Pletcher going to California

[boswd]

Originally Posted by oracle80

Misinformation?
You say its headed in the right direction?
I have a few questions for you then.
1) Are the purses there not embarassingly small given the type of horses who winter there(like the ones YOU cited) and the fact that there is a huge horse population to draw from?
2) Are the weekday cards not an absolute disgrace containing nothing but cheap claimers and maiden claimers(as cited by trainers last year including Frankel when they went to management to complain about it)?
3) Was the refurbishment of Gulfstream Park not incredibly stupid and undertaken with no foresight as the mile and an eigth dirt races give an unfair advantage to the inside pp's causing trainers to scratch horses out of these races when drawing the outside?
Was it not also incredibly stupid to refurbish the oval leaving horseman without the possibility of running mile and a sixteenth two turn dirt races, something that Zito, Pletcher, etc complained about citing how vital they are for three year olds starting their tri crown campaigns who are not ready to go a mile and an eighth of the layoff yet need two turn seasoning?

Now geniuses, if one of you wants to debate me and tell me which one of these FACTS, not opinions, that you disagree with please feel free.
Otherwise stick to what it is that you know(perhaps needlepoint?), because you sure don't know much about how many people feel about the "new Gulfstream Park".

I am not going to disagree with that point at all except if they think they are going to find great daily races I would then like to remind everyone of Del Mar's , the most hyped west coast track, 6 claiming races a day out of 8 total races. I don't know if Santa Anita is going to be any better during the week.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Dixie Porter

Perhaps one of the geniuses on here can explain to me what exactly is wrong with claiming races. The game was born and bred with them.

Now if you want my opinion on maiden races, they should be run in the mornings before the gates open or at a track where a current meet is not ongoing.

To each his own. I love maiden races. That's where I make my biggest bets. I will rarely bet on a claiming race.

Originally Posted by Round Pen

What seems to be your problem I guess what I keep reading about you is true that you want to make everyone believe you are all knowing about everything in the business. Needle Point My A$$ I have only been here a couple of weeks I don't need to brag constantly on who I know or who I have talked too.

I have presented you with 2 articles that say slots are going to happen and increase purses at GP. Were the He!! is your facts that say that this is not going to happen. All I See is your opinion. And by trying to Implemement Slots Revolution is right saying GP is trying to go in the right Direction.

And here's the problem Round Pen. Saying something might happen some day doesnt carry the weight of what past performances and what is happening does.
Now look, I agree that slots will help Gulf's purses in theory. But noone yet has shown me any formal announcement stating that its definitely going to happen and how much they will be raised. Nor has anyone announced an increase in the number of allowance and msw's that are going to be run.
If you wanna play someday someday, Philly Park is eventually going to have huge purses and be completely revived as a racetrack. I can show you articles on that like the ones you showed me about Gulf.
But the last time I checked, Philly's purses and the class of horse running there is pathetic.
All I stated was that I spoke to several guys who were disenchanted with purses at Gulf and the lack of quality races. One of them is an owner who posts here, who may soon have a say in that very situation.
If you look at the last two meets at Gulf, they were pathetic in terms of race quality and purses. You've showed me one vague article and I'm saying that nothing in that article tells me that its going to change this meet. And I'm betting its the same deal this year as the last two years down there, small purses and more claiming races than you can shake a stick at.

One more thing Round Pen. I'll tell you right now that the purses at "lowly" Aqueduct's inner dirt track this winter for MSW's and allowance races in all comparable categories will be much higher than Gulfstreams.
Do you take issue with this and do you think Gulf's will indeed be higher? If so I have a bridge I wanna sell you.

[Gander]

Philly Park is eventually going to have huge purses and be completely revived as a racetrack

LOL! And we are all going to stop gambling and become great citizens! LOL!
What a pit that place is. Makes a cemetery look inviting.

Originally Posted by Gander

Philly Park is eventually going to have huge purses and be completely revived as a racetrack

LOL! And we are all going to stop gambling and become great citizens! LOL!
What a pit that place is. Makes a cemetery look inviting.

