8/7 (DMR): Clement L. Hirsch S. (G1)

[Revidere]

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

This is further proof that you can be literally brain dead and still be a photographer.

Who writes your material?

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

That's an interesting theory but it's totally wrong. They have one goal right now and that goal is to win the BC Classic this year. There is no chance they retire her unless she gets hurt. Every move they make with her is designed to be what they think is the best path to the Classic.

By the way, they think she's better on dirt.

they say they are going to the bc. but they also said they were going to travel with her this year, let her fans see her, and try new things. if they haven't done any of that, how can you be sure they will really point to the bc? you can't. they talk a big talk, but what has she done differently this year? then you see the comments from them about cali, about not shipping, about the win streak. i don't think i'm going out on a limb by suggesting they really don't intend to go to the bc. i think they want peppers prides record, and the money won record. i think the bc is further down on the list, especially with her having won one.
it remains to be seen; i hope she goes, don't get me wrong. but it wouldn't surprise me in the least if she doesn't go.

[brianwspencer]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

If they were afraid of losing, would they have run in the BC Classic last year instead of the Distaff?

Seems quite clear that they were very afraid of losing something else that they very much thought they deserved no matter what, and that's exactly WHY they ran her in the Classic at the last second.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

That's an interesting theory but it's totally wrong. They have one goal right now and that goal is to win the BC Classic this year. There is no chance they retire her unless she gets hurt. Every move they make with her is designed to be what they think is the best path to the Classic.

By the way, they think she's better on dirt.

Surface makes her look more ordinary, take the Apple Blossom for example she just draws off in that race, on synthetics the cynics would say she is only life and death to win, but margins on synth are always invariably less than dirt. She may be sitting on her best race career wise for the BC, she looks better this year and she will drive the naysayers crazy if she wins the Classic with authority this year. That is if she wins.

[2Hot4TV]

Originally Posted by Revidere

And Quality Road has shipped where? Oh I forgot Florida. Belmont south.

QR shipped to Santa Anita and found that he didn't like the starting gate helicopter and that was that. He s h i t alover himself trying to fly back home too. It's not the travel, he just hates airports.

[2Hot4TV]

Originally Posted by CSC

Surface makes her look more ordinary, take the Apple Blossom for example she just draws off in that race, on synthetics the cynics would say she is only life and death to win, but margins on synth are always invariably less than dirt. She may be sitting on her best race career wise for the BC, she looks better this year and she will drive the naysayers crazy if she wins the Classic with authority this year. That is if she wins.

Zenyatta is arguably the greatest race horse we will see in our life time, but the day is coming when she no longer wants to race and as a 6 yo mare the day is coming soon.

[Rileyoriley]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I should correct my earlier post. They actually have 3 goals right now. First, they want to win HOY. Second, they want to win the BC Classic again. Third, they want to reamin undefeated. Every move they make is designed to accomplish these 3 goals. If they win the BC Classic, they kill two birds with one stone. They win the race and they win HOY.

When you consider that those are their 3 goals right now, it wouldn't make much sense for them to look for a tough race right now. They don't need to. They will win HOY if they win the BC Classic. If they don't win the BC Classic, they won't win HOY. Running in a tough race right now doesn't accomplish anything for them and it could hurt one of their goals. If she loses, it kills their goal of staying undefeated.

They will definitely run in the BC Classic because they desperately want to win HOY.

I'd reverse the 3 goals. Remaining undefeated and winning the BCC again will be remembered before who won HOY in 2010.

[Rileyoriley]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

It's about just trying to stay undefeated and having her cranked up to run one whole big race this year.

Coming to Saratoga and trying to beat Rachel Alexandra on dirt - the surface which most American horses are bred best for - at the Classic distance of 10fs - that would have been awesome.

They know she is more likely to finish ahead of RA in the Classic because horses like Quality Road and Rail Trip won't let her loaf ... so, it's basically a full of year of yawners leading into a half court heave at a dirt BC Classic in which she will have her best possible chance at placing in front of RA as some moral victory if she doesn't win the race outright.

