|
|
 |
|
|
|
#1
11-11-2009, 12:20 PM
|
||||
|
||||
John Shirreffs
There was a time when John Shirreffs was easily the greatest debut trainer I have ever seen.
It was back when he had the 505 Farm horses ... not only did his first time starters win at unheard of percentages ... but an alarming percentage of them ran gigantic numbers in there debut. 505 is gone .. and Shirreffs is no longer the worlds greatest debut trainer .. in fact, he's not even a good debut trainer anymore. The magic he has now is his ability to get a peak performance from a horse in a race he aims for.   * Giacomo - this was almost everyones Kentucky Derby horse after he ran a strong closing 2nd in the Hollywood Futurity at age 2. He failed result wise in all 3 Derby prep races ... though he was a victim of a very bad trip in the Sham, a speed bias track in the 2nd prep, and highly unfavorable pace and race shape in his final prep. I know a few people here who posted with me back in '05 remember how I married myself to Giacomo to win the Derby even after the SA Derby defeat when mostly all of his giant bandwagon fled. They said I was stubborn, could never admit I'm wrong about anything, and made fun of me about Giacomo. They were right ... but he did win at 50/1. Giacomo had a terrible start coming out of the gate in the Derby .. and I threw up my hands, swore, and that was finally the point I had given up on him.. thinking everything has to go perfect for his bum ass to win. In the Breeders Cup Classic the following year ... Giacomo was a joke going in .. very sharp people thought they were taking advantage of me with Sun King in a head to head against him. He ran outstanding.. but just wasn't quite enough horse to beat an Invasor, Bernardini, or next out Clark winner Premium Tap. * Tiago ... came into the Santa Anita Derby having never crossed the finish line first. VERY slow speed figure horse ... very moderate worktab. Shirreffs couldn't prep him into the Ky Derby because he didn't have the graded earnings. The gloves came off in the Santa Anita Derby and Tiago won at a huge price. I didn't give Tiago a shot in hell that day even though I expected some improvment. Breeders Cup Classic last year ... Tiago is floundering in preps ... but he steps up and he has the best finish of any American horse in the race. * Zenyatta and Life Is Sweet. Life Is Sweet's 3 prior Beyer's going into the Breeders Cup: 93-91-99 ... she crushes the field with a 107. Zenyatta's 3 prior Beyers going into the BC Classic: 97-99-104 ... she fires a 112 in victory. When you really want one big race as an owner ... Shirreffs seems to be lethal. I've always followed him and he's also pretty leathal as a trainer from a betting value standpoint. Since 1996, he's 327 for 1,641 with a jaw dropping $2.04 ROI. I know most people aren't super serious bettors and certainly don't understand that ROI of his enough to appreciate it ... but it's really mind boggling stuff. 
|
|
#2
11-11-2009, 12:41 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Its on this website somewhere, I think I was PG at the time, but I did bet Tiago in the Santa Anita Derby...
I remember liking him almost by default I thought the group was HORRIBLE. Also thought he could improve. Beyer wise he had improved every career race going in. Last edited by Kasept : 11-11-2009 at 02:26 PM.
|
|
#3
11-11-2009, 12:55 PM
|
||||
|
||||
|
I don't know how anyone could have bet Tiago in the SA Derby... I agree it was a bad field ... but he never did anything to suggest he was any good beforehand.
|
|
#5
11-11-2009, 01:08 PM
|
||||
|
||||
|
Man, who knew Shirreffs was such a good trainer at getting them ready for the big race...thanks for letting us know!
__________________
"To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize"...Voltaire
|
|
#6
11-11-2009, 01:18 PM
|
||||
|
||||
|
You didn't.
In fact, you argued that Zenyatta deserves extra credit points because she's trained by an ordinary trainer like Shirreffs while RA is trained by a wizard like Asmussen. I'd take Shirreffs in every single aspect over Asmussen as a trainer. Even ability to move horses up coming from a different barn.
|
|
#7
11-11-2009, 01:48 PM
|
||||
|
||||
|
Quote:
__________________
please use generalizations and non-truths when arguing your side, thank you
|
|
#8
11-11-2009, 02:09 PM
|
||||
|
||||
|
Quote:
|
|
#9
11-11-2009, 07:56 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
Drugs, This is the stuff that LEGENDS are made of. http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11676
|
|
#10
11-11-2009, 08:02 PM
|
||||
|
||||
|
Quote:
I have no idea what in the hell you, Phil, and Hockey saw in Tiago .. but every one of his races seemed terrible to me.
|
|
#11
11-11-2009, 08:03 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
|
|
#12
11-11-2009, 03:54 PM
|
||||
|
||||
|
Quote:
As for the rest of that, everything did go perfect for him, which is why he won.
|
Hybrid Mode
