12 NBA Olympian's.......No Celtics!!!! - Page 4

#61 06-24-2008, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Carmello is a question is what manner? He is an impossible matchup. He isnt there for his defense or passing. I am thinking that Wade will show up ready. We can pick the team apart all we want but outside of being thin in the middle they have all the parts.

Carmelo has no idea what it takes to win
without him being the main man. He pouts
and whines. Being that Coach K. is in the sanitizer
this presents even more problems.

I dont think K knows how to handle the pro egos.
Suggested by more than a few NBA coaches, ask your
cousin about this... I would like his take if possible.

Cannon Shell · #62 06-25-2008, 05:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddthetide

no, i'd hate to root against the USA out loud.
i'd rather see 12 guys that WANT to be there go and put up a good effort, even if the do lose.

I dont get this? What do you mean they dont want to be there? It is not like they get paid or were drafted to play. They didnt lose in 2004 becuase they didnt want to win. They lost because they selected a dysfunctional team.

Cannon Shell · #63 06-25-2008, 05:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pgardn

Carmelo has no idea what it takes to win
without him being the main man. He pouts
and whines. Being that Coach K. is in the sanitizer
this presents even more problems.

I dont think K knows how to handle the pro egos.
Suggested by more than a few NBA coaches, ask your
cousin about this... I would like his take if possible.

Carmello doesnt have any idea what it takes to win? Save that crap for 8th graders. He did lead his team to an NCAA Championship as a freshman. His team did win 50 games last year. He did play on the USA team that wiped the floor with everyone last summer, leading scorer in fact.
Coach K was the pick because he has no axe to grind and has the respect of everyone. I know that much already. But I will tell him that you think Carmello isnt a "winner". I'm sure he will find that rich.

docicu3 · #64 06-25-2008, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Would you care to wager?

Why don't we figure out what Vegas is offering and come up with something Chuck. And by the way I am not pessimistic about USA basketball I just don't like the hypocrisy of some of the selection process. I have access to info you don't because of people who live locally here but since I heard this on the radio today like it was news I guess I can fess up abit here.

C. Boozer named one of the 12 Apostles of Basketball this time around hasn't played a day yet with this team according to David Aldridge yesterday which kind of blows a hole in the "these guys have been playing together for years for the Olympics". The team was put together by.......cmon'n now fill in the blank and then it will make sense to you if you know your NBA history why there are no Celtics on this team.

#65 06-25-2008, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Carmello doesnt have any idea what it takes to win? Save that crap for 8th graders. He did lead his team to an NCAA Championship as a freshman. His team did win 50 games last year. He did play on the USA team that wiped the floor with everyone last summer, leading scorer in fact.
Coach K was the pick because he has no axe to grind and has the respect of everyone. I know that much already. But I will tell him that you think Carmello isnt a "winner". I'm sure he will find that rich.

When he is not the main man.
No distortions with my post. With Syracuse, he was the man.
And he was playing against Children. Dont even use that comparison.

What winning has he done since when it matters in the playoffs? He complains and whines. He has Iverson, the defensive MVP, and he gets taken out of his game so easily in the playoffs.
I dont give a crap about him being the leading scorer, thats probably bad.
And I will say it again. Carmello has no idea how to win if he is NOT the main man. He is a selfish child. Easily agitated and easily taken out of his game. What about this do you not agree with? You think he has poise? Have you actually watched the guy in games IN THE NBA when it matters? In the playoffs... He FOLDS. He gets frustrated and gives up. Tell me what you disagree with about Carmello in NBA games that count.

BTW I still think we will win because of superior talent.
But I think Carmello is easily replaced with someone else.
Carmello is there for the kids who have his jersey. He is
very popular. He should do great scoring when the US is up by 20 points
and he knows he has superior talent around him. He is very gifted, I will give
you that. But he is an infant as an all around basketball player and
we dont need him. Can you realistically see Carmello through his superior
ability to win pulling out a close game through sheer will in an important
NBA game and not against guys that have no way to cover him.

Coach K was picked because the NBA coaches dont want any piece of those
egos at one time.

#66 06-25-2008, 02:44 PM

If Carmelo is on the team just add Vince Carter as well.
Thats the direction Carmello is headed.

ddthetide · #67 06-25-2008, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I don't get this? What do you mean they don't want to be there? It is not like they get paid or were drafted to play. They didn't lose in 2004 because they didn't want to win. They lost because they selected a dysfunctional team.

they will get paid. the agents talk these guys into going and the agents use it as leverage to deal with the shoe and clothing companies. most of the the American players aren't going to play for the USA. they are playing for themselves and let the agents figure how to get them a few more dollars.
the foreign players are proud to play for their home countries and try to beat the Americans. the hockey tourney is the same way. it's a Very big deal to foreign players.

