Derby Aftermath

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by Mike

Should we just cave in and embrace this darker, seedier side of horse racing? Could producing a Narcos style Netflix series that depicts a Baffert-like trainer, high society clients and Arab sheiks create an explosion of interest in the game?

Why do we even think it will ever change. Baffert will win the Derby next year

My introduction to horse racing came watching the movie “The Black Stallion”. I learned then that they cheat and I’ve worked under the assumption that everyone cheats from the very beginning. I’m just not gonna sit here and talk about the integrity of the sport when I’ve never believed there was much to begin with so nothing surprises me. I can sit here and act like I’m so appalled and outraged but I know I’ll be betting on the weekend....on Baffert’s horses....so what would be the point?

[Hickory Hill Hoff]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

My introduction to horse racing came watching the movie “The Black Stallion”. I learned then that they cheat and I’ve worked under the assumption that everyone cheats from the very beginning. I’m just not gonna sit here and talk about the integrity of the sport when I’ve never believed there was much to begin with so nothing surprises me. I can sit here and act like I’m so appalled and outraged but I know I’ll be betting on the weekend....on Baffert’is horses....so what would be the point?

Totally agree! if you can't do anything about it and it's a waste of your money ....... DON'T BET!

[fpsoxfan]

During the pandemic I was betting Fonner park and whatever Australia had to offer along with whatever tree in my backyard bloomed first. I’ll be taking in all the Pimilco action Saturday. Enjoy!

[moses]

Lukas isn’t helping with the public perception of the sport.

https://twitter.com/downeyprofile/st...877315590?s=21

[fpsoxfan]

Originally Posted by moses

Lukas isn’t helping with the public perception of the sport.

https://twitter.com/downeyprofile/st...877315590?s=21

Before the cancel culture gets any more carried away, here’s what Lukas really said to a real TV station.

https://www.wbaltv.com/article/bob-b...ainer/36412469

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

My introduction to horse racing came watching the movie “The Black Stallion”. I learned then that they cheat and I’ve worked under the assumption that everyone cheats from the very beginning. I’m just not gonna sit here and talk about the integrity of the sport when I’ve never believed there was much to begin with so nothing surprises me. I can sit here and act like I’m so appalled and outraged but I know I’ll be betting on the weekend....on Baffert’s horses....so what would be the point?

YEP

[moses]

Originally Posted by fpsoxfan

Before the cancel culture gets any more carried away, here’s what Lukas really said to a real TV station.

https://www.wbaltv.com/article/bob-b...ainer/36412469

So was that fake? Because I saw Ellis Starr and Pat Cummings tweet it and figured maybe they had actually checked it out. I see the tweet is now unavailable.

[OldDog]

Originally Posted by moses

Lukas isn’t helping with the public perception of the sport.

https://twitter.com/downeyprofile/st...877315590?s=21

I think context is important. Between those 2 quoted sentences he also said,

“Obviously (21) picograms or whatever that horse had had no effect on the race or his performance. And every vet and every scientist and every lab will tell you that.”

[knickslions2]

Originally Posted by OldDog

I think context is important. Between those 2 quoted sentences he also said,

“Obviously (21) picograms or whatever that horse had had no effect on the race or his performance. And every vet and every scientist and every lab will tell you that.”

The lower level excuse doesn’t matter. It’s above the limit of detection and demonstrates the drug was given inside the window it’s was allowed. Sure at that time of race it probably had no impact but still is against rules. I still call bull on the vet no knowing it was in otomax. It’s a key ingredient

[knickslions2]

Originally Posted by OldDog

I think context is important. Between those 2 quoted sentences he also said,

“Obviously (21) picograms or whatever that horse had had no effect on the race or his performance. And every vet and every scientist and every lab will tell you that.”