After yesterday's races, personally I'm looking forward to the BCC and Blame v. Zenyatta. If both horses win their next races, we'll have the undefeated mare from the west going against the undefeated colt (in 2010) from the east. The media would hopefully eat this up and really promote the race. RA, at this point, is an afterthought.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by 2Hot4TV

Zenyatta is arguably the greatest race horse we will see in our life time, but the day is coming when she no longer wants to race and as a 6 yo mare the day is coming soon.

Her career isn't over and I haven't decided where she is to be placed amongst the all time great horses, to be fair you wait until her career is over and even then maybe years, it is human nature to look back with more objectivity.

[stonegossard]

Originally Posted by Smooth Operator

IF she can pull off a couple more wins (prep race at SA and the BCC), we're talkin' immortality.


And that will drive the haters absolutely craZZZZZZZZZZZy...

I think you are confused a bit. People like myself aren't haters. Personally...I have always been a huge fan of the big closers over speed type horses. Closers , in my humble opinion, have to do far more work to win races. I think much more can go wrong (see Ice Box in Kentucky Derby) with that type of style. So when you get a horse that keeps winning like she does, it is impressive. I was a fan of hers up until last spring/summer when the connections started to duck everyone and do the same thing yet again. Because of The BC being at SA one could argue it was the right call to stay out there. Ok..then how about running in The Hol Gold Cup or Pac Classic ? It was borderline gutless to run in those filly races. Then she runs an excellent race in The BC Classic. I was very impressed. If she had either won a real race like the two I mentioned above in Cali, then she probably wins HOY.

Then The Moss's bring her back, which is great. They say 2010 is gonna be different. Even better. Fans like me figured they learned their lesson and are gonna run vs some real fields and stay on the dirt (surface of BC.......no excuse not to run on it in 2010). But after one race at OP , they go back to their conservative/gutless campaign vs horrible fields again. What are they proving vs the same bad horses again this year ? Absolutely nothing. Her fans can continue to blab about her amazing run.....but in reality she isn't doin much more than that horse from New Mexico did. Beating the same fields over and over again. Yesterdays race was an embarassment. The race coming up at SA will probably be the same if not worse. How many times can they line up 5 cripples to run against her? I think the truth is she isn't as good as she was last year and the connections know it. This cr#p about her only winning by a head or so because she knows thats all she has to do is hilarious.

Even more funny are the people mentioning her and Cigar in the same sentence. She wouldn't have gotten within 10 lengths of him every time they faced each other.

Personally, I don't hate her. She is a cool horse. I think this year's campaign is pathetic and her connections are an embarassment for what they are doing. But I dont hate them...I just think The Moss's and Sheriffs are gutless.

[knickslions2]

Originally Posted by stonegossard

I think you are confused a bit. People like myself aren't haters. Personally...I have always been a huge fan of the big closers over speed type horses. Closers , in my humble opinion, have to do far more work to win races. I think much more can go wrong (see Ice Box in Kentucky Derby) with that type of style. So when you get a horse that keeps winning like she does, it is impressive. I was a fan of hers up until last spring/summer when the connections started to duck everyone and do the same thing yet again. Because of The BC being at SA one could argue it was the right call to stay out there. Ok..then how about running in The Hol Gold Cup or Pac Classic ? It was borderline gutless to run in those filly races. Then she runs an excellent race in The BC Classic. I was very impressed. If she had either won a real race like the two I mentioned above in Cali, then she probably wins HOY.

Then The Moss's bring her back, which is great. They say 2010 is gonna be different. Even better. Fans like me figured they learned their lesson and are gonna run vs some real fields and stay on the dirt (surface of BC.......no excuse not to run on it in 2010). But after one race at OP , they go back to their conservative/gutless campaign vs horrible fields again. What are they proving vs the same bad horses again this year ? Absolutely nothing. Her fans can continue to blab about her amazing run.....but in reality she isn't doin much more than that horse from New Mexico did. Beating the same fields over and over again. Yesterdays race was an embarassment. The race coming up at SA will probably be the same if not worse. How many times can they line up 5 cripples to run against her? I think the truth is she isn't as good as she was last year and the connections know it. This cr#p about her only winning by a head or so because she knows thats all she has to do is hilarious.

Even more funny are the people mentioning her and Cigar in the same sentence. She wouldn't have gotten within 10 lengths of him every time they faced each other.

Personally, I don't hate her. She is a cool horse. I think this year's campaign is pathetic and her connections are an embarassment for what they are doing. But I dont hate them...I just think The Moss's and Sheriffs are gutless.