Cannon Shell · #68 06-25-2008, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by docicu3

Why don't we figure out what Vegas is offering and come up with something Chuck. And by the way I am not pessimistic about USA basketball I just don't like the hypocrisy of some of the selection process. I have access to info you don't because of people who live locally here but since I heard this on the radio today like it was news I guess I can fess up abit here.

C. Boozer named one of the 12 Apostles of Basketball this time around hasn't played a day yet with this team according to David Aldridge yesterday which kind of blows a hole in the "these guys have been playing together for years for the Olympics". The team was put together by.......cmon'n now fill in the blank and then it will make sense to you if you know your NBA history why there are no Celtics on this team.

Honestly this supposed anti-Celtics thing is insane. Boozer was hurt last summer or had some kind of surgery. Garnett and Allen already have gold medals. You honestly think if Kevin Garnett had said 2 years ago or last year that he wanted to be a part of this that he wouldnt be? Pierce isnt really what they need nor is Allen. Not to mention that these guys just played 26 post season games after 81 regular season games and they would be the oldest guys on the team save Kidd. Not to mention that they have been banged up.

My sources are pretty solid by the way...

Cannon Shell · #69 06-25-2008, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pgardn

When he is not the main man.
No distortions with my post. With Syracuse, he was the man.
And he was playing against Children. Dont even use that comparison.

What winning has he done since when it matters in the playoffs? He complains and whines. He has Iverson, the defensive MVP, and he gets taken out of his game so easily in the playoffs.
I dont give a crap about him being the leading scorer, thats probably bad.
And I will say it again. Carmello has no idea how to win if he is NOT the main man. He is a selfish child. Easily agitated and easily taken out of his game. What about this do you not agree with? You think he has poise? Have you actually watched the guy in games IN THE NBA when it matters? In the playoffs... He FOLDS. He gets frustrated and gives up. Tell me what you disagree with about Carmello in NBA games that count.

BTW I still think we will win because of superior talent.
But I think Carmello is easily replaced with someone else.
Carmello is there for the kids who have his jersey. He is
very popular. He should do great scoring when the US is up by 20 points
and he knows he has superior talent around him. He is very gifted, I will give
you that. But he is an infant as an all around basketball player and
we dont need him. Can you realistically see Carmello through his superior
ability to win pulling out a close game through sheer will in an important
NBA game and not against guys that have no way to cover him.

Coach K was picked because the NBA coaches dont want any piece of those
egos at one time.

So let me understand your theory. Anthony is a loser when he isnt needed to be the main guy? That is rich. He happened to be the leading scorer on last years team that included Kobe and LeBron. But he isnt a loser when he is the main guy? Lets face it, you dont like him because he isnt exactly a role model and he is a scorer. Last i looked basketball is a team game. This 'he doesnt know how to win" crap is bunk. KG had no idea how to win either until he got to a team with other good players. NOW he is a winner? I guess Eddie House learned how to be a winner this year too and Pierce and Allen. That "winners" crap is just plain stupid.

Everybody loves the NCAA game and how it is teamwork and all that jazz. yet this selfish, one dimensional loser was able to almost single handedly win the title beating all those other "teams". Yeah he is awful. Put your money up too...

Cannon Shell · #70 06-25-2008, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddthetide

they will get paid. the agents talk these guys into going and the agents use it as leverage to deal with the shoe and clothing companies. most of the the American players aren't going to play for the USA. they are playing for themselves and let the agents figure how to get them a few more dollars.
the foreign players are proud to play for their home countries and try to beat the Americans. the hockey tourney is the same way. it's a Very big deal to foreign players.

You are kidding right? Darren these guys like Kobe and LeBron have giant contracts already. They surely dont need the olympics for exposure. If anything a loss is a potential bad mark. THE OTHER TEAMS ARE MOSTLY PROS TOO!!!!!!! There are foreign guys drafted every year in the NBA draft that DONT COME BECAUSE THEY ARE ALREADY MAKING A LOT OF MONEY playing in the foreign pro leagues!!!! There is no doubt that we are a target but that is because we are the top country for basketball. I just dont understand why guys who are making a lot of money cant be patriotic too.

This aint the international version of hoosiers regardless of what the announcers say.

