The Fierce Urgency of Pork

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Another response that does supports nothing of substance and ignores realities.

military spending creates jobs and helps stimulate the economy. Ask one of your fellow teaschers in the history dept about military spending, the economy and WWII.

But money that goes to education and allows some of us
to teach a class of 15 instead of 35 that is waste. I got it.
Because paying for more teachers does not stimulate job
production. Got that.

And excuse me, but this country saved tons of money during
Bush I, and Clinton with the closing of military bases. In this
city alone 3 very large Air Force bases were closed and we
thought it was the end of the world. It was not. So lets be
careful about the military spending thing. The military folks
that are teachers know this. They experienced it.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

If govt spending were the answer then Cuba and Russia would have model economies

true! i just think folks should look more to their local and state governments-the feds seem to get blamed for everything wrong, and that's not always the correct place to put the blame.

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

If govt spending were the answer then Cuba and Russia would have model economies

Then what is the answer?
Right now given the economic situation you would
scrap the current bill and do nothing... OK.

[Cannon Shell]

After reading a few op-ed pieces in the NY Times I can see why the liberals are so nuts. Wow.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/07/op...erbert.html?em

"The party without a heart"
"...mistake him for a class act"
"...party without a brain"
The obligatory shot at Rush L
"govt spending is needed to replace demand for goods and services"
"alleviate enormous suffering..."
Then the arrogant ending.

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

A proper science lab or a good teacher hire is a local or state issue not a national one.
Building new schools just to build new schools is a waste

Sorry to dissappoint.
It has now become a National issue,
not a local one. Look at state and local governments
balance sheets.

Where have you seen a new school built that is a waste?
All I can speak to is this city, and I have yet to see a new
school built where no kids or teachers show up. And I see
schools occupied that are absolutley falling apart and are
dangerous.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by pgardn

Then what is the answer?
Right now given the economic situation you would
scrap the current bill and do nothing... OK.

Of course not. But seriously this is almost entirely a political laden bill, not real help. We all realize that politics play a role in our life (usually to the detriment) but this simply is a bad bill that originally was much worse.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by pgardn

Sorry to dissappoint.
It has now become a National issue,
not a local one. Look at state and local governments
balance sheets.

Where have you seen a new school built that is a waste?
All I can speak to is this city, and I have yet to see a new school built where no kids or teachers show up. And I see
schools occupied that are absolutley falling apart and are
dangerous.

Like everything else it has become a national issue yet it does not belong there. slippery slope....

You never saw a school built where it wasnt needed
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123396676711659061.html

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by pgardn

It will not be wasted if it goes to "your" congressional
district. If it pays for a proper science lab room in
in "your" school district it will not be wasted. If it hires
a good teacher it will not be wasted. I could go on...

But it "you" do not see the benifits IMMEDIATELY and
DIRECTLY, it is a waste.

lets say hypothetically that none of it was wasted, the point is we're broke, so in effect we're taking this money from future generations of taxpayers to use it now. those future generations are not going to see the benefits are our spending splurge. no, they're going to inherit a mess, and a lower standard of living. we're running this country into the ground by making endless excuses for why we have to borrow and spend.

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Throwing money at education has never worked. And they are throwing about 150 billion at it.

Nah it never worked.
When Sputnik went up, the spending on science
education went up immediately. It directly led
to more engineers,scientists, doctors. We became
the leaders in so many major innovations directly
because of this. From computers, to medicine,
we are/were the best.

No effect whatsoever.

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

lets say hypothetically that none of it was wasted, the point is we're broke, so in effect we're taking this money from future generations of taxpayers to use it now. those future generations are not going to see the benefits are our spending splurge. no, they're going to inherit a mess, and a lower standard of living. we're running this country into the ground by making endless excuses for why we have to borrow and spend.

You may be perfectly correct.
So what would you do?
Right now?
Just sit tight?

Give us a plan.

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Like everything else it has become a national issue yet it does not belong there. slippery slope....

You never saw a school built where it wasnt needed
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123396676711659061.html

Nope I never have.
That is why I said in my experience.
The article illustrates how spending this much money
goes to the wrong places and not the places that need it.
LIke here, where I live. Where a new High School is built every
2 years now and immediately has portable classrooms on it before it opens.

Now would you like me to give you the
article on the B-1 bomber toilet seat cost?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by pgardn

Nah it never worked.
When Sputnik went up, the spending on science
education went up immediately. It directly led
to more engineers,scientists, doctors. We became
the leaders in so many major innovations directly
because of this. From computers, to medicine,
we are/were the best.

No effect whatsoever.

NASA is not education

If you got a 10% raise would you teach better?

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by pgardn

Then what is the answer?
Right now given the economic situation you would
scrap the current bill and do nothing... OK.

hell yes! that is actually a much better solution.

contrary to what Obama says we are not facing catastrophe if we don't pass this bill.

this bill stimulates government spending, thats all. its also a payoff to the causes and groups that supported Obama, unions and such.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by pgardn

Sorry to dissappoint.
It has now become a National issue,
not a local one. Look at state and local governments
balance sheets.

Where have you seen a new school built that is a waste?
All I can speak to is this city, and I have yet to see a new
school built where no kids or teachers show up. And I see
schools occupied that are absolutley falling apart and are
dangerous.

The Milwaukee Public School system, for example, would receive $88.6 million over two years for new construction projects under the House version of the stimulus -- even though the district currently has 15 vacant school buildings and declining enrollment. Between 1990 and 2008, inflation-adjusted MPS spending rose by 35%, per-pupil spending increased by 36% and state aid grew by 58%. Over the same period, enrollment fell by a percentage point and is projected to continue falling, leaving the system with enough excess capacity for some 22,000 students.


And Bingo was name O

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123396676711659061.html

Had to put the quote up for those to lazy to read the link.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

hell yes! that is actually a much better solution.

contrary to what Obama says we are not facing catastrophe if we don't pass this bill.

this bill stimulates government spending, thats all. its also a payoff to the causes and groups that supported Obama, unions and such.

Everybody knows that you have to take care of the maitre d' to get the best table. This is like tipping them $800 billion.

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

NASA is not education

If you got a 10% raise would you teach better?

It did a hell of a lot more than NASA.
That is a very old line. It happened in SCHOOLS.

Hell no.
But take a bunch of that 10% to pay someone capable
to teach that lowers my class sizes in every class I have
and I guarantee you, kids will
learn more.

And it will not be how to write properly or
use of the English language.
God I am awful.

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

hell yes! that is actually a much better solution.

contrary to what Obama says we are not facing catastrophe if we don't pass this bill.

this bill stimulates government spending, thats all. its also a payoff to the causes and groups that supported Obama, unions and such.

So do nothing.
Ok we got your plan.
I think Herby Hoover did the same thing.

You know I am the only one
replying here.

I think all the liberals are lazy and
of course asleep early Sunday morning.

Early here anyway.

[ArlJim78]

Where is Milton when we need him?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWsx1...layer_embedded

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

Where is Milton when we need him?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWsx1...layer_embedded

Milton is dead so he cant apologize.
But Alan Greenspan has.

We must have rules that dont allow Banks
to pull the crap they did. The, "let the
market take care of itself", looks very bad
right now.