La Troienne discussion

[Indian Charlie]

The funny thing is Danzig, RA's last race would still probably beat 'Big Z'.

[johnny pinwheel]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

The funny thing is Danzig, RA's last race would still probably beat 'Big Z'.

in what galaxy? peter pan land...she didn't run at arkansas because she was worried about be fair.....yeah, ok...i'd be waiting for the retirement announcement.

[Indian Charlie]

This galaxy.

[philcski]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

This galaxy.

She ran a -1 1/4 and a -1 3/4 on TG's last two. That's pretty strong, even though she was 5w2w and 4w3w it still seems a bit aggressive to me, even though it fits with the rest of the card- it gives the winner a 3 point new top.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

The funny thing is Danzig, RA's last race would still probably beat 'Big Z'.

I'm glad to see you are coming around, there once was a day you would have said "woulda".

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by CSC

I'm glad to see you are coming around, there once was a day you would have said "woulda".

I wish I woulda figured out what you mean by that!

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Duvalier

Chuck...what would be the reason a trainer would make a change to a figure 8? What is it supposed to accomplish?

Generally a figure 8 is used for a horse that flips its palate. As Outofthebox said he uses it on a lot of horses and in attempting to get her rate perhaps he was worried about holding her hard and her flipping her palate? That is just speculation, I have no inside knowledge of why he made the change. But in my experience I can't ever remember a horse running worse because they wore a figure 8 though it has helped some run better. A tongue tie is the most signifigant equip change that isnt reported. Nosebands, fig8's, shadow rolls,drop nosebands, etc can all be helpful to a degree but arent that signifigant. Now the type of bit in the horses mouth can be a big positive or negative but is too broad of a subject to accurately discuss here. While I understand people wondering if it has made a difference in her performance, I have a hardtime making the connection.

[Duvalier]

Thanks

[prudery]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Generally a figure 8 is used for a horse that flips its palate. As Outofthebox said he uses it on a lot of horses and in attempting to get her rate perhaps he was worried about holding her hard and her flipping her palate? That is just speculation, I have no inside knowledge of why he made the change. But in my experience I can't ever remember a horse running worse because they wore a figure 8 though it has helped some run better. A tongue tie is the most signifigant equip change that isnt reported. Nosebands, fig8's, shadow rolls,drop nosebands, etc can all be helpful to a degree but arent that signifigant. Now the type of bit in the horses mouth can be a big positive or negative but is too broad of a subject to accurately discuss here. While I understand people wondering if it has made a difference in her performance, I have a hardtime making the connection.

In other equine disciplines, the figure eight is used to keep a horse " on the bit ", that is to aid in the mouth closing so the bit may be retained in the proper position for control and to prevent the horse from " blowing " through it .

Figure eights are usually hunter/jumper nosebands .

The flash noseband seems to have superceded the dropped noseband for general purposes and especially in dressage, where the figure eight is not legal to show in ..

They both serve the same purpose as the figure eight .

The only conceivable difference it could make in her performance is to give the rider a better more effective contact with the mouth and a little more control --it certainly would not move her up or down length wise, though I have heard from a few self-proclaimed experts that the figure eight helps the horse breathe better and opens the nostrils !!!

I have however, seen Rachel go in a ring bit with and without the figure eight, and that is a strong bit .

I have also seen her with Borel up in a plain loose ring or eggbutt snaffle and no noseband at all from last year .

I would think that a ring bit and a figure eight combined would be a lot of brake, but I have seen that combo at the track, and I believe Rachel wore that at least once this year racing.

I also have a hard time believing this change of equipment could negatively impact her racing, but I have seen some of her workouts from this year and most notably from last year before the Oaks when she ran off with her rider, mouth wide open ,evading the bit and very rank .

Perhaps this would suggest why the figure eight was added .