The lower level excuse doesn’t matter. It’s above the limit of detection and demonstrates the drug was given inside the window it’s was allowed. Sure at that time of race it probably had no impact but still is against rules. I still call bull on the vet not knowing it was in otomax. It’s a key ingredient

[moses]

Originally Posted by OldDog

I think context is important. Between those 2 quoted sentences he also said,

“Obviously (21) picograms or whatever that horse had had no effect on the race or his performance. And every vet and every scientist and every lab will tell you that.”

Even with that addition, his comment is incredibly tone deaf and his attitude is the exact reason there was a need for federal legislation to regulate the industry. Clearly people in the industry can’t do it themselves.

[richard burch]

Originally Posted by moses

Even with that addition, his comment is incredibly tone deaf and his attitude is the exact reason there was a need for federal legislation to regulate the industry. Clearly people in the industry can’t do it themselves.

I don't like the word "federal" but I believe it is time for 1 governing body like the major sports have. Accountability is clearly lacking.

[richard burch]

Originally Posted by knickslions2

The lower level excuse doesn’t matter. It’s above the limit of detection and demonstrates the drug was given inside the window it’s was allowed. Sure at that time of race it probably had no impact but still is against rules. I still call bull on the vet not knowing it was in otomax. It’s a key ingredient

100% Correct.

It's total BS. It just gave him another alibi to build on.

I liked BB. I trusted BB and I was made a fool by BB. In all the years I have watched this sport I have never been so let down but BB is only half of this Preakness problem.

Pimlico had a chance to say that cheating will not be tolerated. Instead they caved in like a sinkhole and should be ashamed for letting him participate in this race knowing that he broke the rules and has already been DQ'd and banned from racing in KY.

I don't care if you stick a camera up both of their asses until post time, it is not fair to the public, the jockeys , the bettors and all the other connections that have to race with a different set of rules than the so-called elite.

If BB had some courage and truly cared about the longevity and character of the sport and not how many trophy's he can get then he would have dropped out himself and wait for that split sample to confirm that he broke the rules. I am still waiting to hear some sort of apology but I guess it won't happen.

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by richard burch

100% Correct.

It's total BS. It just gave him another alibi to build on.

I liked BB. I trusted BB and I was made a fool by BB. In all the years I have watched this sport I have never been so let down but BB is only half of this Preakness problem.

Pimlico had a chance to say that cheating will not be tolerated. Instead they caved in like a sinkhole and should be ashamed for letting him participate in this race knowing that he broke the rules and has already been DQ'd and banned from racing in KY.

I don't care if you stick a camera up both of their asses until post time, it is not fair to the public, the jockeys , the bettors and all the other connections that have to race with a different set of rules than the so-called elite.

If BB had some courage and truly cared about the longevity and character of the sport and not how many trophy's he can get then he would have dropped out himself and wait for that split sample to confirm that he broke the rules. I am still waiting to hear some sort of apology but I guess it won't happen.

You sound like he broke up with you or something.

Get a grip man

[Rudeboyelvis]

Originally Posted by knickslions2

The lower level excuse doesn’t matter. It’s above the limit of detection and demonstrates the drug was given inside the window it’s was allowed. Sure at that time of race it probably had no impact but still is against rules. I still call bull on the vet not knowing it was in otomax. It’s a key ingredient

Hypothetical Question - let's assume for a moment that Rosario's iron doesn't slip on Rock Your World at the break, Asmussen actually instructs Smith to go on Midnight Bourbon (the only chance the horse had, BTW) and now Medina Spirit is pressed on the lead the whole way, fades as expected in the stretch due to pace pressure, and finishes a faltering (and expected) 8th or 9th.

How would that affect the perspective? I'd venture a bet that this would be the biggest non-story since the last time he got caught.

Instead the racing world is upside-down over it because the horse won, thus the automatic assumption by the media and casual fans of the sport is that the horse won because of this overage, not because he was allowed to walk the whole way, against one of the most horrid fields in recent history.

Context would be helpful. And it would have been refreshing to see Lukas explain that, and why the perceived cause/effect is not accurate, rather than giving Baffert a pass and adding more fuel to the fire.