Tim they already have slots legislation and indeed will be kicking butt sometime soon.
I know thats hard to believe but its gonna happen with the slots money.
Its easier for me to believe that then it is that Gulf is suddenly gonna boost purses and start running races that horseman wanna run in.
It was an absolute joke the last two years there, and even longer than that.
They have a HUGE pool of very expensive an classy horses to draw from down there and refused to utilize it.
Some gamblers may not mind claiming races but guys who drop hundreds of thousands of dollars or millions on horses who don't have spots to run in do mind, they mind a great deal.
For anyone who wants to question the quality of the product down there recently all you have to do is pull the results from last year and check out the nauseating cards on all weekdays and most Sundays.
They packaged a bunch of stakes races on a few days(many at graded stakes level committe minimum purse money for that grade, ahem cough cough) in an attempt to try and fool people into thinkiing it was still a great product. Its not. You need to give horsemen a chance to run allowance runners and maidens in proper spots.
As one guy told me, the racing secretary is not a horse trainer, yet due to the lack of spots available for them to run higher class horses in, hes acting as one by basically giving you no options on where to run your horse.
Oaklawn flourished last year and will flourish again this year. Even though there is no grass course, they card decent races with good purses.
Same with Aqueduct's inner. Big purse money and places to run your horses.
Fair Grounds should have a good base as well.

[Gander]

I know Mike, its just hard to believe Philly Park will ever look nice. Its an absolute eyesoar. Gulfstream was an utter mess last year, save for the a few big Saturdays here and there, mostly in teh beginning of the meet. When does Saratoga start again, LOL!

Originally Posted by Gander

I know Mike, its just hard to believe Philly Park will ever look nice. Its an absolute eyesoar. Gulfstream was an utter mess last year, save for the a few big Saturdays here and there, mostly in teh beginning of the meet. When does Saratoga start again, LOL!

not soon enough!!!

Originally Posted by Gander

I know Mike, its just hard to believe Philly Park will ever look nice. Its an absolute eyesoar. Gulfstream was an utter mess last year, save for the a few big Saturdays here and there, mostly in teh beginning of the meet. When does Saratoga start again, LOL!

Tim the saddest part is that the opening of Gulfstream used to be a real joy and something that was awaited by everyone. Those cards last year were just tragic.
Santa Anita has far away by light years become the place with the highest quality races to watch and bet on in the winter time.
East coast horseman and bettors deserve better quality racing.

[Gander]

I agree. The day after Christmas is now what I look forward to the most in winter racing, not when Gulfstream opens. What use to be one of my favorite meets is now something I could care less about (except for a few Saturdays in the course of 4 months). It started going downhill that year all those horses were breaking down towards the very end of the meet. When they actually had a hole in the track. I think its way too long of a meet. They ought to cut it down to 5 days a week and 3 months max.

Originally Posted by Gander

I agree. The day after Christmas is now what I look forward to the most in winter racing, not when Gulfstream opens. What use to be one of my favorite meets is now something I could care less about (except for a few Saturdays in the course of 4 months). It started going downhill that year all those horses were breaking down towards the very end of the meet. When they actually had a hole in the track. I think its way too long of a meet. They ought to cut it down to 5 days a week and 3 months max.

Santa Anita has become by far the premier winter meet in the USA. They run nice races with nice purses and have some nice stakes races that arent all at the graded stakes commitee's minimum purse requirements, imagine that?
Gulf used to rule the winter months but I now find myself eagerly awaiting Oaklawn's opening day far more than Gulf's.

[bogeydaman]

Originally Posted by oracle80
Misinformation?
You say its headed in the right direction?
I have a few questions for you then.
1) Are the purses there not embarassingly small given the type of horses who winter there(like the ones YOU cited) and the fact that there is a huge horse population to draw from?
2) Are the weekday cards not an absolute disgrace containing nothing but cheap claimers and maiden claimers(as cited by trainers last year including Frankel when they went to management to complain about it)?
3) Was the refurbishment of Gulfstream Park not incredibly stupid and undertaken with no foresight as the mile and an eigth dirt races give an unfair advantage to the inside pp's causing trainers to scratch horses out of these races when drawing the outside?
Was it not also incredibly stupid to refurbish the oval leaving horseman without the possibility of running mile and a sixteenth two turn dirt races, something that Zito, Pletcher, etc complained about citing how vital they are for three year olds starting their tri crown campaigns who are not ready to go a mile and an eighth of the layoff yet need two turn seasoning?


