The Perkins Trade: One of the Worst in NBA History

[dalakhani]

Now that the Celtics have been sent on their way, I think it is fair to say that the trade deadline swap of Perkins and Robinson for Krstic, Green and 2012 clipper first rounder is arguably one of the worst trades in NBA history.

Now before anyone starts throwing tomatoes, I don't mean from a material standpoint. Certainly the Clippers first rounder next year will be no worse than mid tier and possibly even a lottery pick. Green was not too long ago a top five pick and averaged 14 a game for a playoff team. That is not a terrible haul for a soon to be free agent who wanted a contract the celts were unwilling to pay.

The reason it is one of the worst trades in NBA history is because it took a team that was in the drivers seat for home court advantage throughout the playoffs and turned them into a road team for the conference semifinals. It took a team with the toughest interior defense in the league and made them rely on the knees of Jermaine O'neal. Worst of all, it took away the chemistry and that "edge" the celtics had by being the bullies of the east.

Wade and Lebron lived in the lane. Would that have been the case if Perkins was there to clean up, clotheslines and forearms in tow?

Its hard to say if the Celtics would have won the championship with Perkins, but I think one would have to be naive not to notice the differences in the way teams attacked Boston after the trade. I have never seen a trade turn a contender into such a mediocrity overnight.

[clyde]

splat!!!!










Kidding....so true.

[horseofcourse]

You may be right, but I'm still not convinced Miami wins that series without the decapitation of Rondo's left arm. Even with a crippled point guard, Boston was not too far at all from winning both game's 4 and 5.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

You may be right, but I'm still not convinced Miami wins that series without the decapitation of Rondo's left arm. Even with a crippled point guard, Boston was not too far at all from winning both game's 4 and 5.

I agree. But then against Chicago? Chicago would have abused them in the paint like they did the last time they played.

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

You may be right, but I'm still not convinced Miami wins that series without the decapitation of Rondo's left arm. Even with a crippled point guard, Boston was not too far at all from winning both game's 4 and 5.

Bingo.

The bigger problem was that Ainge and Doc gambled on Shaq's health and lost. A 100% or thereabouts Shaq changes things in the lane against Miami, even without Perk. The timing of the trade also wasn't great, as it came at a time when the Celts were cruising and didn't give them much time to incorporate all the new pieces. Green is a good player, but you could tell he wasn't confident within the Celtic offense in the playoffs.

Bottom line is while the trade may have hindered their chances at a title this season, calling it 'one of the worst in NBA history' is hysterical IMO. Perk is a big, strong post defender who doesn't move well and couldn't play in the 4th quarter because he was (and is) a complete liability on offense. Perkins was very valuable to the C's when they played Orlando because of his ability to keep Howard out of the paint, but that's about it.

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

I agree. But then against Chicago? Chicago would have abused them in the paint like they did the last time they played.

The Celtics likely wouldn't have beaten the Bulls with or without Perkins. Their defense is too good and their frontcourt is deeper and more athletic than any in the NBA.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Would appear that Boston's players have a tendency to get hurt. They play in a style that results in this. If it ain't Rondo, it would possibly be Perkins getting re-injured. You can't say that, because he's playing for OKC, then, he'd been fine to play for Boston. The Celtics have a different style.

2009: Garnett

2010: Perkins

2011: Rondo

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Would appear that Boston's players have a tendency to get hurt. They play in a style that results in this. If it ain't Rondo, it would possibly be Perkins getting re-injured. You can't say that, because he's playing for OKC, then, he'd been fine to play for Boston. The Celtics have a different style.

2009: Garnett

2010: Perkins

2011: Rondo

Meh. KG has had knee problems going back to his days in Minnesota and both Perkins and Rondo got hurt in freakish ways. They did have a lot of injuries this season in particular, but that's more due to their collective age.

[dalakhani]

The fact that the celtics were in serious contention for home court advantage and the trade hindered their ability to win a title is precisely why it's one of the worst trades in history.

Can you recall another deadline move where a conference leader trades one of it's starters, loses two seeds and goes 16-12 the rest of the way?

[ateamstupid]

When I think of a terrible trade, I think of something like the Herschel Walker/Steve Young/Dominique Wilkins deals. This was an ill-timed trade, but I'm pretty sure if Shaq stayed healthy and Rondo doesn't lose his arm, it doesn't look nearly as bad as it does now.

It's an easy scapegoat for a team that suffered through a bunch of injuries and frankly, gave away two games in the series against Miami (with the help of some typically Sternian officiating in Game 5).

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Meh. KG has had knee problems going back to his days in Minnesota and both Perkins and Rondo got hurt in freakish ways. They did have a lot of injuries this season in particular, but that's more due to their collective age.

They are a very physical team. You think it's been just bad luck? Perkins n' Rondo's injuries weren't age related. Perkins is just 26 (hard to believe.)

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

They are a very physical team. You think it's been just bad luck? Perkins n' Rondo's injuries weren't age related. Perkins is just 26 (hard to believe.)

I ask this seriously, did you watch either of the plays they got hurt on? Bynum went over the back on Perk (as he'd been doing all series) and Perk came down wrong on his knee with Bynum's weight added. Rondo was WWF leg sweeped by Wade and landed wrong on his elbow. It doesn't have anything to do with what team they're on, anybody who takes awkward falls like that is going to seriously injure themselves.

