Frankel - Page 6

santana · #**101** 06-19-2012, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

That horse is unbelievable. He made a mockery of the Queen Anne.

Pretty awesome racehorse....Now if they would only bring him over for the BC.

Calzone Lord · #**102** 06-19-2012, 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by santana

Pretty awesome racehorse....Now if they would only bring him over for the BC.

He looks even better at age 4.

The gamble is running him in the Breeders Cup Classic -- he's bred terribly top and bottom for dirt and sensationally well for turf on top and bottom.

Obviously, they're not going to bring him here to run in the BC Mile.

Arletta · #**103** 06-19-2012, 09:00 AM

Dang it!! I missed it

Calzone Lord · #**104** 06-19-2012, 09:50 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agM-AMeDCh4

I never tried to see if I could make figures for any of his races. Going to study them a little later when I get time. Visually, it sure looks like he's improved from age 3 to age 4 like virtually all healthy horses will.

Arletta · #**105** 06-19-2012, 09:59 AM

Wow!

#**106** 06-19-2012, 10:04 AM

They should enter for the bc and scratch over a bad post draw.

Calzone Lord · #**107** 06-19-2012, 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

They should enter for the bc and scratch over a bad post draw.

Calzone Lord · #**108** 06-19-2012, 10:19 AM

I'm looking back through Frankel's past races -- and in the recent ones -- I can't find another race on the same day and at the same distance until June 14th of last year in the St. James's Palace at Royal Ascot.

This, however, was Frankel on his absolute worst day.

Frankel won by 3/4 of a length over Zoffany in 1:39.24

On that exact same card, Canford Cliffs won by one length over Goldikova in 1:38.38

Frankel went 0.86 slower. The past performances of 2nd place finisher Zoffany cements the fact that the older horses were faster on that day.

It's a shame that the only day I can find a good comparison to attempt an American style speed figure for Frankel -- was the one day he didn't bring his best stuff.

outofthebox · #**109** 06-19-2012, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord

I'm looking back through Frankel's past races -- and in the recent ones -- I can't find another race on the same day and at the same distance until June 14th of last year in the St. James's Palace at Royal Ascot.

This, however, was Frankel on his absolute worst day.

Frankel won by 3/4 of a length over Zoffany in 1:39.24

On that exact same card, Canford Cliffs won by one length over Goldikova in 1:38.38

Frankel went 0.86 slower. The past performances of 2nd place finisher Zoffany cements the fact that the older horses were faster on that day.

It's a shame that the only day I can find a good comparison to attempt an American style speed figure for Frankel -- was the one day he didn't bring his best stuff.

Was this the race everyone criticized the ride for putting Frankel in a drive halfway through the race? What was Frankel's time form rating going into todays race? I keep hearing on the broadcast that he is the highest ranked horse in the world...

Calzone Lord · #**110** 06-19-2012, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by outofthebox

Was this the race everyone criticized the ride for putting Frankel in a drive halfway through the race?

Yes. Whoever was riding Frankel that day must have been studying Ronnie Franklin's Belmont.

Here is the video of Frankel holding on for dear life to win:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLmu_pHF0sA

He caught a break that the race was only a mile and that Zoffany was no world-beater.

Calzone Lord · #**111** 06-19-2012, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by outofthebox

What was Frankel's time form rating going into todays race? I keep hearing on the broadcast that he is the highest ranked horse in the world...

http://www.timeform.com/display_arti...l_Rankings.asp

outofthebox · #**112** 06-19-2012, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord

http://www.timeform.com/display_arti...l_Rankings.asp

Thanks.. Only rated 2lbs below all time high ranked Sea Bird. Imagine if he was a classic winner over a mile. He might be considered the greatest ranked horse of all time..

Calzone Lord · #**113** 06-19-2012, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by outofthebox

Thanks.. Only rated 2lbs below all time high ranked Sea Bird. Imagine if he was a classic winner over a mile. He might be considered the greatest ranked horse of all time..

I've always been a little skeptical of those Timeform ratings.

They aren't true American style speed figures and the way racing is in Europe makes them very subjective.

Of all the Euro horses I looked at -- Harbinger is BY FAR the fastest I've seen on a day when everything was clean and an American style number could be made. Sea The Stars was an undefeated Arc winner ... but he had some clean days to ... and was never anywhere close to Harbinger's clean race. Timeform had them both at 140 (Sea The Stars had a monster reputation and Harbinger came from out of nowhere at age 4 and never ran again after his masterpiece. He was injured in his very next workout)

Calzone Lord · #**114** 06-19-2012, 12:02 PM

147 Timeform for Frankel.

He's now the highest rated horse in the 60+ year history of Timeform by 2 full pounds.

Calzone Lord · #**115** 06-19-2012, 03:38 PM

Frankel went 2.29 seconds (or about 13.5 lengths and about 25 Beyer points) faster than Group 1 3-year-olds did at the same distance in the St James's Palace Stakes at the same distance today.

I made the Harbinger number as conservative as humanly possible to keep it no higher than a figure of 125.

I think Frankel's performance today was conservatively in the 120-to-125 range.

Easily the 2nd fastest turf race I've ever did a projection for -- trailing only Harbinger's win in the King George VI and Queen Elizabeth ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mo7pEsp2WKc )

Riot · #**116** 06-19-2012, 04:04 PM

Frankel was simply stunning today. Best horse of my lifetime, better than Secretariat? He's not even fully mature yet, and look at how he's become even more massive this year. Two pounds better than Sea Bird! Can't wait to see him stretch out to mile and more.

Don't forget second ranked horse, the great Aussie sprint mare Black Caviar, runs Saturday am at Ascot (last day meet)

Indian Charlie · #**117** 06-19-2012, 05:31 PM

What was the quality of todays field like?

Calzone Lord · #**118** 06-19-2012, 05:34 PM

http://www.racingpost.com/horses/res..._tabs=ANALYSIS

Thunder Gulch · #**119** 06-20-2012, 10:10 AM

It will be a shame if we never get to see him. However, I disagree strongly with those who want to see him in the Classic. I'd much rather witness his brilliance than a ridiculous gamble like the one they took with his sire Galielo when they sent him on the dirt. Why does anyone think he needs to prove anything on dirt (other than breeders), when he is quite possibly the best at his craft we've seen in a generation.

RolloTomasi · #**120** 06-20-2012, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thunder Gulch

It will be a shame if we never get to see him. However, I disagree strongly with those who want to see him in the Classic. I'd much rather witness his brilliance than a ridiculous gamble like the one they took with his sire Galielo when they sent him on the dirt. Why does anyone think he needs to prove anything on dirt (other than breeders), when he is quite possibly the best at his craft we've seen in a generation.

Godolphin (Sahkee) and Coolmore (Galileo) both took shots at the 2001 BC Classic. Sahkee nearly took down the whole thing. Galileo split the field. All in all, not a bad performance.

Especially since Godolphin and Coolmore ran 1-2 in the BC Turf with other horses on the same card, some 6 lengths clear of any American-based rival.

They've already said they won't waste their time bringing Frankel over for the BC Mile. Basically only track configuration/post position could get him beat. It's a longshot, but hopefully, they go beyond his "craft" and actually broaden his horizons at some point.