Zenyatta

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by 10 pnt move up

I told you if I owned the horse our schedule would have been the SA Handicap, Dubai WC, HGC, Pacific Classic, JCGC and the BC Classic.

But saying she did not run in many meaningful races is just ludicris because the competition did not show up. I can make the same argument for half of Cigars races then.

Same thing happened with Azeri, so she only ran in 1-2 meaningful races...I just can't by that.

Again, I know you know how ridiculous your argument is. She didn't run in meaningful races. The competition didn't show up because

A) the males couldn't
B) because dirt horses don't want to run on synth

The competition was there in the Big Cap, Hollywood Gold Cup, Pacific Classic and Goodwood. She didn't show up.

[gales0678]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

Again, I know you know how ridiculous your argument is. She didn't run in meaningful races. The competition didn't show up because

A) the males couldn't
B) because dirt horses don't want to run on synth

The competition was there in the Big Cap, Hollywood Gold Cup, Pacific Classic and Goodwood. She didn't show up.

jay stop blaming her , she wanted to run in those spots , i spoke to her , it was all the fault of moss and sheriffs

[10 pnt move up]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

Again, I know you know how ridiculous your argument is. She didn't run in meaningful races. The competition didn't show up because

A) the males couldn't
B) because dirt horses don't want to run on synth

The competition was there in the Big Cap, Hollywood Gold Cup, Pacific Classic and Goodwood. She didn't show up.

You are the first person I have seen that thinks the Big Cap, HGC, Pacific Classic contained good horses........the fact those males are so horrendous is the reason its irritating she did not run in those races. I still don't see how she only ran in 2-3 meaningful races in her ENTIRE career when all she did was run in Grade 1 races, but you are entitled to your opinion.

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by 10 pnt move up

You are the first person I have seen that thinks the Big Cap, HGC, Pacific Classic contained good horses........the fact those males are so horrendous is the reason its irritating she did not run in those races. I still don't see how she only ran in 2-3 meaningful races in her ENTIRE career when all she did was run in Grade 1 races, but you are entitled to your opinion.

I said the races contained good horses? Read much?

[10 pnt move up]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

I said the races contained good horses? Read much?

So "competition" meant what?

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by 10 pnt move up

So "competition" meant what?

You tell me. You are the one that said the competition didn't show up.

But even you have to admit there were better horses in those races than the ones she ran in before the Classic. They weren't good, but a lot better than she faced.

[Indian Charlie]

And, and, they were run at the classic distance of a mile and a quarter!!

[Duvalier]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

Good luck getting an answer to this.

What's your opinion on JC Guerrero for Trainer of the Year?

[brockguy]

What would her year have been like had she not gotten up by a head to defeat Anabaa's Creation last year in Del Mar?? Simply racing against open company in Californian would have been enough for many.. I wish she had gone to Dubai (she may still do) or try turf, just do something a little different to the other few years without having to leave California..

I thought it was such a remarkable run on Saturday and was clearly her best run yet. She doesn't deserve HOY but I think she'll get it!

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by philcski

I don't think there's any evidence to support that. Especially considering the fact that you're dealing with 2yo's without a lot of established form.

The three outliers would be the 5th, 6th and 11th- the 5th, an allowance won by almost 20 but in a rather modest time- resulting in a 73 raw Beyer; the 6th, a very fast maiden won by 8 for an 84 raw Beyer, and the 11th, a slow maiden won with a raw Beyer of 59.

5th: The connections of Blame sent out the winner, who was visually impressive- but the also-rans looked like they wanted a place to lie down. There's a good chance this is a negative key race.

6th: Steve Asmussen sends out a dominating 2yo winner who went off favored in his 2nd start and ran well, then crushes in his 3rd start. I've heard this story before.

11th: The winner went off at 3-1 despite being in the 12 hole and debuting at Presque Isle, 4th beaten 6 lengths. The only other horse to run went off favored, and was dreadful at KEE. Clearly, this was the weakest of the three maiden races at 6F on the day. Not surprising that it was also the slowest race on the day.

You might be right. It's hard to say. The filly that won the 2nd race looks like a nice filly and I would have exepcted her final time to be about a second or so faster than the winner of the final race. So that is evidence that does not support my argument.

On the other hand, the 9th race that day (an allowance race that was as strong as a stakes race) went in 1:19. That $40k filly that won the 1st race ran 1:12 3/5 which is almost as fast. Yet I don't think that filly would have finished within 5 lengths if she was in the 9th race. To me that is some evidence that the track was slower later in the day.

So I don't know. There is conflicting evidence.

[philcski]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

You might be right. It's hard to say. The filly that won the 2nd race looks like a nice filly and I would have exepcted her final time to be about a second or so faster than the winner of the final race. So that is evidence that does not support my argument.

On the other hand, the 9th race that day (an allowance race that was as strong as a stakes race) went in 1:19. That $40k filly that won the 1st race ran 1:12 3/5 which is almost as fast. Yet I don't think that filly would have finished within 5 lengths if she was in the 9th race. To me that is some evidence that the track was slower later in the day.