[herkhorse]

PG1985 had a large bet on Boston winning the whole thing. nuff said.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

When I think of a terrible trade, I think of something like the Herschel Walker/Steve Young/Dominique Wilkins deals. This was an ill-timed trade, but I'm pretty sure if Shaq stayed healthy and Rondo doesn't lose his arm, it doesn't look nearly as bad as it does now.

It's an easy scapegoat for a team that suffered through a bunch of injuries and frankly, gave away two games in the series against Miami (with the help of some typically Sternian officiating in Game 5).

As I said in the first post, materially, the trade was actually pretty decent. They weren't going to pay Perkins anyway and getting a potential lottery pick as well as Green and Krstic for him was a good haul.

The timing in this deal is everything. Who makes that trade when a title is in the balance?

[declansharbor]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

As I said in the first post, materially, the trade was actually pretty decent. They weren't going to pay Perkins anyway and getting a potential lottery pick as well as Green and Krstic for him was a good haul.

The timing in this deal is everything. Who makes that trade when a title is in the balance?

The Sixers traded an injured Theo Ratliff while atop the Eastern Conference in 2001. Deke came in and helped us get to the Finals !!

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by declansharbor

The Sixers traded an injured Theo Ratliff while atop the Eastern Conference in 2001. Deke came in and helped us get to the Finals !!

Good pull but that's a different trade altogether. Mutombo and Ratliff played the same position and Deke was the best interior defender in the league at the time. Ratliff was expected to miss another 20 games at the time the trade was made and possibly more.

Trading a healthy Ratliff for Deke would have been an upgrade. Trading a seriously injured Ratliff for Deke was a no brainer. I realize that Perkins was injured when Boston traded him but it was minor. Ratliff had a pretty serious wrist injury.

[Cannon Shell]

I dont see Perkins in his current state making a difference for Boston. He wasn't going to make much of a difference against Miami. His biggest value was against Orlando and LA both who are also gone.

The idea that Perkins in the middle would have made a difference was pretty much shredded by what Memphis did. I mean would he have shutdown Joel Anthony anymore than Anthony is shutdown by his own self check? Boston's chemistry would have been much better if Paul Pierce didnt look like he aged 20 years the last 6 months, Rondo's left arm was still attached, Garnett didn't bounce after every good game and Big Baby didnt completely tank the series.

Watch Perkins tonight, he isn't moving very well even for him.

I didn't understand the trade for Boston at the time and still don't think it is going to look good in hindsight but I don't think Perkins at 80% (being kind) would have made any difference in this series.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

I ask this seriously, did you watch either of the plays they got hurt on? Bynum went over the back on Perk (as he'd been doing all series) and Perk came down wrong on his knee with Bynum's weight added. Rondo was WWF leg sweeped by Wade and landed wrong on his elbow. It doesn't have anything to do with what team they're on, anybody who takes awkward falls like that is going to seriously injure themselves.

Joey, the Celtics are chippy. They just so happen to be getting as good as they giving. Both situations are in response to chippy play during the game. They're arrogant (so they think they can always get an advantage in a physical atmosphere.) It's simply not the case. Maybe it does help them short term, but it's an injury risk (to play that style all the time.)

http://hypevideos.com/2011/02/10/old...ht-each-other/

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I dont see Perkins in his current state making a difference for Boston. He wasn't going to make much of a difference against Miami. His biggest value was against Orlando and LA both who are also gone.

The idea that Perkins in the middle would have made a difference was pretty much shredded by what Memphis did. I mean would he have shutdown Joel Anthony anymore than Anthony is shutdown by his own self check? Boston's chemistry would have been much better if Paul Pierce didnt look like he aged 20 years the last 6 months, Rondo's left arm was still attached, Garnett didn't bounce after every good game and Big Baby didnt completely tank the series.

Watch Perkins tonight, he isn't moving very well even for him.

I didn't understand the trade for Boston at the time and still don't think it is going to look good in hindsight but I don't think Perkins at 80% (being kind) would have made any difference in this series.

Memphis is a completely different team on both ends of the floor than Miami and Boston is a completely different team defensively than OKC. How you can say that what Memphis did against OKC is proof of anything that Boston would have done against Miami just doesn't make sense.

Boston's problem against Miami, aside from the obvious injury to Rondo, was that Wade and Lebron could sail through the lane unmolested and without fear. Was Krsti or 95 year old twins jermaine O and KG going to lay a body on those guys? I don't care if Perkins was 80%, on the defensive end, that is a vast improvement over what Boston had individually not to mention what it did for the team as a collective unit. Rondo was more free to take chances on the perimeter and Allen could actually put a hand up in Wade's face instead of having to give him two feet or worse, boston having to double.

I think its fair to say that its questionable that Boston would have beaten Chicago with or without Perkins. But at the same time, Boston probably would have had homecourt advantage over Miami and things might have played out a little differently. I think Boston's record AFTER the trade not to mention Rivers comments (AFTER he got the money!) give a little credence to my argument.

You might have a point that Perkins would not have made a difference but everything I saw especially the blowout in Miami at the end of the regular season tell me differently. I think if you are in contention to win a title, which anyone would agree that they were, you don't trade your starting center away (one of the top five defensive centers in the league) for a tweener, a draft pick and a soft euro.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

You might have a point that Perkins would not have made a difference but everything I saw especially the blowout in Miami at the end of the regular season tell me differently.

Would his presence have kept Rondo from getting hurt? Cuz they ain't doing shyt without Rondo. I think the trade hurt the team more in chemistry. Nate R was like a lil cheerleader on Anjo Dust. Bitch is all quiet in OKC.