As a South Florida local who goes to GP 10-12x per year for the past 15 years I agree with all of the above statements. I would temper the comments above with the following:

*Outside of a few meets (such as Saratoga) most weekday cards at most tracks are a joke (including Del Mar, Santa Anita, Aqueduct and even the old GP had horrible mid week cards with a minor stake stuck in the middle 1x per mid week).
*I personally am not an owner so I don't care what the purse structure is. I am guessing that whether an allowance race last year was for $33K or $50K I still would have seen Bernadini vs Exclusive Quality (believe this is the Pletcher's horse name) in a NW1 at Gulf last year. I don't care what the purse of the allowance race was. That being said it sure would be nice to see more 3 year old maiden allowance and Nx1 races each day (instead of 3-4every other Saturday) and I believe slots will enable this.
*I believe that if (yes Bush may still try to kill this deal) slots are installed purses will significantly increase (I have heard numbers similar to the posted article on this string). For now we are all just speculating so there is no reason to point fingers until we see what happens.
*I know this string started with Pletcher going west, but there have been plenty of West Coast trainers heading (or remaining) East (more than East Coast trainers heading West) for the GP meet for stall space in advance of the purse hikes (all the more reason that it will happen and be significant). Wesley Ward and Mike Mitchell moving their tacks for the meet and Harty / Frankel staying East despire having the ability to move those horses back west. Granted a lack of claiming horse quality out West is part of the reason as well.

[Independent George]

Originally Posted by Round Pen

What seems to be your problem I guess what I keep reading about you is true that you want to make everyone believe you are all knowing about everything in the business. Needle Point My A$$ I have only been here a couple of weeks I don't need to brag constantly on who I know or who I have talked too.

I have presented you with 2 articles that say slots are going to happen and increase purses at GP. Were the He!! is your facts that say that this is not going to happen. All I See is your opinion. And by trying to Implemement Slots Revolution is right saying GP is trying to go in the right Direction.

Now you've done it, Round Pen. You dare to disagree with the Almighty Oz (he's the Oracle, the Predictor of the Future). If he tells you that Todd Pletcher (I wrote his last name for YOUR sake, since the Oz only needs first names) will have more horses stabled at Aqueduct this winter than Gulfstream, take it to the bank; even though it flies in the face of reality.

And don't fret the "needlepoint" remark. It's a subconscious reference to the time when Todd wouldn't accept the doilies he had knitted for him. He's been bummed ever since.

[Honu]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

When Gulfstream starts, the Santa Anita meet will be going on. Pletcher did not say that he will run horses at Santa Anita. The track is terrible there. It will be interesting to see if he keep the horses out here once Santa Anita starts. The article only said that he will run them at Hollywood this Fall. It didn't say anything about running at Santa anita this winter.

You really think the track is terrible? How about Del Mar and Arlington , have you even been out to see what the track is like now after they revamped it this summer . For the 5 days I was there working horses on it I thought it was a great improvement, it feels softer , yet not "cuppy" and loose it even seems to be a diffirent color which means to me that they have added something to the texture of the surface.
Im all for Polytrack and the surfaces if it makes it kinder on the horses. My biggest comcern with the polytrack and such is that because its kinder that trainers are going to think they can train harder over it, and believe me they will if they think they can, and I just dont get it .

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Honu

You really think the track is terrible? How about Del Mar and Arlington , have you even been out to see what the track is like now after they revamped it this summer . For the 5 days I was there working horses on it I thought it was a great improvement, it feels softer , yet not "cuppy" and loose it even seems to be a diffirent color which means to me that they have added something to the texture of the surface.
Im all for Polytrack and the surfaces if it makes it kinder on the horses. My biggest comcern with the polytrack and such is that because its kinder that trainers are going to think they can train harder over it, and believe me they will if they think they can, and I just dont get it .

I don't know how SA compares to Del Mar or Arlington. I heard the track at Del Mar was really bad this year. I don't know about Arlington. I know there have been a lot of breakdowns there.

One of my trainers thought the track was so bad at Santa Anita just 4 weeks ago, that he sent all of our 2 year olds out to the farm and put them on the aqua-tread for 3 weeks until Hollywood Park re-opened. When Hollywood re-opened and only the training track was opn and not the main track, he moved all his horses to Hollywood. He thought the main track was so bad at Santa Anita that he preferred to train on the training track at Hollywood. He said that he could see a difference in a lot of the horses immediately. He said they travelled much better over the training track at Hollywood than the main track at Santa Anita.