Not within 10 lengths? Now I loved Cigar but you must be joking here

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Rileyoriley

After yesterday's races, personally I'm looking forward to the BCC and Blame v. Zenyatta. If both horses win their next races, we'll have the undefeated mare from the west going against the undefeated colt (in 2010) from the east. The media would hopefully eat this up and really promote the race. RA, at this point, is an afterthought.

How exactly is RA an afterthought?

Because she lost her first two off of a 9 month layoff for a guy who is a statistical deadbeat as a layoff trainer?

If St. Trinians simply broke cleanly in the Vanity - there's no possible way Zenyatta would still be undefeated.

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by knickslions2

Not within 10 lengths? Now I loved Cigar but you must be joking here

I agree. It may be more like 12.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by hockey2315

94 Beyer.

The variant for that figure was split - and that number was inflated significantly to get to 94 because of the slow pace.

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

How exactly is RA an afterthought?

Because she lost her first two off of a 9 month layoff for a guy who is a statistical deadbeat as a layoff trainer?

If St. Trinians simply broke cleanly in the Vanity - there's no possible way Zenyatta would still be undefeated.

Further, after watching the Whitney yesterday, how exactly could Quality Road win any race in which Rachel was entered? If anything he is the afterthought.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

What is so silly is that many of you keep making the same silly arguments that you were making last year. You all thought that she wasn't anything special because she wasn't beating much and she wasn't winning by big margins. You all thought she had little or no chance in the BC Classic.
After she stepped up and won the BC Classic, I would have thought that that would be enough for you to realize that you were wrong and that her winning margins and her level of competition are pretty much meaningless. Her win in the BC Classic proved that there's more in the tank than she's showing. And yet here you go again making this same argument that she must not be that good because she's beating mediocre competition by small margins. I just don't get it. The BC Classic proved that that argument is wrong and yet you guys still make that same argument.

I'm not saying that she's the greatest horse ever. I'm simply saying that you can't measure her based on these races because she is clearly capable of doing more as she proved in the BC Classic.

That really isnt true. Who exactly was the big horse everyone was touting?
The truth is that the people who knock her were right last year and are still right. These arent great races. These arent good races. She is beating crap and looking very ordinary doing it. Spin it how ever you'd like but she is really just a nice horse with quirky habits, a strong closing kick and a cupcake schedule.

Unless you just WANT her to be more than she is. Then you can say she is better than Affirmed or rank her 12 all time or whatever blasphemy you want to go with.

And you want to know why people arent flocking to see RA and Z? Because most everyone outside of 7 year old girls and retards are tired of watching glorified exibition races.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

Further, after watching the Whitney yesterday, how exactly could Quality Road win any race in which Rachel was entered? If anything he is the afterthought.

I've concocted a crazy theory that the braid bead that was whipping around wildly and kept hitting his eyeball over and over while he was trying to run might have been an explanation for his horrendous performance.

If that isn't the case, he's hopeless.

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

And you want to know why people arent flocking to see RA and Z? Because most everyone outside of 7 year old girls and retards are tired of watching glorified exibition races.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

Further, after watching the Whitney yesterday, how exactly could Quality Road win any race in which Rachel was entered? If anything he is the afterthought.

This is silly. He was flat, one time. I pray he comes back in the Woodward, then everything will be fine again.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

That really isnt true. Who exactly was the big horse everyone was touting?
The truth is that the people who knock her were right last year and are still right. These arent great races. These arent good races. She is beating crap and looking very ordinary doing it. Spin it how ever you'd like but she is really just a nice horse with quirky habits, a strong closing kick and a cupcake schedule.

Unless you just WANT her to be more than she is. Then you can say she is better than Affirmed or rank her 12 all time or whatever blasphemy you want to go with.

And you want to know why people arent flocking to see RA and Z? Because most everyone outside of 7 year old girls and retards are tired of watching glorified exibition races.

This is kind of funny, because I was fighting with my X outside, on the phone at work yesterday and for some reasson I used the word ******, and then one of the retards actually reported me for saying ******, and I hate the word but she pisses me off so much.... This is not even the kids mom, so now I get in trouble for saying ****** because retards were spying on me. ****ing bullshit.