The hockey players are all pros too. And not that I am an NHL expert or anything arent the great majority of the players in the NHL foreign?

#71 06-25-2008, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

So let me understand your theory. Anthony is a loser when he isnt needed to be the main guy? That is rich. He happened to be the leading scorer on last years team that included Kobe and LeBron. But he isnt a loser when he is the main guy? Lets face it, you dont like him because he isnt exactly a role model and he is a scorer. Last i looked basketball is a team game. This 'he doesnt know how to win" crap is bunk. KG had no idea how to win either until he got to a team with other good players. NOW he is a winner? I guess Eddie House learned how to be a winner this year too and Pierce and Allen. That "winners" crap is just plain stupid.

Everybody loves the NCAA game and how it is teamwork and all that jazz. yet this selfish, one dimensional loser was able to almost single handedly win the title beating all those other "teams". Yeah he is awful. Put your money up too...

KG tried hard every night at Minnesota when he had no chance. Mellow is on a 50 win team and then folds up the tent. Same stuff every year with this guy. Absolutely terrible comparison.

Do you think Carmelo is a poised basketball player?
Do you think he plays well when it matters?

If you answer yes to either of the above I dont know who you are watching.

And comparing his scoring with Lebron and Kobe is crazy. Kobe at least knows that the team has plenty of scoring and was told last summer his role was lock down D. And that is exactly what Kobe did. Another horrible comparison. He scores well in 40 point blowouts... wonderful. What kind of way is that to rate a player? Rate him when he is under some sort of pressure.

I dont care what he does in his off time, I care what he does on the court when it matters. And you are correct, all he basically does is score. And if he is not allowed to do that like in the playoffs, he gives up. That is exactly what I saw.
What did you see?

Good stuff.

ddthetide · #72 06-25-2008, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You are kidding right? Darren these guys like Kobe and LeBron have giant contracts already. They surely don't need the olympics for exposure. If anything a loss is a potential bad mark. THE OTHER TEAMS ARE MOSTLY PROS TOO!!!!!!! There are foreign guys drafted every year in the NBA draft that DON'T COME BECAUSE THEY ARE ALREADY MAKING A LOT OF MONEY playing in the foreign pro leagues!!!! There is no doubt that we are a target but that is because we are the top country for basketball. I just don't understand why guys who are making a lot of money cant be patriotic too.

This aint the international version of hoosiers regardless of what the announcers say.

The hockey players are all pros too. And not that I am an NHL expert or anything aren't the great majority of the players in the NHL foreign?

in kobe and lebron's case, their sponsors are " encouraging" them to play to make sure those specific brands get the same exposure. those two owe it to those sponsors to be there.
i understand the foreign players are pros also. i'm just saying it means more to the foreign players to play for their home country than it means to American players. American players just don't get how much the international competitions mean to the rest of the world.

Cannon Shell · #73 06-25-2008, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddthetide

in kobe and lebron's case, their sponsors are " encouraging" them to play to make sure those specific brands get the same exposure. those two owe it to those sponsors to be there.
i understand the foreign players are pros also. i'm just saying it means more to the foreign players to play for their home country than it means to American players. American players just don't get how much the international competitions mean to the rest of the world.

I just dont know how you quantify this. Guys who have contracts worth hundreds of millions of dollars need to go spend a month playing 7 or 8 games in order to get more exposure? That is a stretch, a real stretch. Why does it mean more for foreign players? I dont understand your reasoning. It means more to Manu Ginobili to play for his country than it means for Dwight Howard to play for his? Why would that be? International competition in basketball used to mean a serious ass whipping for the other teams. Do you think that our guys dont know that we have been knocked down a notch? Dont you think they want a gold medal like the guys that have come before them? Did the guys who played last year in the tourney no one but me seemingly watched do it for the sponsors then too? Dont you think Kobe or LeBron could have begged out of last years qualifier and still be on this team?

Cannon Shell · #74 06-25-2008, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pgardn

KG tried hard every night at Minnesota when he had no chance. Mellow is on a 50 win team and then folds up the tent. Same stuff every year with this guy. Absolutely terrible comparison.

Do you think Carmelo is a poised basketball player?
Do you think he plays well when it matters?

If you answer yes to either of the above I dont know who you are watching.

And comparing his scoring with Lebron and Kobe is crazy. Kobe at least knows that the team has plenty of scoring and was told last summer his role was lock down D. And that is exactly what Kobe did. Another horrible comparison. He scores well in 40 point blowouts... wonderful. What kind of way is that to rate a player? Rate him when he is under some sort of pressure.