Originally Posted by Independent George

Now you've done it, Round Pen. You dare to disagree with the Almighty Oz (he's the Oracle, the Predictor of the Future). If he tells you that Todd Pletcher (I wrote his last name for YOUR sake, since the Oz only needs first names) will have more horses stabled at Aqueduct this winter than Gulfstream, take it to the bank; even though it flies in the face of reality.

And don't fret the "needlepoint" remark. It's a subconscious reference to the time when Todd wouldn't accept the doilies he had knitted for him. He's been bummed ever since.

Boy George,
Lemme see if I can explain this so as not to offend you and your delicate views.
The arrival of the Gulfstream meet used to be one of the most anticipated happenings in the racing world for trainers, owners, jockeys, and bettors.
The weather was quite pleasant for those who were actually there, and for those who weren't, the racing quality and races for freshly turned 3YO's as well as the grass racing made for a nice change from the last two dreary months of the racing year.
Then things changed. The racing has been destroyed at Gulf, plain and simple. The incredible amount of claiming races, VERY cheap horses and non2 life claimers(which are even worse than the regular ones) have left most gamblers unhappy, and horsemen even unhappier.
This past year Valenzuela, Gomez, and Espinoza were millions and millions ahead of their East counterparts Velazquez, Prado, and Bejarano at March's end. The reason? Very simple, they were competing for purses which dwarfed their Gulf rivals.
When you offer primarily cheap purses and cheap claimers you ruin your whole product. Horses are stabled in South Florida at Gulf, Calder, Palm Beach Downs, Payson Park, Palm Meadows, and quite a few private training farms. The racing secretary has more horses to draw from than any racing secretary in the country at any place at any time of the year. Grass horses abound as do 3YO's looking to break their maidens and advance through allowance conditions.
Thats what makes the situation so inexcusable. Allowance races and Maiden Special Weights are as rare as unicorns and it impacts everyone there. Just this past winter trainers such as Mott and Albertrani were shipping to Tampa Bay with regularity so as to get their horses into a grass MSW race. Think about that!! Trainers with expensive horses willing to ship a great distance of ground and run for tiny purses simply because Gulf left them no options. Jockey agents, jockeys, trainers, and owners take a huge hit in income and revenue because there simply is a lack of purse money. Did Gulf think that there would never be a reaction to this? They do have a powerful Eats Coast winter time monopoly on grass racing and because of the weather, trainers with powerful barns want to be there so training doesn't get interrupted. So what does Gulf do? They take advantage of the monoploly at their expense. Just this past meet a 30 grand allowance race had both Bandini and Wanderin Boy in it!!! The few allowances and miaden races that they do run have small purses and you get the "joy" of catching fields that look like graded stakes races. Perhaps you don't realize this but trainers are trying to make payroll and not all owners are sheikhs who don't care about getting money back on their investments so long as they win.
The graded stakes races are to a large extent a joke. You may not realize this but the graded stakes committee has rules as far as purses go on graded races. 100 grand for grade 3, and 150 grand for grade 2. This doesnt mean that the tracks can't offer more money. And in most cases Gulf certainly chooses not to. This past winter a grade two was run(150 grand purse) which contained: Bushfire(future 3 time grade one winner), Wait A While(future grade one placed and grade one winner), Wonder Lady Anne l(future grade one winner) and Teammate(future twice grade one placed). The purse was a measly 150 grand, geez that just swell. There are also grade 3 grass races with 100 grand purses that contain Breeders Cup type fields. It's deplorable.
Bettors have come to make grass races, allowance races, MSW's and high priced claiming races their bread and butter for gambling. Some players may like cheap claimers but they are definitely outnumbered by those who don't.
Noone wins here, are you getting the point?
Everyone wants Gulf to return to its former glory, myself included. But when I posted this past summer that I had had conversations with a couple of major trainers, owners, and one jockey agent who all said they were considering going west with horses this winter, I wasn't making it up. WHy would I? I certainly didn't speak to Todd about that and found his move shocking at first glance.
But I can tell you to expect at least one major jockey and his agent to announce that they are heading west this year. These guys(owners, tariners, and jocks and their agents) simply cannot afford to give a three month head start to their counterparts and wait for Keeneland to come around in order to run for real purses and have opportunities to race in real races. Just last year Eibar Coa shockingly decided to stay up north at Aqueduct's inner track and he and his agent made a fortune and were near the top of the East coast jocks as far as money won at the end of March. Expect some more guys to stay up here in the winter this year as well and for trainers to keep large strings up at Aqueduct in addition to the the Gulf runners.
What Gulfstream has done is to exploit a monopoly at everyone elses expense. People will only take that so long, at some point they will react with changing venues to a partial or full extent.
When Round Pen countered that things would be different by posting a vague article about 1000 slot machines going in, I scoffed at the notion that there would be an immediate change at Gulfstream in substantial purse raising and quality of races being written. I find it hard to believe that the addition of 1000 machines this winter is going to have a very big impact, or any at all.
Fair Grounds will be open again this year and many guys will head there. Oaklawn's meets just keep getting better and better and California's Santa Anita meet has become the winter jewel by such a large margin over Gulf that its not even comparable.
Its going to take lots more than 1000 slot machines to change this and nowhere have I read(and I asked Round Pen to provide it if he could) any articles or statements by Gulfstream Park or its management that provide a statement that they will be raising purses or the quality of the condition book being written.

