call his name once and be done with him

Danzig · #57 11-14-2007, 10:59 AM

surprised no one mentioned funny cide.

seriously tho, out of all of them since i've been around, the worst was gato del sol.

Port Conway Lane · #58 11-14-2007, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig

surprised no one mentioned funny cide.

His Preakness keeps him out of the cellar.

letswastemoney · #59 11-14-2007, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Port Conway Lane

His Preakness keeps him out of the cellar.

His 4 year old season was consistent, yet rarely remembered. The JCGC and 3rd by a neck in the Suburban plus the Excelsior win give enough credibility.

Sightseek · #60 11-14-2007, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by letswastemoney

His 4 year old season was consistent, yet rarely remembered. The JCGC and 3rd by a neck in the Suburban plus the Excelsior win give enough credibility.

I loved that Suburban race!