I dont care what he does in his off time, I care what he does on the court when it matters. And you are correct, all he basically does is score. And if he is not allowed to do that like in the playoffs, he gives up. That is exactly what I saw.
What did you see?

Good stuff.

So KG tries and Carmello doesnt? He isnt a 'winner'? He wins the NCAA championship as a freshman. Gets drafted by Denver who won 17 games the previous year. The next year they win 43 and make the playoffs. They win 49, 44, 45, and 50 games. Maybe you thought different but no one gave Denver a chance of advancing in the playoffs because even though they have some talented players they are a dysfunctional, mismatched team with more cancers than Anthony ever thought of being. Was Bob McAdoo not a winner when he played for Buffalo but became a winner late in his career when he was traded to a team with 4 hall of famers? If you switch him and Paul Pierce do you think Denver makes a playoff run? You love to make these blanket, unprovable statements like "does he play well when it matters?" When exactly does it matter? The NBA finals? The All Star game? Feb 3rd against Portland? The NCAA Championship? The guy is an unstoppable offensive threat. Is he MJ? Is he Bird? No but he is what he is, a tough shooter that can score in a variety of ways including the short intl three. He can score in the post. He can back his guy down or face up. He has a deadly mid range jumper. Think playing with LeBron, Kidd, Paul and Williams feeding him the ball wont be an awful matchup for every team?

#75 06-25-2008, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

So KG tries and Carmello doesnt? He isnt a 'winner'? He wins the NCAA championship as a freshman. Gets drafted by Denver who won 17 games the previous year. The next year they win 43 and make the playoffs. They win 49, 44, 45, and 50 games. Maybe you thought different but no one gave Denver a chance of advancing in the playoffs because even though they have some talented players they are a dysfunctional, mismatched team with more cancers than Anthony ever thought of being. Was Bob McAdoo not a winner when he played for Buffalo but became a winner late in his career when he was traded to a team with 4 hall of famers? If you switch him and Paul Pierce do you think Denver makes a playoff run? You love to make these blanket, unprovable statements like "does he play well when it matters?" When exactly does it matter? The NBA finals? The All Star game? Feb 3rd against Portland? The NCAA Championship? The guy is an unstoppable offensive threat. Is he MJ? Is he Bird? No but he is what he is, a tough shooter that can score in a variety of ways including the short intl three. He can score in the post. He can back his guy down or face up. He has a deadly mid range jumper. Think playing with LeBron, Kidd, Paul and Williams feeding him the ball wont be an awful matchup for every team?

It matters in the playoffs. The NBA playoffs. Not the NCAA where he is faster, bigger, better than anyone he faces. When he faces guys that can actually frustrate him, he shuts down. He does not find a way to get it done.

Look at his series against the Lakers. It was absolutely putrid. When they needed him, he did what all overly talented guys do that do not know how to use smarts. He forced it. He used what always comes easy for him. He forced his way to the basket. Got offensive fouls, did not look for other players. He could NOT adjust. When that did not work, he forced 3's when it started to get out of hand. He is predictable and bad under pressure.
That is what I see so far. The Nuggets would definitely be worse without him.
But they go nowhere with him as the lead player in the playoffs. He has plenty of time to make the necessary adjustments because he is a supertalented athlete.

He will actually be fine for our Olympic team just like V. Carter would be. He has all the back up systems he needs. But if there is ever a close game where we have to catch up in the last part of a elimination game, I personally dont want him on the court... When it matters.

Cannon Shell · #76 06-25-2008, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pgardn

It matters in the playoffs. The NBA playoffs. Not the NCAA where he is faster, bigger, better than anyone he faces. When he faces guys that can actually frustrate him, he shuts down. He does not find a way to get it done.

Look at his series against the Lakers. It was absolutely putrid. When they needed him, he did what all overly talented guys do that do not know how to use smarts. He forced it. He used what always comes easy for him. He forced his way to the basket. Got offensive fouls, did not look for other players. He could NOT adjust. When that did not work, he forced 3's when it started to get out of hand. He is predictable and bad under pressure.
That is what I see so far. The Nuggets would definitely be worse without him.
But they go nowhere with him as the lead player in the playoffs. He has plenty of time to make the necessary adjustments because he is a supertalented athlete.

He will actually be fine for our Olympic team just like V. Carter would be. He has all the back up systems he needs. But if there is ever a close game where we have to catch up in the last part of a elimination game, I personally dont want him on the court... When it matters.

I surrender