So I don't know. There is conflicting evidence.

There isn't as much difference between a $40k claimer and an N1X for 2yo's; hell, Nina Fever ran the best 2yo non-stake race for winners at KEE this fall in a $30k race. I think the reason for this is most 2yo's with ability get tossed straight into stakes and skip allowance company.

I didn't think a whole lot of that allowance race when I looked at it, to be honest.

[DaTruth]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

I think I just got dumber reading that.

I gave up midway through the first sentence.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by philcski

There isn't as much difference between a $40k claimer and an N1X for 2yo's; hell, Nina Fever ran the best 2yo non-stake race for winners at KEE this fall in a $30k race. I think the reason for this is most 2yo's with ability get tossed straight into stakes and skip allowance company.

I didn't think a whole lot of that allowance race when I looked at it, to be honest.

In general you are right that most 2yo's with ability do go straight into stakes races and the2 year old allowance races often times are not that strong. But this was not a typical 2 year old allowance race. The favorite in there had just won easily at Belmont and run a 93 Beyer. The 2nd choice in there won by 10 lengths first time out at Calder and got an 80 Beyer. That horse was purchased privately after that race for $350,000 and would have gone for more if he wasn't by D' Wildcat. This was his first start since the purchase. Then there was the Catalano horse had just run 4th in the Grade III Arlington Washington Futurity. And then there was the Pletcher who had been working heads up with More Than Real and Pluck. On paper, it looked like a stakes race.

[Handicappy]

Originally Posted by Left Bank

bullshit! I'll NEVER forget it,and I'll be rubbing it in every Zenyatta fan's face that I can,for as long as I live!

yet more proof of Zenyatta's greatness

[Handicappy]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You are simply a faceless troll on the internet. I have a grasp of the sport that you just aren't intellegent enough to understand. Keep making up phony idiocy like "footwork" and other garbage like your flawed charts that no one else cares about. Only about 10% of the people who are involved or follow this sport really have any clue as to what really is happening. You shouldn't be ashamed that you fall into the other 90%. There are some people who are far smarter than you that don't get it either.

You probably should try to get some help before your self-loathing becomes dangerous to others.

so you are obviously right because ............. well because you have thought it and therefore you are right. It is sad when someone has to pontificate about how much more of a grasp they have of something than 90% of the others. That kind of self-elevation only means the drop is that much harder. So if we don't agree with you, we are faceless internet trolls who don't get it? Man, you must have alot of yes-men around you to keep that ego going. This blog is getting far to full of just this kind of "let me elevate myself by making someone else look foolish".

[slotdirt]

Originally Posted by Handicappy

so you are obviously right because ............. well because you have thought it and therefore you are right. It is sad when someone has to pontificate about how much more of a grasp they have of something than 90% of the others. That kind of self-elevation only means the drop is that much harder. So if we don't agree with you, we are faceless internet trolls who don't get it? Man, you must have alot of yes-men around you to keep that ego going. This blog is getting far to full of just this kind of "let me elevate myself by making someone else look foolish".

Don't you know who Cannon SHell is? Of course he has a lot of yes man. Good God.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by 10 pnt move up

ah running in 14 grade 1 races and only 2-3 you consider meaningful.

Why do you follow the sport then, what does that say about the time you are wasting if you think like that?

what horse did that this year? they should be in the running for hoy. it's far more than what blame or zenyatta have done this year.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Handicappy

so you are obviously right because ............. well because you have thought it and therefore you are right. It is sad when someone has to pontificate about how much more of a grasp they have of something than 90% of the others. That kind of self-elevation only means the drop is that much harder. So if we don't agree with you, we are faceless internet trolls who don't get it? Man, you must have alot of yes-men around you to keep that ego going. This blog is getting far to full of just this kind of "let me elevate myself by making someone else look foolish".

If you are wrong, you are wrong. I don't make idiots like you and TFM write stupid things. But I will point it out when you do. If that is too much for you to deal with then you can check in at some of the other public forums where the ratio is a lot closer to 99%/1%.

[Handicappy]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

Don't you know who Cannon SHell is? Of course he has a lot of yes man. Good God.

I do know exactly who he is.

[Handicappy]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

If you are wrong, you are wrong. I don't make idiots like you and TFM write stupid things. But I will point it out when you do. If that is too much for you to deal with then you can check in at some of the other public forums where the ratio is a lot closer to 99%/1%.

My goodness. It is worse than I thought. We aren't talking about facts here! Opinions are being expressed. Everyone on this site is prone to mistakes in judgement. Andy S even acknowledges wearing a dunce hat periodically. And I am not the one shooting out names like Idiots/trolls/etc. to those who stand in disagreement with me.

I have respect for your decisions regarding bloodstock and training and know some of the owners you have given advise to. That doesn't make you right! Perhaps you should consider the 99%/1% forum as then you would have more folks giving you unquestioned support without anyone trying to point out or challenge you on your demeanor.