[2Hot4TV]

Originally Posted by Dixie Porter

Perhaps one of the geniuses on here can explain to me what exactly is wrong with claiming races. The game was born and bred with them.

Now if you want my opinion on maiden races, they should be run in the mornings before the gates open or at a track where a current meet is not ongoing.

You nuts. Its a big part of the game and the best value for your money. Don't get me wrong I will play cheap claimers when I find a horse that is on the up cycle and not a sore horse.

[Round Pen]

Oracle I have a question for you Seriously now (and you may not be doing this on purpose) but why does it seem every post you make that you are talking down to everyone. No reason to call Independent George, boy George.

Bogeydaman responded to your post with some very good points but yet no response why not.

Obviously he has heard some of the same things I have.

And Surely your smart enough to know that GP could not announce any purse inceases yet. That will have to be decided after slots start and see how much revenue is actually generated.

Have a Nice Day

Originally Posted by Round Pen

Oracle I have a question for you Seriously now (and you may not be doing this on purpose) but why does it seem every post you make that you are talking down to everyone. No reason to call Independent George, boy George.

Bogeydaman responded to your post with some very good points but yet no response why not.

Obviously he has heard some of the same things I have.

And Surely your smart enough to know that GP could not announce any purse inceases yet. That will have to be decided after slots start and see how much revenue is actually generated.

Have a Nice Day

I wouldn't expect anything enormous this year. And what they generally do is announce a percentage increase. This won't help raise the racing quality much since condition books are written well in advance and I don't think bumping the purses on the endless array of claimers and maiden claimers is gonna thrill anyone.
Bottom line is that until they start writing better condition books it doesnt matter.
But yeah, maybe in 2008 or more likely 2009 things will turn around. Won't be this year though.

[Independent George]