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by Rudeboyelvis

Hypothetical Question - let's assume for a moment that Rosario's iron doesn't slip on Rock Your World at the break, Asmussen actually instructs Smith to go on Midnight Bourbon (the only chance the horse had, BTW) and now Medina Spirit is pressed on the lead the whole way, fades as expected in the stretch due to pace pressure, and finishes a faltering (and expected) 8th or 9th.

How would that affect the perspective? I'd venture a bet that this would be the biggest non-story since the last time he got caught.

Instead the racing world is upside-down over it because the horse won, thus the automatic assumption by the media and casual fans of the sport is that the horse won because of this overage, not because he was allowed to walk the whole way, against one of the most horrid fields in recent history.

Context would be helpful. And it would have been refreshing to see Lukas explain that, and why the perceived cause/effect is not accurate, rather than giving Baffert a pass and adding more fuel to the fire.

Bingo!

I’m pissed that Baffert feels like rules don’t apply to him and has been enabled by those in charge for years.

Medina Spirit didn’t win because he was “drugged.”

[moses]

Originally Posted by Rudeboyelvis

Hypothetical Question - let's assume for a moment that Rosario's iron doesn't slip on Rock Your World at the break, Asmussen actually instructs Smith to go on Midnight Bourbon (the only chance the horse had, BTW) and now Medina Spirit is pressed on the lead the whole way, fades as expected in the stretch due to pace pressure, and finishes a faltering (and expected) 8th or 9th.

How would that affect the perspective? I'd venture a bet that this would be the biggest non-story since the last time he got caught.

Instead the racing world is upside-down over it because the horse won, thus the automatic assumption by the media and casual fans of the sport is that the horse won because of this overage, not because he was allowed to walk the whole way, against one of the most horrid fields in recent history.

Context would be helpful. And it would have been refreshing to see Lukas explain that, and why the perceived cause/effect is not accurate, rather than giving Baffert a pass and adding more fuel to the fire.

Agreed on all that, except I really don’t think Midnight Bourbon would have impacted the race. He’s not fast enough, in my opinion. We may find out tomorrow.

[Rudeboyelvis]

Originally Posted by moses

Agreed on all that, except I really don’t think Midnight Bourbon would have impacted the race. He’s not fast enough, in my opinion. We may find out tomorrow.

I don't know if he is fast enough or not - I know he's never passed a horse in his life, so if he were to have any chance, he needs to be sent, thus would have provided some additional pace pressure at least early on.... I'm sure they are sending him tomorrow, so I agree, we'll see.

[knickslions2]

Originally Posted by Rudeboyelvis

Hypothetical Question - let's assume for a moment that Rosario's iron doesn't slip on Rock Your World at the break, Asmussen actually instructs Smith to go on Midnight Bourbon (the only chance the horse had, BTW) and now Medina Spirit is pressed on the lead the whole way, fades as expected in the stretch due to pace pressure, and finishes a faltering (and expected) 8th or 9th.

How would that affect the perspective? I'd venture a bet that this would be the biggest non-story since the last time he got caught.

Instead the racing world is upside-down over it because the horse won, thus the automatic assumption by the media and casual fans of the sport is that the horse won because of this overage, not because he was allowed to walk the whole way, against one of the most horrid fields in recent history.

Context would be helpful. And it would have been refreshing to see Lukas explain that, and why the perceived cause/effect is not accurate, rather than giving Baffert a pass and adding more fuel to the fire.

I agree with everything you said here Dan. I know we discussed the race lots that week and I did like Medina Spirit to have a shot especially if one of the other pace players didnt get out. While I don't think the horse won because of this Baffert continues to push the envelope dosing his horses. This drug does help with inflammation and is very useful after workouts for quick healing. There are rules to when its allowed to be given to keep everything fair. Its black and white in my eyes. Not to say he won by this but who is to say someone like Charlie if he had it a few days before the race doesnt close harder. Bafferts act is tiring and along with his excuses.