Originally Posted by oracle80

Boy George,
Lemme see if I can explain this so as not to offend you and your delicate views.
The arrival of the Gulfstream meet used to be one of the most anticipated happenings in the racing world for trainers, owners, jockeys, and bettors.
The weather was quite pleasant for those who were actually there, and for those who weren't, the racing quality and races for freshly turned 3YO's as well as the grass racing made for a nice change from the last two dreary months of the racing year.
Then things changed. The racing has been destroyed at Gulf, plain and simple. The incredible amount of claiming races, VERY cheap horses and non2 life claimers(which are even worse than the regular ones) have left most gamblers unhappy, and horsemen even unhappier.
This past year Valenzuela, Gomez, and Espinoza were millions and millions ahead of their East counterparts Velazquez, Prado, and Bejarano at March's end. The reason? Very simple, they were competing for purses which dwarfed their Gulf rivals.
When you offer primarily cheap purses and cheap claimers you ruin your whole product. Horses are stabled in South Florida at Gulf, Calder, Palm Beach Downs, Payson Park, Palm Meadows, and quite a few private training farms. The racing secretary has more horses to draw from than any racing secretary in the country at any place at any time of the year. Grass horses abound as do 3YO's looking to break their maidens and advance through allowance conditions.
Thats what makes the situation so inexcusable. Allowance races and Maiden Special Weights are as rare as unicorns and it impacts everyone there. Just this past winter trainers such as Mott and Albertrani were shipping to Tampa Bay with regularity so as to get their horses into a grass MSW race. Think about that!! Trainers with expensive horses willing to ship a great distance of ground and run for tiny purses simply because Gulf left them no options. Jockey agents, jockeys, trainers, and owners take a huge hit in income and revenue because there simply is a lack of purse money. Did Gulf think that there would never be a reaction to this? They do have a powerful Eats Coast winter time monopoly on grass racing and because of the weather, trainers with powerful barns want to be there so training doesn't get interrupted. So what does Gulf do? They take advantage of the monoploly at their expense. Just this past meet a 30 grand allowance race had both Bandini and Wanderin Boy in it!!! The few allowances and miaden races that they do run have small purses and you get the "joy" of catching fields that look like graded stakes races. Perhaps you don't realize this but trainers are trying to make payroll and not all owners are sheikhs who don't care about getting money back on their investments so long as they win.
The graded stakes races are to a large extent a joke. You may not realize this but the graded stakes committee has rules as far as purses go on graded races. 100 grand for grade 3, and 150 grand for grade 2. This doesnt mean that the tracks can't offer more money. And in most cases Gulf certainly chooses not to. This past winter a grade two was run(150 grand purse) which contained: Bushfire(future 3 time grade one winner), Wait A While(future grade one placed and grade one winner), Wonder Lady Anne l(future grade one winner) and Teammate(future twice grade one placed). The purse was a measly 150 grand, geez that just swell. There are also grade 3 grass races with 100 grand purses that contain Breeders Cup type fields. It's deplorable.
Bettors have come to make grass races, allowance races, MSW's and high priced claiming races their bread and butter for gambling. Some players may like cheap claimers but they are definitely outnumbered by those who don't.
Noone wins here, are you getting the point?
Everyone wants Gulf to return to its former glory, myself included. But when I posted this past summer that I had had conversations with a couple of major trainers, owners, and one jockey agent who all said they were considering going west with horses this winter, I wasn't making it up. WHy would I? I certainly didn't speak to Todd about that and found his move shocking at first glance.
But I can tell you to expect at least one major jockey and his agent to announce that they are heading west this year. These guys(owners, tariners, and jocks and their agents) simply cannot afford to give a three month head start to their counterparts and wait for Keeneland to come around in order to run for real purses and have opportunities to race in real races. Just last year Eibar Coa shockingly decided to stay up north at Aqueduct's inner track and he and his agent made a fortune and were near the top of the East coast jocks as far as money won at the end of March. Expect some more guys to stay up here in the winter this year as well and for trainers to keep large strings up at Aqueduct in addition to the the Gulf runners.
What Gulfstream has done is to exploit a monopoly at everyone elses expense. People will only take that so long, at some point they will react with changing venues to a partial or full extent.
When Round Pen countered that things would be different by posting a vague article about 1000 slot machines going in, I scoffed at the notion that there would be an immediate change at Gulfstream in substantial purse raising and quality of races being written. I find it hard to believe that the addition of 1000 machines this winter is going to have a very big impact, or any at all.
Fair Grounds will be open again this year and many guys will head there. Oaklawn's meets just keep getting better and better and California's Santa Anita meet has become the winter jewel by such a large margin over Gulf that its not even comparable.
Its going to take lots more than 1000 slot machines to change this and nowhere have I read(and I asked Round Pen to provide it if he could) any articles or statements by Gulfstream Park or its management that provide a statement that they will be raising purses or the quality of the condition book being written.

I'll take the "Boy George"---kind of a compliment, since I haven't been referred to as a boy for many years.
Whatever, It's a moot point. Everything we all have said is speculation. I believe the same guys with the same kinds of horses and the premier jocks in the East will be at Gulfstream this year.You make this veiled statement about "knowing" that one major jock will move west this year.Anyone can say that and be almost assured of being right.Name the major jockey--put yourself out on that big limb.
You make some legitimate points but then you spoil it all by telling us Fairgrounds will draw "many guys" there. What guys? The usual suspects? I used to like to play Fairgrounds but, talk about a place whose product has deteriorated as far as the betting public is concerned and that's the place. They can't even get full fields for state-bred conditional claimers. Their daily cards two years ago were a disgrace.What trainer that usually goes to Gulfstream is going to go to Fairgrounds this year?
Peace, brother..........we shall see who's right; who's wrong, come January.